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TDI Power Enhancements Discussions about increasing the power of your TDI engine. i.e. chips, injectors, powerboxes, clutches, etc. Handling, suspensions, wheels, type discussion should be put into the "Upgrades (non TDI Engine related)" forum. Non TDI vehicle related postings will be moved or removed. Please note the Performance Disclaimer.

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Old September 1st, 2018, 20:45   #16
MAXRPM
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Originally Posted by [486] View Post
Neat, dog ring engagement?
The trans itself isn't hugely heavier than the 02j, maybe 50lbs more?
Andy2's running an 02j with everything done to make it stay together, it is a many thousand dollar path to take, even machining a lot of the parts yourself.
the rest of the kit that comes with the 6 speed makes it heavy plus the tranny itself too, 6 speed with LSD really expensive too
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Old September 5th, 2018, 12:31   #17
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Max,

I respectfully suggest you look at the Eurotune 6 speed conversation kit.
I did the first one in the U.S. back in 2012. I sold my B4V with the Eurotune 6 speed conversion. Zero problems in 6 years. See my signature for my front wheel Dyno resultes

I have a brand new, never used kit I will sell for $1000, if you are interested
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Old September 5th, 2018, 12:41   #18
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Originally Posted by MAXRPM View Post
not just me but several members have been running taller 5th gear even with stock cars since they came out long time ago, and right now I am running .658 not to say some members are even running it with .622, I can tell you with a lot of mods in my Jetta, and it does NOT run poorly, there is a big difference between stock and modded tdi,,,, roads in the US vs China or any other countries there is a big difference and other circumstances that would impact your car performance, I like my set up so far, I guess it's just a thing of preference for the driver

Max, having run the stock 5 speed gearing and a
622 fifth gear for about 18 months. I have to say there was a big gap from 4th to 5th
The Eurotune 6 speed conversion kit solved that issue for me in a 3100 lbs Passat.
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Old September 8th, 2018, 15:44   #19
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Originally Posted by TDIMeister View Post
Your best bet for peace of mind under high torque/HP punishment would be to go to an 0A6 tranny aka MQ500.

It will likely cost the same at the end plus you'll gain a 6th gear and proper TDI-matched ratios with no funny spacings of ratios. Having recently driven a China-made van while overseas, I can attest that it is no fun when the ratios are so badly chosen that the vehicle could not negotiate a moderate grade (in this case in 3rd) and downshifting to 2nd would put the engine near redline. In the TDI case that's usually the top and second-top gears (in reference to what you want to do here).
Wow, that 0A6 transmission looks like a sweet option if you had the money to spend on sourcing one and finding all the other parts necessary to make it work in our MKIV cars. Hopefully down the line someone will install one in a MKIV car.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAXRPM View Post
6 speed I know it is beefier than 5 speed but it adds up quite a bit of weight to a tdi that is already front heavy, guessing you will add up between 100-120 Lbs, starter, axles, clutch, flywheel, heavier than stock, I know most like it but I do not, having the extra weight off set my goal, so it is out of the question.

getting back to cryo why is it then that in the racing world people cryo their trannies and other components in a car? waste of $?
Where are you getting your numbers from on the added weight of a 6 sped transmission compared to a 5 speed?

From what I've found it's only a ~17 lb difference going from 02J to 02M.
Weight of 02J 95lbs: https://forums.fourtitude.com/showth...-a-rough-idea)
Weight of 02M 112lbs: https://forums.vwvortex.com/showthre...mission-Weight
112-95=17, so it's not nearly as bad as you make it out to be. Heck you relocate your battery to the trunk or install a lightweight Li-Ion battery and you've solved your problem. That's why I have the battery relocated in both of my MKIVs.

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Originally Posted by TDIMeister View Post
Your plan to put .658 5th gear with no change in the other 4 gears will go over very poorly on the road.
TDIMeister makes a really good point on the gap you'll have going from 4th to 5th if you install a taller 5th gear. I thought I saw you were going to change the R&P to 3.16 too?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MAXRPM View Post
the rest of the kit that comes with the 6 speed makes it heavy plus the tranny itself too, 6 speed with LSD really expensive too
Again you really need to do some more research before you write off the 02M 6 speed transmission.
You can get a 5 speed to 6 speed swap from Frans for $1450. http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=434593

Then depending on which LSD you wanna go with there's either a $75 difference between Peloquin 02J and 02M LSDs.
https://www.fourseasontuning.com/02j...ferential.html
https://www.fourseasontuning.com/02m...ferential.html
Or $200 difference between Wavetrac 02J and 02M LSDs.
https://www.fourseasontuning.com/103...ml?mfg_id=1098
https://www.fourseasontuning.com/103...d-non-r32.html

So lets say you can sell your current 5 speed setup for $700, you'd have to pay an extra $825 to upgrade to a much stronger 02M with a Peloquin LSD in your transmission

Quote:
Originally Posted by john.jackson9213 View Post
Max,
I respectfully suggest you look at the Eurotune 6 speed conversation kit.
I did the first one in the U.S. back in 2012. I sold my B4V with the Eurotune 6 speed conversion. Zero problems in 6 years. See my signature for my front wheel Dyno resultes
I have a brand new, never used kit I will sell for $1000, if you are interested
I was going to mention this kit, so you could keep your 5 speed transmission and then still have the benefits of a 6 speed transmission. See if you can find someone in your area that has a 6 speed in their TDI and see if you can drive it to see why so many people upgrade to a 6 speed transmission.


Now if you're still really stuck on keeping your 02J transmission, here are some upgrades I've found, but be prepared to open up your wallet and spend $$$$.
If you wanna have your cake and eat it too, you could always go with the 6 speed Dog Box Kit for the 02J for 3450 Euros which is approximately $3,988.12 at today's exchange rate.
http://www.sqsracing.com/produkt/176...r-transmission
Then there's the 5 speed syncro kit for 1570 Euros or approximately $1,814.88
http://www.sqsracing.com/produkt/276...ng-competition
Then you can't forget the sequential shifter for those upgraded transmission all for the low, low price of 1470 Euros or approximately $1,699.16
To make sure you know what gear you're in, you better get the Gear Indicator for 50 Euros or $57.79

So if you went with the 6 speed Dog Box Kit, Sequential Shifter and Gear Indicator you're looking at 4970 Euros or $5,744.62 to have the ULTIMATE 02J transmission in the world. The 02M doesn't look to bad now does it.

Here are a few other options I found as well.
http://store.forcefedengineering.com...ts.asp?cat=134
http://www.sqsracing.com/stranky/27:...2a-02j-02m-02q
https://www.ecstuning.com/b-cts-part.../ctshw054~cts/
http://holingeramerica.com/showroom/mf-2wd

Then this company does metal surface treatment on transmission parts, LSDs, etc, so you'd have to contact them on what you want done and if they can treat that kind of part.
http://www.wpctreatment.com/about.htm

Good luck on your decision, but my vote is to upgrade to a 02M with a LSD and never look back.
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Old September 10th, 2018, 19:47   #20
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I am no fan of the 6 speed to be honest, I like the other options that you came up for the 5 speed 02j I appreciate that.

id rather have a big gap between 4th and 5th than rpm going overboard red lining rpms with stock 5th, for me I'll take this gap at any given day besides for the kind of driving i do it is just fine. for other members they get frustrated and picky about it.
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Old September 11th, 2018, 14:45   #21
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It's been awhile since I've been on TDI Club. But I too am having transmission problems I had broken 3 02J Transmissions 5th gear get sheared off.I'm running 289 whp and I'm putting in an O2M Transmission the cost is a very expensive for me since I've already paid for two other transmissions previously. I'm going with a wavetrac limited slip and will be selling my 5 speed Parts including my upgraded driveshafts. I still have to look into a clutch.i will probably go with a bully stage4.
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Old September 12th, 2018, 20:48   #22
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Originally Posted by raydeee View Post
It's been awhile since I've been on TDI Club. But I too am having transmission problems I had broken 3 02J Transmissions 5th gear get sheared off.I'm running 289 whp and I'm putting in an O2M Transmission the cost is a very expensive for me since I've already paid for two other transmissions previously. I'm going with a wavetrac limited slip and will be selling my 5 speed Parts including my upgraded driveshafts. I still have to look into a clutch.i will probably go with a bully stage4.
^
This is why I'm trying to recommend you go with the 02M right from the start MAXRPM.

What is so wrong with the 02M that you don't wanna run it?
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Old September 13th, 2018, 19:17   #23
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I have to 2nd 3L3M3NT's suggestion of an 02M. I've put 170k on an 02J (100k of it with a 0.681 5th and taller tires) and 100k on an 02M and there's just no comparison.

5th is the weakest link and the easiest to put a lot of torque through unknowingly. Going to a taller 5th and 3.17 R&P puts even more torque through 5th gear. It's not a large % that have 5th gear failures, but there's quite a few here that have had that issue.

You're going with a nice responsive torquey turbo and talking about LSD and cryo treating etc. Just get the 02M and be done with it. The LSD cost is about the same, you don't need the R&P or the cryo treating or taller 5th. It's probably more expensive doing all the things to a 5 speed than just getting a 6 speed from the start.

If you're going with basic bolt on modifications to a daily driver/commuter ALH or PD then you can get buy with an 02J and taller 5th gear for the same cruising RPM's as an 02M for a lot less $. The gap between 4th and 5th isn't even a big deal really (especially with a tune). If you're even thinking of 200HP/300+ft-lbf and want it to last, just go with an 02M.
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Old September 13th, 2018, 20:47   #24
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if the concern is about making the tranny last under abuse, would the OP be better off running an external pump circuit that goes to sprayer/spray bars on the gears and a air to oil cooler.
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Old September 13th, 2018, 21:12   #25
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Ditch all that noise about junk VW transmissions, you want you a 4T65E from grandma's buick
With the strange chain drive setup it only sticks out 9" past the bellhousing flange, move the motor over for easier timing belt access
Weighs the same as an 01m (210ish lbs wet, with a full converter)
2.57 final drive is possible, with the .70 overdrive it puts 70mph cruise RPM around 1750ish last I looked
holds up to a 300hp V8 in a 4000lb car with stock components and wimpy stock shift programming, never mind the guys that build them up to hold even more poop than that
no boost lag on shifts (small spikes, actually), and you can stall the converter from a stop to get boost leaving the line

I plan on one in an insight with an ALH. Feels to me like it'll go like stink.

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Old September 14th, 2018, 10:07   #26
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you guys are too convincing lol now I'm starting to check at 02M I know it is a bullet proof tranny so what are you guys using for flywheel and clutches, i love this forum but at the at times I dislike it cause my choices are being diverted lol, my car is a daily driver so hopefully it is not an overkill, looking at the 02m I'd need an LSD new flywheel and a clutch, I know they sell it with a clutch and DMF shoot that's going to add up $$
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Old September 14th, 2018, 16:16   #27
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for those looking to run an older box.. this is the cheap easy to install solution.
https://www.vwvortex.com/aftermarket...5th-gear-cuff/


oh nice.. http://eng.kaps-transmissions.com/products-02m.html

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Old September 14th, 2018, 16:47   #28
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I can't ditch my 5th for that
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Old September 14th, 2018, 20:19   #29
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Originally Posted by MAXRPM View Post
you guys are too convincing lol now I'm starting to check at 02M I know it is a bullet proof tranny so what are you guys using for flywheel and clutches, i love this forum but at the at times I dislike it cause my choices are being diverted lol, my car is a daily driver so hopefully it is not an overkill, looking at the 02m I'd need an LSD new flywheel and a clutch, I know they sell it with a clutch and DMF shoot that's going to add up $$
Think of what it would cost if you cryo treated everything in your 02J and in the end had to go with a 02M like raydeee found out the hard way.

Compared to the 02J the only thing you have to do to a 02M is upgrade to steel shift forks and figure out which LSD you wanna install.

Steel shift forks: https://www.uspmotorsports.com/Steel...e-02M-02Q.html
Most people can get away with changing out just the 1-2 shift fork, but for piece of mind people will do the 3-4 shift fork as well.

Your LSD options.
Peloquin: https://peloquins.com/02m/
Quaife: https://www.quaife.co.uk/
Wavetrac: http://www.wavetrac.net/index.htm

As far as clutches go, there's quite a few companies you can go with nowadays.
DC Clutches through Aaron at Cascade German: http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=228609
South Bend Clutches: https://www.southbendclutch.com/
Sachs Performance: https://www.sachsperformance.com/en/...l-883089000034
Clutch Masters: https://www.ecodetuning.com/clutchma...ab-description
DKM Clutch: http://www.dkmclutch.com/base-usa/clutch-kits/ms/
Darkside Clutch Kit: https://www.darksidedevelopments.co....m-6-speed.html
And I'm sure there are others that I'm forgetting, so shop around see who offers the clutch that will work for your needs.

Quote:
Originally Posted by shortysclimbin View Post
for those looking to run an older box.. this is the cheap easy to install solution.
https://www.vwvortex.com/aftermarket...5th-gear-cuff/


oh nice.. http://eng.kaps-transmissions.com/products-02m.html
I don't think this is a drag car build, but if it was, that would be a great option

If one could afford a 02M sequential transmission would be pretty sweet.

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Originally Posted by MAXRPM View Post
I can't ditch my 5th for that
What this isn't going to be a drag build.
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Old September 16th, 2018, 09:51   #30
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Ok I really appreciate your help on the info for my tranny,,so we can get back on the right trac ok My golf has been built looooong time ago so this is NOT for my racer car,, My golf got G force gearing inside 1 through 4th gear and its got .658 cryod and wpc on the 5th its got .316 R&P and LSD as well so this is done the 02J and supposedly it is bullet proof so far I have pushed it hard and I haven't messed it up yet,,
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