Clean Diesel DPF Data Collection Thread

HeAvYfUeL · Jan 26, 2012

Plus 3 Golfer said:
Interesting. Here's a link to the directions. Almost a DIY. I wonder what the price of the fluids and machine are.

Total price:
The Chemicals: http://www.goedkoopvoorauto.nl/products/Roetfilter-Reiniger-Set.html
And the tools: http://www.goedkoopvoorauto.nl/products/TORALIN-Professionele-Roetfilter-Reiniger-Apparaat.html
Approx 50 Euro for the chemicals and 200 Euro for the tools.
Total price 330 US $.
And the video instructions: http://youtu.be/YoCiEHFiSB8

lsnover · Jan 26, 2012

HeAvYfUeL said:
Total price:
The Chemicals: http://www.goedkoopvoorauto.nl/products/Roetfilter-Reiniger-Set.html
And the tools: http://www.goedkoopvoorauto.nl/products/TORALIN-Professionele-Roetfilter-Reiniger-Apparaat.html
Approx 50 Euro for the chemicals and 200 Euro for the tools.
Total price 330 US $.
And the video instructions: http://youtu.be/YoCiEHFiSB8

Well, if it works, would make a good part time business.

Tarbe · Jan 28, 2012

MemberName: Tarbe
Model Year: 2009
Model: Jetta Sportwagen
Tranny: 6M
Miles: 120,000
Oil Ash Volume: 108ml
Oil Type: Mobil 1 ESP FM 5W-40
Avrg. MPG: 45.6
Comments: On the Mobil oil since 40k miles. 0.9ml per 1,000 miles

attyjeff · Jan 30, 2012

I'm about to hit 120,000 but I dont have a way to check.

740GLE · Jan 30, 2012

that little pump cleaner thing looks cool, but isn't it a pain in the but to get to the bungs for the sensors, and aren't they some special thread pitch? I think it'd take some modifications to get it to work.

Tarbe · Jan 30, 2012

attyjeff said:
I'm about to hit 120,000 but I dont have a way to check.

When you have your timing belt done (it is due at 120k) have whoever is doing the work use the VCDS to check it.

Tim

lsnover · Jan 31, 2012

attyjeff said:
I'm about to hit 120,000 but I dont have a way to check.

FYI, I was at the dealer and asked them to check on "what is full" related to ash load.

My rep. supposedly got in touch with a VW Tech. and was told that "under ideal circumstances it should last indefinitely, more miles then you would put on most any car." I asked if they had a number for "full" and he said no, they have no specification for a "full" DPF. It is consider "full" when the Computer tells you it is, based on differential pressure, and after manual regeneration fails.

He said cars driven short distances exclusively are the only ones they've seen outright fail and have had to replace.

This dealer also told me they've done maybe 4 HPFP repairs, and 2 they know were from gas being put in the tank. He said they "sell a lot of TDIs", and they really have not seen many of these pump issues. FWIW, could be bull, could be the deal.

darrelld · Feb 1, 2012

2012 Golf TDI
Mileage: 1100

Found the DPF values with the help of new map file from Ross-Tech.

MacBuckeye · Feb 5, 2012

Haven't had a chance to get under the car and look at the DPF, but where does that cleaner attach? Isn't the DPF a sealed unit? I watched the video. They used two types of fluid to clean the DPF out? Couldn't tell for sure, but was the car in the video a VW? We could be "worried" about our DPF clogging up, but perhaps it (DPF) is going to out-live the car. One could only hope!

I updated the spreadsheet this morning with the recent posts. Thanks for keeping the data coming...

lsnover · Feb 5, 2012

MacBuckeye said:
Haven't had a chance to get under the car and look at the DPF, but where does that cleaner attach? Isn't the DPF a sealed unit? I watched the video. They used two types of fluid to clean the DPF out? Couldn't tell for sure, but was the car in the video a VW? We could be "worried" about our DPF clogging up, but perhaps it (DPF) is going to out-live the car. One could only hope!

I updated the spreadsheet this morning with the recent posts. Thanks for keeping the data coming...

It looks like it hooks up in place of the various screw in sensors and such.

HeAvYfUeL · Feb 6, 2012

Most probably the oxygen sensor on top of the DPF.
The first product is the cleaning agent.
The second product is the flush agent.

SkiTraveler · Feb 20, 2012

Ok, looks like I'll be purchasing VCDS. I'm approaching 90,000 miles and had the check engine light go on. Dealer retrieved faults: "Particulate Trap Efficiency below Threshold." Dealer provide price quote of $3,900 to replace. The check engine light is off for now, but I've only driven 150 miles.

So what is next? Will my Check Engine Light go on again? If I keep driving will it turn red? It sounds like a "manual or forced regen" is necessary and VCDS can handle that forced operation.

I'm driving two 45 mile trips per day. How many miles do I have before I'm forced to deal with this DPF and what am I really looking at in the way of repair costs?

I'll contribute my DPF data as soon as it can be obtained.

What is HPFD? Thank you to all the bloggers that provide clear and concise input. It is greatly appreciated!

JSWTDI09 · Feb 20, 2012

SkiTraveler said:
What is HPFD? Thank you to all the bloggers that provide clear and concise input. It is greatly appreciated!

You probably mean HPFP which is High Pressure Fuel Pump. A small percentage of these parts have failed. The biggest problem is that when they fail, they spread metal shavings throughout the entire fuel system. This means replacing everything from fuel tank to injectors (and everything in between).

Have Fun!

Don

DanG144 · Feb 21, 2012

Don't always take code messages at face value.
Since there is no opacity meter, the message may have been triggered by a momentary reported high differential pressure (dp). Maybe the dp is truly running high because of a clogged trap, and maybe not. It could be a sensor problem, such as the inlet sensor reading a bit high and or the outlet sensor reading a bit low.

A forced regen does nothing more than a regular regen, as far as I know.

Your move to get VCDS and get more data, get more control over the situation, is I think, the right one.

Look for a PM in case you need some help getting started with VCDS.

lsnover · Feb 21, 2012

SkiTraveler said:
Ok, looks like I'll be purchasing VCDS. I'm approaching 90,000 miles and had the check engine light go on. Dealer retrieved faults: "Particulate Trap Efficiency below Threshold." Dealer provide price quote of $3,900 to replace. The check engine light is off for now, but I've only driven 150 miles.

So what is next? Will my Check Engine Light go on again? If I keep driving will it turn red? It sounds like a "manual or forced regen" is necessary and VCDS can handle that forced operation.

I'm driving two 45 mile trips per day. How many miles do I have before I'm forced to deal with this DPF and what am I really looking at in the way of repair costs?

I'll contribute my DPF data as soon as it can be obtained.

What is HPFD? Thank you to all the bloggers that provide clear and concise input. It is greatly appreciated!

What year is your Diesel? If it's an 2009 and the dealer hasn't replaced many/any of these before, be sure to tell them to check the parts prices for 2010 (if it's a Jetta). The part prices are quite a bit lower. My dealer quoted me 2K to replace the DPF on my 2009 Sedan. Just FYI.

Elfnmagik · Feb 21, 2012

His member stats reflect he has an '09.

andy7079 · Feb 21, 2012

Got my Vag-Com last night.

MemberName: andy7079
Model Year: 2010
Model: Jetta Sedan
Tranny: DSG
Miles: 27311
Oil Ash Volume: 18mL
Oil Type: (ex. Castrol LL03, Mobile 1 ESP, etc.) Castrol LL03
Avrg. MPG: 38mpg
Comments: None.

SkiTraveler · Feb 21, 2012

Risk ~ Financial Bomb

JSWTDI09 said:
You probably mean HPFP which is High Pressure Fuel Pump. A small percentage of these parts have failed. The biggest problem is that when they fail, they spread metal shavings throughout the entire fuel system. This means replacing everything from fuel tank to injectors (and everything in between).

Have Fun!

Don

Yes, HPFP (High Pressure Fuel Pump)! I'm replacing the fuel filter twice as often as scheduled. I think every 20,000 miles.

Ok, I love driving this car, but between the DPF and the HPFP risk, there is considerable real financial exposure to driving this car. I woke up this morning thinking maybe I should dump it. I've had no problem up until the recent check engine light at 88K.

I'm reading no real minimal easy fix when the DPF goes. I haven't research the HPFP. My guess is $5K to fix that catastrophic chain reaction. Add the two together and you have a $9K repair bill for a 3-year old vehicle.. That is unacceptable and should be considered a fatal flaw with the TDI! Also, locating a trustworthy TDI mechanic is questionable.

JSWTDI09 · Feb 21, 2012

SkiTraveler said:
Also, locating a trustworthy TDI mechanic is questionable.

If you are up for a little drive, there is an excellent TDI mechanic in the Denver area. Try Anuthee (Anut) here: http://www.dieselland.net/

For other good TDI mechanics, check out the trusted mechanics list here:
https://docs.google.com/document/preview?id=1Lucw8ALCkLtt79MMw9JOG1E_dX57-raBhbhIFdtHnEQ&pli=1

Have Fun!

Don

Plus 3 Golfer · Feb 21, 2012

SkiTraveler said:
Yes, HPFP (High Pressure Fuel Pump)! I'm replacing the fuel filter twice as often as scheduled. I think every 20,000 miles.

Ok, I love driving this car, but between the DPF and the HPFP risk, there is considerable real financial exposure to driving this car. I woke up this morning thinking maybe I should dump it. I've had no problem up until the recent check engine light at 88K.

I'm reading no real minimal easy fix when the DPF goes. I haven't research the HPFP. My guess is $5K to fix that catastrophic chain reaction. Add the two together and you have a $9K repair bill for a 3-year old vehicle.. That is unacceptable and should be considered a fatal flaw with the TDI! Also, locating a trustworthy TDI mechanic is questionable.

Here's parts you need to fix HPFP failure. MSRP parts costs are about $5.2k add labor, misc. charges (like fuel disposal) and you are at around $8k at dealer.

SkiTraveler · Feb 21, 2012

Plus 3 Golfer said:
Here's parts you need to fix HPFP failure. MSRP parts costs are about $5.2k add labor, misc. charges (like fuel disposal) and you are at around $8k at dealer.

Wow, 8K really? What's the likelihood of catastrophic HPFP failure?

SkiTraveler · Feb 21, 2012

JSWTDI09 said:
If you are up for a little drive, there is an excellent TDI mechanic in the Denver area. Try Anuthee (Anut) here: http://www.dieselland.net/

For other good TDI mechanics, check out the trusted mechanics list here:
https://docs.google.com/document/preview?id=1Lucw8ALCkLtt79MMw9JOG1E_dX57-raBhbhIFdtHnEQ&pli=1

Have Fun!

Don

Diesel Land: Great lead! I pass by there all the time! Thank you!

Jack Frost · Feb 21, 2012

DanG144 said:
A forced regen does nothing more than a regular regen, as far as I know.

There is one important difference. With a forced regen, one can start driving the car in the best way to burn off the DPF's soot and ensure that it is completed properly. Most other regens are unplanned and not necessarily completed. Those that drive short trips all the time in the city fall into this category.

If a forced regen does not fix the problem, there is not much to hope for except replacing the DPF.

chowster1 · Mar 2, 2012

I just had my DPF replaced at 37,271k. I drive 40k in the city/highway each day, not much short runs. The EGR valve/filter was replaced 3 months agao...could this have affected or clogged the DPF. Will I need to be concerned about the cat. converter?

ziggy55 · Mar 2, 2012

Instead of replacing the DPF on an outta warranty car, does anyone know if the DPF cleaning services will work on our DPFs?

Jack Frost · Mar 2, 2012

chowster1 said:
...could this have affected or clogged the DPF. Will I need to be concerned about the cat. converter?

I am not a mechanic but from what I know, I don't think so. All the EGR valve does is divert exhaust gases to the back in front of the intake valves. For load load and low rpm, some of the exhaust gases will be diverted to the turbocharger. In either case, I can't imagine how any misfunction of the EGR valve can affect the DPF.

The only two reasons I can think that a DPF has to be replaced is because of ash build up or physical damage. The former could be the because of the engine burning oil. Not much is known about the affects of additives or biofuel on DPFs but I am sure they don't help. Perhaps having excessive soot produced by your engine could hasten the demise of a DPF, but I am speculating htere. Physical damage could be from a manufacturing defect, a mechanical shock, or perhaps too much heat.

lsnover · Mar 2, 2012

chowster1 said:
I just had my DPF replaced at 37,271k. I drive 40k in the city/highway each day, not much short runs. The EGR valve/filter was replaced 3 months agao...could this have affected or clogged the DPF. Will I need to be concerned about the cat. converter?

Wow, that's pretty low mileage considering your not primarily in the city. Do you know what the Ash load figure was when they pulled it? Would you mind sharing what they charged you, or was it covered under warranty?

lsnover · Mar 2, 2012

ziggy55 said:
Instead of replacing the DPF on an outta warranty car, does anyone know if the DPF cleaning services will work on our DPFs?

From talking to my dealer, they have not had to deal with this on many cars. My dealer actually said they have done NONE thus far. So whether the cleaning kits might work or not is an open question. Someone will have to roll the dice. ;-)

whitedog · Mar 2, 2012

I wonder if anyone has any facts on what they do with the old DPF if they replace one. Do they put it in the scarp pile or does it get special treatment and is sent someplace special for recovery of anything valuable.

If it's the scrap pile, who wants to acquire one to try cleaning?

Jack Frost · Mar 2, 2012

The DPF has a lot of paladium as the catalyst involved with oxidizing post injected fuel. I am sure the DPF has value even when it is full of ash. I saw a thread on this forum of a DPF that was full of ash. It is hopeless to think that one cold blow any of it out. They just were not designed for that.

Clean Diesel DPF Data Collection Thread

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