Brm White smoke at operating temp.

fwthompson

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Location
CDA
TDI
06 jetta tdi brm 5 spd 220k (sold) , 05.5 jetta tdi brm dsg 134k (SOLD), 06 Jetta TDI BRM dsg mkv white. 224k. 2011 jetta cja dsg Silver. 155k
So i have been looking thru hundreds of threads the last week and have found nothing exactly like my problem. I hate to make another smoke thread but this one has me a bit confused. So i bought a 2005.5 jetta brm dsg that had a run away. I personally rebuilt the motor after my machinest did the machining. All the parts came from bora and id parts. We put new 150 pistons in and arp studs, colt cam kit, dsg flywheel, new bv39 turbo you know did it up real good, and waiting on pd 150 injectors.
The car ran great but had low mpg and a bit of oil consumption but i thought nothing of it because it was yet to be broken in. All the break in miles went good, but continues to eat oil at a rate of 1 qt for 1100 miles ish.... now heres where it get weird. It has a great start and shut down and all the power it should but if i run it hard and warm it up good it begins to smoke white clouds like something out of a James Bond Film. Also if i take it easy for 600 miles or more it will start smoking too.
I have ran vag com and the timing is spot on at -.5, deviation looks questonable tho at
#1 .28
#2 -1.2
#3 .32
#4 .67
All stock tune and egr delete and as far as i can see nothing else questionable as far as vag is concerned. Also there is no coolent loss and turbo play feels fine. On the second oil change from break in i did find metal particles in the oil that glittered gold in color finer then the filter could catch, and quite a large amount. Engine compression is 420 accross the board when hot and all the glow system is in order. I did pull the cam back apart and looks great for 6k it has on it. Im hoping the injectors will solve this but if they dont what would all this point to next? Thanks for all your help on here guys, this site has been great for guidance on these cars.
 
Last edited:

fwthompson

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Location
CDA
TDI
06 jetta tdi brm 5 spd 220k (sold) , 05.5 jetta tdi brm dsg 134k (SOLD), 06 Jetta TDI BRM dsg mkv white. 224k. 2011 jetta cja dsg Silver. 155k
Quick update.
I have installed the pd150 injectors and it has cured about a third of the smoke issue. One weird thing tho is my deviation is still near what it was befor the injector swap. That has me a bit worried. But boy are those injectors great. The car still smokes a bit if i get it up past operating temp by hard runs. I did notice a bit of aluminum particles in the oil since my last change about 100 miles ago and they seem to be seeping from the oil return from the tandum pump into the head as far as i can tell. I have a new one coming from bora and we will see what happens next. Some input on this would be great..
 

fwthompson

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Location
CDA
TDI
06 jetta tdi brm 5 spd 220k (sold) , 05.5 jetta tdi brm dsg 134k (SOLD), 06 Jetta TDI BRM dsg mkv white. 224k. 2011 jetta cja dsg Silver. 155k
One thing i forgot to mention about the injector bores, there was some wear spots from the injectors vibrating or something. I tried to clean the bores with fine sand paper, then cleaned up good, but didnt remove all the groves. So i got the new tandum pump installed and still have the smoke at hot temps issue. Took the old pump apart and there was alot of wear insite the vac pump part, contaminated the oil slightly with aluminum powder. Still cannot find the source of the gold particles tho. The car runs great and gets 57 mpg when cruising according to mfd. The injector deviation is still close to the same as before tho. All the numbers add up to 0 also so im stumpped.
 

fwthompson

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Location
CDA
TDI
06 jetta tdi brm 5 spd 220k (sold) , 05.5 jetta tdi brm dsg 134k (SOLD), 06 Jetta TDI BRM dsg mkv white. 224k. 2011 jetta cja dsg Silver. 155k
No solution yet for this problem. I will continue to drive it until the problem gets worse i guess.
 

fwthompson

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Location
CDA
TDI
06 jetta tdi brm 5 spd 220k (sold) , 05.5 jetta tdi brm dsg 134k (SOLD), 06 Jetta TDI BRM dsg mkv white. 224k. 2011 jetta cja dsg Silver. 155k
Yes. On my other car they are similar to yours as well. I read somewhere that if all the deviation numbers add up to 0 then theres no problem. Mine are high but do add to zero. The car runs fantastic otherwise as well.
 

fingeradrenaline

Active member
Joined
May 7, 2007
Location
Mechanicsburg, PA
TDI
None
Hey fwthompson,

Did you ever come up with a resolution for the smoking? I'm having similar symptoms with a similar engine background, but most smoke threads are for a blown turbo.

Thanks!
 

fwthompson

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Location
CDA
TDI
06 jetta tdi brm 5 spd 220k (sold) , 05.5 jetta tdi brm dsg 134k (SOLD), 06 Jetta TDI BRM dsg mkv white. 224k. 2011 jetta cja dsg Silver. 155k
I have yet to solve this problem. However after the injector change out, the smoke did decrease. I found a small amount of wear in the bore holes and i suspect theres injector leak. The MPG is so good that i cannot justify tearing it apart, so i think i will drive it till it shows its head.
 

fwthompson

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Location
CDA
TDI
06 jetta tdi brm 5 spd 220k (sold) , 05.5 jetta tdi brm dsg 134k (SOLD), 06 Jetta TDI BRM dsg mkv white. 224k. 2011 jetta cja dsg Silver. 155k
Quick update,
The car has 13,000 miles on the new motor now and still runs good. It has alot of smoke on start up in cold weather until it gets to operating temp. Get very strong Mpg, 55-60 on the freeway. I still suspect theres a injector leak due to injector bore wear i found when installing the pd150s. Its my 3rd car so i can afford to let it go without tearing into it further. The motor has 127k original miles before rebuld. This problem of smoke only comes with dramatic temp. Like hot summer days or real cold start ups. At reg temps its fine tho. Thanks for all the support on this site..
 

fwthompson

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Location
CDA
TDI
06 jetta tdi brm 5 spd 220k (sold) , 05.5 jetta tdi brm dsg 134k (SOLD), 06 Jetta TDI BRM dsg mkv white. 224k. 2011 jetta cja dsg Silver. 155k
Another update on this car. The problems have gotten alot worse and recently i have started to have alot of coolent loss, the Provent has kept the coolent out of my oil and kept it from contaminating too badly.
I tore it down thinking it was a head gasket issue but upon reinstallation i still have coolent migration into the oil somehow. I have eliminated all other leaking potentials and still have the issue. So todayi pull the head off to find my worse fear and most likely cause.
Three of the head stud holes in the block have cracks and the worse one is right by the oil gravity return. So time to replace the block i guess. I still cant figure out why i had the smoke issue or rough idle. Im going to start with a different block. Thanks for all the input EVERYONE. And a BIG shout out To FRANK06 for all the good advice and predictions.
 

bobthefarmer

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Location
Indianapolis
TDI
2006.5 Jetta Mk 5 192K miles; 2012 Car of the Year, Passat Tdi SE+Nav in blue nightgown, shod in 18 inch heels
Do you have a cracked block? I'm thinking that you are passing fluid into the cylinder, but that would not show when cold. Seems like an awful problem to have after a nice rebuild. Is your coolant getting polluted?
 

fwthompson

Well-known member
Joined
Feb 24, 2013
Location
CDA
TDI
06 jetta tdi brm 5 spd 220k (sold) , 05.5 jetta tdi brm dsg 134k (SOLD), 06 Jetta TDI BRM dsg mkv white. 224k. 2011 jetta cja dsg Silver. 155k
Yes the block is cracked at the head bolt hole in center front hole. Near gravity oil return cavity. The coolent is contaminating the oil only because the crack is near the gravity return. Im woundering if the arp studs were a bad idea after all. Maybe a small amount of fluid was passed in the beginning into a cylinder to make the original smoke problem.
 
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