BHW/01E 6 Speed Swap

Uberhare

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2006
Location
Ontario, Canada
TDI
Too many.
Sweet. Did you get the longer dowel pins? That is what held me up. There are a few bolts of different lengths required too. I managed to find some used ones around so I didn't note all the length.

2.5 TDI? Which ratios?
 

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
It's an FRF - same ratios as the DQS, just a later version.

Ratio: Final drive 31 : 08 = 3,875
Z2:Z1 1st gear 28 : 8 = 3,500
2nd gear 34 : 18 = 1,889
3nd gear 32 : 26 = 1,231
4th gear 27 : 31 = 0,871
5th gear 26 : 39 = 0,667
6th gear 23 : 41 = 0,561
Reverse gear 38 : 11 = 3,455

Going to get the dowels this week - did you get them from a Ford dealer or VW?

Also working on the auto-delete tune with Malone.
 

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
First snag - wrong starter :(

It's a snub nose version, but there's a dowel on the face of it that prevents it from fully seating, and the wattage is low. I looked up the part # and it's for a 1.8t - shame, because it look really new. :D
 

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
Update:

So, like the Greeks, I have burned my boats - no turning back.

In other words, I yanked the auto last night and promptly sold it moments after it hit the floor. It was a challenging decision to make given that my auto was working fine before removal.

But then again, I can never leave well enough alone when it comes to the pursuit of 6-speed Passats... :D

Anyhoo, as expected my rear main is leaking, and there is a decent trail of oil coming down from the tandem pump, so I'll likely replace that at the same time, along with the coolant housing at the back of the head.



Once the transmission was out, I took some time to take measurements.

The depth of this chamfer in the crank snout - 4mm



The distance from the face of the crank snout to the block/pan mating surface - 23mm

Depth of the input shaft from the transmission bellhousing (note, this is the distance to the end of the chamfer on the nose of the input shaft which is about 1mm past the nose of the shaft) - 10mm:



Width of the spacer needed for the stock clutch - 5.5mm

Total depth to the input shaft seen here - 15.5mm:



By my calculations, if you install the stock pilot bearing to the depth of the chamfer, you will get 3.5mm of support on the surface of the input shaft (23mm -4mm -10mm - 5.5mm = 3.5mm)

So, what to do? I did some searching, and the stock input shaft bearing is 15mm wide x 15mm id x 21mm od. After looking around, I found a company in the UK called simplybearings, and they make a 15x21x20mm bushing that fits in the crank nicely and sticks out 1mm from the face of the crank snout rather than being 4mm recessed to the depth of the chamfer:



Which will give 8.5 mm of support on the input shaft instead of 3.5mm. I'm comfy with the bronze oillite bushing instead of the bearing - many a vehicle I have changed clutches on came with a bushing instead of a bearing from the factory.

****Note - see post 209 - after 20k km, the bronze bushing gave out and I installed the factory pilot/needle bearing with less depth support. I do not recommend getting this bushing if you are going with a 6speed and the spacer.***

So, now all i'm waiting for are the starter, longer bolts, rear main seal, tandem pump and coolant seals, and a tune. Malone has been busy lately - hard to get ahold of him :(

No worries, it'll be warmer before I get into the job to any depth again...

But I am getting the itch...
 
Last edited:

Uberhare

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2006
Location
Ontario, Canada
TDI
Too many.
Congrats on getting started! I did the same, I'm not sure if the tranny had even cooled down from it's last drive before the new owner picked it up. Drove home from work on a Friday, and yanked it while the buyer drove over.

Good to know I have at least some part of the crank touching....:D
 

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
Congrats on getting started! I did the same, I'm not sure if the tranny had even cooled down from it's last drive before the new owner picked it up. Drove home from work on a Friday, and yanked it while the buyer drove over.
Good to know I have at least some part of the crank touching....:D
I'll take the above to mean that you haven't installed the clutch yet - sell it to me? :D

Let me know if you want that extra bushing.
 

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
No reason why it shouldn't - but you would need to measure the ID (21mm on my BHW) of the hole in the crank, and the OD of the input shaft (15mm on my 01E) on your 5-speed. As it is, I plan to put a thin washer behind the top hat of my bushing for a total of 9.5 mm of shaft engagement - just shy of the 10mm the factory bearing provides.

If, for some reason your measurements are different, I think that simplybearings.uk makes oillite bushings in almost every size imaginable. If you don't see what you need, send them an email.
 

Uberhare

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2006
Location
Ontario, Canada
TDI
Too many.
That method is not sound... The normal pilot bearing fits fine in a BHW crank. It does not in an auto 1.8T crank, which is the engine in the article. The 1.8T needs a bushing with the OD made to fit the crank and the ID to fit the normal pilot bearing. Hacking off the end of the crank with a disc grinder is insane.

In cases where the input shaft does not reach far enough into the crank (6 speed 240mm DMF with spacer on bellhousing) an oilite bushing could be purchased or made that would extend from the crank s few mm to support the input shaft, see above.
I agree. Don't like this solution. I'm going to be putting in a bushing once the trans is back out. Windex carefully measured his setup and figured I have about 4 mm of engagement :eek:.
 

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
I agree. Don't like this solution. I'm going to be putting in a bushing once the trans is back out. Windex carefully measured his setup and figured I have about 4 mm of engagement :eek:.
You doing your clutch any time soon? I broke down and ordered the same one from RyanP (The UK pound to CAD is not very favourable at the moment :( ) should be here in a week. then I'll have all I need to complete the swap (plus some hopefully higher temperatures).

Let me know when you want that extra oil-lite bushing.
 

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
Got into it a fair bit this weekend. Got the clutch line in.
I found that if I loosened off the two torx bolts holding the booster, then lifted it with a nylon strap, there is enough clearance to slide the line under it and into place:



Got the clutch master and pedal in, got the brake pedal cut down, and got the shifter in place.

Also, I fought with the transmission for an hour on and off trying to get it into place.

Eventually I took it out again (could only get it within about 3cm of seating). to find out why it would not go into place.

Was going on the theory that the release bearing may have got jammed in some way. Turns out is was just the slave cylinder pushing out on the release bearing. I removed the slave and now have the transmission within about a cm of seating on the engine (getting the input shaft to go into the pilot bushing).

TLDR - take the slave out before trying to seat the transmission, and you will save yourself a lot of grief.
 
Last edited:

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
That should be this afternoon. Just put the starter in, have the axles and bleeding the slave left, aside from some trim stuff. Getting the Trans lined up and seated was quite the ordeal last weekend. :D
 

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
Done Done Done.

Almost.

Car is driving (Finally!)

Can't seem to bleed the clutch fully, but it releases fully.

Still have to button up the interior, add the clutch switch for the cruise, and hook up the reverse lights.

But, I've had it down the road, and it drives nice. Much better than the slushbox.

Anyone need some good GMR axles with new outer boots? (All I have left :D)

Thoughts:

- Make sure you know which bellhousing bolts line up before you put everything together - I spent half an hour trying to thread the top two holes before I realized they don't mate up to anything on the BHW block.
- As above, loosening off the two torx bolts on the master cylinder and lifting it upward slightly gives enough clearance to wiggle the clutch line under it.
- Remove the slave cylinder from the transmission before trying to seat it to the block - the spring in the slave will fight you more than you know (Many expletives were uttered - everyone stayed far away from my garage that day...
- On mine, I got a new end-of-the-cylinder-head coolant manifold, and replaced it while I had the transmission out - very easy to get to with the trans out - difficult with it in place.
- I opted to get 1.8T flanges for the transmission, so I could use 1.8T axles - more common over here, limiting the only-from-Europe replacement parts list.

The Money shot:

 
Last edited:

vwztips

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2009
Location
Greenville, SC
TDI
2005 Passat GLS Wagon TDI 5 spd manual w/BSM delete 2011 Tiguan TDI/DSG 2005 Audi A4 Avant 6MQ TDI 2011 BMW X5 35d
Out of all the converions I have done, I have yet to have the clutch pedal be firm right off the bat in spite of multiple bleedings. Typically I have to pump it a lot and then after 25-50 miles of use it functions normally and has a firm factory feel. Give it some time and miles. Also if you hooked up the clutch cruise switch verify it is working throught VCDS BEFORE trying it on the road with the engine running.
 

A5INKY

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Sep 4, 2007
Location
Louisville, KY
TDI
2006 Jetta TDI, 2002 Eurovan Westphalia VR6
I've not done but one of these B5.5 conversions but the clutch bled out easily and felt great from the beginning. I used my pneumatic vacuum bleeder and helped it along by slowly pumping the pedal a few times while it was still sucking.

Just got to drive that car again as it was in for a new fan clutch this weekend. About 5K miles since conversion and no issues. Still amazed how nice a driving car a manual trans conversion makes.
 

vwztips

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2009
Location
Greenville, SC
TDI
2005 Passat GLS Wagon TDI 5 spd manual w/BSM delete 2011 Tiguan TDI/DSG 2005 Audi A4 Avant 6MQ TDI 2011 BMW X5 35d
I have both a pressurizer and a mity-vac and still have problems getting a firm pedal until I drive it for several miles.
 

Uberhare

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2006
Location
Ontario, Canada
TDI
Too many.
Ah...congrats on the first drive! It's a wonderful feeling. Almost makes me want to do another one!

No troubles bleeding the clutch here... Did it the old fashion way with my wife operating the pedal. I attach a piece of vinyl tubing to a bottle to catch the fluid. It also prevents air being sucked back in. Often I one-man bleed brakes by hanging it from a spring with a loop in the tube.
 

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
Money shot number two:



Drove it around for about 30km tonight, and filled the tank to start a baseline for fuel consumption. 2000 rpm is a bit "thrummy", but it pulls better than my B4.

Uber- I want to drive your car again to compare - when is the next time you are in town. You wanted to drive this FRF to see the RPM drop no? You can feel what the Darkside clutch feels like too - I am quite happy with the pedal feel, less effort than I was expecting.
 
Last edited:

Windex

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Apr 1, 2006
Location
Cambridge
TDI
05 B5V 01E FRF
Give me a shout - I should be home both evenings.

We could drag race - the only two 6 speed B5 wagons in the country (Or province at least) :D
 

vwztips

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 30, 2009
Location
Greenville, SC
TDI
2005 Passat GLS Wagon TDI 5 spd manual w/BSM delete 2011 Tiguan TDI/DSG 2005 Audi A4 Avant 6MQ TDI 2011 BMW X5 35d
Reset your Can Gateway to get rid of the automatic field at the bottom of the center screen.
 
Top