New Custom Cluster - Vag Tacho Access Denied

s1iver · Nov 3, 2009

Hey Guys,

I've put togeather a nice little guage cluster for myself:

Before

I took it from a 2008 City Golf, and swapped the tach/speedo with the cluster from a Passat, everything lines up and looks great when plugged in.

But... Vag Tacho cannot pull the SKC from it..

Does any of the cluster guru's have any time to try and help me?

This would be going into my IMMO2 2000 GTI

Steve99 · Nov 3, 2009

Which version of VagTacho do you have and where are you located?

s1iver · Nov 3, 2009

2.2, out in winnipeg

Steve99 · Nov 3, 2009

The cluster is VDO correct?
I would think you just need a newer version of VagTacho. I have version 2.5 which worked on a 2007 CityGolf(with basic cluster) and a 2004 R32 MFA cluster.

Does your software have a "VDO new" option for cluster type? That will be the selection you need with VagTacho.

s1iver · Nov 3, 2009

yes i do, VDO New is what i've been trying.

I've read that it could take a few tries to calculate the new code, but i tried about 35 times connect ecu - disconnect and so on..

Where do i get the latest copy of vagtacho?

Steve99 · Nov 3, 2009

The readme for VagTacho does say it can take multiple tries for the login but I have rarely ever had it need more then one try with 2.5. Its easy to get the version 2.5 software but be careful with it. I assume you have a chinese clone of the real cable, running a newer version of software with a cloned cable will often kill the cable. There are generally programming changes in the microcontroller thats in the cable itself with newer versions.
I have no first hand experience trying software 2.5 with a 2.2 cable though, it may work fine, it may kill the cable.

s1iver · Nov 3, 2009

well, the crappy chinese cable does say it was compatible with 2.5.

I just can't find a reliable copy of 2.5

Steve99 · Nov 3, 2009

Check your PM, I sent you a link.

s1iver · Nov 3, 2009

Thanks alot!

s1iver · Nov 5, 2009

Still having problems with 2.5, if i try a few times it then reboots the cluster a bunch of times trying to calculate the seed key.

seed-key mode: 01.

Let it do that for half an hour constantly rebooting the dash... and just quits saying access denied.

sigh

Steve99 · Nov 5, 2009

Thats a shame, The 2008 City Golf must use a newer cluster type or software version that Vag Tacho 2.5 doesn't support. It may be possible to do it manually by removing the eeprom soldered onto the cluster PCB and reading/editing.

s1iver · Nov 5, 2009

I've looked at doing it, it wouldnt be the first time, I had to do this same thing with my RNS, there was no pin, and the pin the dealer provided didn't work.

Lets hope i dont have to de-solder the chip and can just hook up the leads to power the chip itself.

onehotspud · Nov 5, 2009

Look around on the outside black cluster housing. Does it actually say "VDO" anywhere on it? On a label, molded in with the plastic...

s1iver · Nov 5, 2009

yes it does

onehotspud · Nov 5, 2009

Well, I got nuthin' then.

s1iver · Nov 9, 2009

onehotspud said:
Well, I got nuthin' then.

Thanks anyways!!

s1iver · May 27, 2010

Just bump this back up, the GTI will be back on the road and still want to get this cluster working.

Any insight?

Steve99 · May 27, 2010

The other thing I can suggest is a newer version of VagTacho. Along with the software you will need newer hardware as well.
I would try my VagTacho 2.5 with a 2008/2009 City Golf if I had access to one.

OmegaRenegade · May 30, 2010

i've found that the newer clusters from 2006+ only like communicating with Vag-Commander. The Tacho works on everything before that.

Steve99 · May 30, 2010

Newer clusters are canbus and the clone VagTacho 2.5 is K-line communication only. Now it seems this should work with the 2008 City Golf as its still a mark IV car but perhaps they did include a canbus only cluster.
If you have VCDS fire it up and select function 17, see if inits canbus to communicate.

Its also possible the 2008 is still K-line but uses a newer security login protocol.

s1iver · May 31, 2010

Steve99 said:
Newer clusters are canbus and the clone VagTacho 2.5 is K-line communication only. Now it seems this should work with the 2008 City Golf as its still a mark IV car but perhaps they did include a canbus only cluster.
If you have VCDS fire it up and select function 17, see if inits canbus to communicate.

Its also possible the 2008 is still K-line but uses a newer security login protocol.

Have you ever done a dump of a cluster to find out the PIN?

Steve99 · May 31, 2010

Generally VagTacho will give you the pin automagically. If you do have an eeprom dump of a cluster the PIN can generally be found in it.

Demon Diesel · Jun 1, 2010

Steve99 said:
Generally VagTacho will give you the pin automagically. If you do have an eeprom dump of a cluster the PIN can generally be found in it.

Does VagTacho work with IMMO 3? I have a 2002 Jetta and wondering if a 4 digit PIN still exists? I thought IMMO 3 had to use the 7 digit SKC which is no longer availiable from the dealer. If so, can i not use VDS Pro and do a memory read at a specific address?

graeme86 · Jun 1, 2010

Yes. It extracts a 4 digit PIN.
4 digit pin works okay. The seven digit SKC converts to a four digit pin anyway. VAGCOM will accept the four digit pin directly (plus adding 0 in front).

Demon Diesel · Jun 2, 2010

Ok so that sounds a lot better. Even IMMO 3 still runs on 4 digit PIN and the 7 digit was just another layer they added. Does anyone know if i can just use my VDS Pro to read specific memory locations to ge the 4 digit PIN? I just ordered a VAGTacho V3.01 but wouldn't mind trying it with my VDS-Pro.

Also, whenever you change any values, do you have to recalculate the checksum? Lets say i changed my odometer or enabled the lights for the needles. Assuming i used something like VDS-Pro, would i have to change some sort of checksum? What are the risks with changing options ("bricked cluster")?

s1iver · Aug 28, 2011

Just a little update guys, i've got a friend that will be getting VAGTacho 3.01 and we'll try that and see if it can get into the cluster.

This is an OEM cluster with 5k mms on it and it has Miles/Kilometers to empty enabled as well as a L/Hr section on the half mfa.

If i can get a dump for it i'll get it to you guys to dissect

graeme86 · Aug 30, 2011

My IMMO 3 euro cluster has l/hr as well.

Only when you are not actually moving though - then it reverts to l/100km again.

s1iver · Aug 30, 2011

this one has both sections, they're separate.

I wish i knew how to dump the eeprom without vagtacho, anybody know the pins where i could solder a reader to?

graeme86 · Aug 30, 2011

Now that IS interesting!

Just to clarify - I have "overall l/100km" consumption readout.

Then there is also an instantaneous fuel consumption readout which is l/100km when you are moving and then to becomes l/hr if you are idling.

There should be a 93C86 chip on the board somewhere - that's the one with the EEPROM information.

s1iver · Aug 30, 2011

All separate, mind you i haven't started driving with the cluster as the immobilizer is enabled.

But when i scroll through all the different options i have obviously 2 sections (1st is for that trip, 2nd is overall) works just like my immo2 cluster.

I have instant fuel consumption, overall, l/hr, kilometeres/miles to empty, there has to be some other funky stuff in there. I'm going to see if i can find some contact points on the board to make reading the 93c86 easier (did this already with my navi once)

New Custom Cluster - Vag Tacho Access Denied

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