Help.. Dealer won't give me back my money!

I need a bit of help... I went to a VW dealership and was very interested in a Jetta. However, I'm still shopping around for other cars but I was quoted a pretty good price. The salesperson told me that I can just reserve a vehicle... and if for any reason don't want to purchase it after shopping around... they'll just refund my deposit. The deposit is 500$. So I agreed and put down a deposit. After shopping around, I ended up purchasing a Jetta at another VW dealership... got a better deal. So after signing, I went to the 1st dealership today where I put the deposit to get my 500$ back. The sales manager says its impossible for him to return my money!

WHAT THE HELL!?!? Isn't this ILLEGAL!?!? I didn't sign ANYTHING at all.. only a paper to reserve the vehicle. THAT's it. what should i do now?

Go in there when it's busy and if they won't play ball, escalate to as high as you can get. If they don't want to deal, start raising a fuss and making a scene. No one wants to lose customers right now, so if you're going to scare people off, they'll placate you.

Well you can try and fight it, I mean you can call head office, demand to talk to the owner of the dealership, but because you didn't sign anything I don't think you can take them to small claims for the money and even still would it be worth the money to do so?

The fact is that, you took the guys word on it, and he was a weezel and you didn't sign any type of agreement saying that it is refundable. Its horse**** that they would even do that to you really sorry to hear that man. That guy who told you that seriously miss led you because any type of dealership i've worked at, the deposit was non refundable. It is basically seen as, they will hold the car, and if you come back that 500 bucks goes towards the car, but if not, that 500 bucks is compenation for the fact they COULD have sold that car already. Bull**** really they just want your money man.

If you paid the $500 on your credit card, call the card company and do a chargeback.

My friend, you can relax now. It is illegal for them to keep your deposit. We are all protected by a lil consumer law that allows us to change our mind after 10 days. The guy is probably testing the waters to see if you do anything about it. They have 15 days to refund you your money. Give it to them in writing and make sure it is well within the 10 day cooling off period. Hand it directly to the ARSEhole.

"The Consumer Protection Act, 2002 is serious about looking after your interests. Individuals violating certain sections of the act are liable to a fine of up to $50,000 or imprisonment of up to two years less one day. A corporation can be fined up to $250,000."

Read up on it here... They have to disclose everything. Believe me, this dealership is flirting with the devil:

http://www.gov.on.ca/mgs/en/ConsProt/STEL02_045905.html

Did you sign anything? Did you get a receipt for the $500?

When I bought my Toyota, I put down a $500 deposit and was also told it's refundable. From what I understand as well, it's illegal for them to keep it.

If the original request for refund was made within the time limit, walk into the original dealership with that act printed out and a cell phone in hand and tell them they are legally required to refund it. If they still protest, start dialing the phone ...

yeah.. it was on my credit card... I'm going to try the credit card company to see if they can dispute it.

I'm soooooo frustrated now... geez. but thanks for everyone's advice.

Dude, did ya go to the link I provided? RELAX. What they are doing is illegal. You WILL get your money back.

yeah.. i read it up... thanks so much.
another learning experience i guess.

Jonny, I am afraid you are mistaken.

Our friend signed something, but we're not sure what. We haven't seen it, and he hasn't shown it to us (or didn't get a copy).

If what he signed was a bill of sale, even if it was signed under the guise of "reserving a vehicle", he has entered into a legal and binding contract which entitles the dealership to keep his money as "liquidated damages".

look here: http://www.omvic.on.ca/info/faqs/consumer_faqs.htm

at the first entry.

Now, it doesn't mean that if he doesn't raise a stink that he wont get his money back, but it is by no means guaranteed.

If they stick to their guns and keep the money, you are entitled to a statement of liquidated damages- the dealership has to tell you, in writing the costs they incurred to reserve you the vehicle, and what they are putting that money towards.

Also, I would raise the spectre of filing a complaint with OMVIC. Dealerships don't like that.

Also, if what you signed was not a bill of sale (but I suspect it was), then they owe you the money- no question.





SO... What did you sign?

Even if that was what they tricked him into signing W, if it was me, I would still call the cc company up and do a chargeback, stating fraud. I wouldn't threaten them about filing with OMVIC, I'd do it. While IANAL, I don't believe a contract signed by fraud is valid. While it would be useless, I'd still call VWoC and report the dealer for fraud.

These are all good points, and the CC chargeback is a route I would take as well.

...Assuming the OP is telling an accurate story. If he came in a told the sales person that he was going to buy the car (why else would he leave a deposit), and they held the car for him in good faith, then they might actually be entitled to compensation for the inability to sell the car to other parties while he was "playing the field". Both morally and legally.

I have worked for and seen dealerships lose deals, and ask to have deposits refunded after they had dealertraded to get a car from across the city,incurring legitimate costs to do so.

There are always two sides to every story, and I'm not hearing enough of either side yet.


Bsoft, you've been watching this thread for an hour. What did you sign?

and quoting him a US consumer protection law isn't going to do him any good in Canada.

Jonny did actually quote Canadian Consumer Law, but the cooling off period he is refering to does not apply in this case.

It applies to Contracts signed in the home. Unless Bsoft managed to get a VW salesperson to come to his livingroom to have him sign for the deposit, he really is at the mercy of the dealership.

I'm not saying that, as described, what the dealership was right. Quite the contrary, if the salesperson misrepresented what i'm guessing is a sales contract to be a simple deposit form, than it was a very shady (and illegal) move. However, it would be something that Bsoft would have to try to prove - very difficult.

EDIT - Bsoft? You there?

hey guys...
here's what happened.. i was looking into getting a jetta for the family... walked in two nights ago... spoke with the salesperson for about 30 minutes... we were quoted a price... I asked if they could do better, etc... they threw in some tires... and said that's as low as it can go. Still not convinced at the price.. I said I'll have to think about it. At that point.. the salesperson said..well.. you should make a decision soon because these cars are going quickly... so I can't guarantee that the car will still be available when you come to a decision. So, salesperson and sales manager convinced me to simply reserve the car clearly stating that if I don't want it in the end.. they need only swipe my credit card again to refund the deposit. What did I sign? Well.. it looked like some generic fill-out sheet that the dealer printed out... just to put my name and number.. the deal they had quoted me... and that I was putting down 500$ as a deposit. They did not give me a copy of it, they did not even give me a bill for it after swiping my card. And that was it.

I went to another dealer the day after to see if I could get a better deal... and I did. So I signed for it.. contract.. and everything. Went back tonight to get my deposit refunded... and the sales manager said impossible. I left.. and told him I will dispute this with my CC company.. and that I will be contacting the BBB. And here I am now.. a few hours later.

Do you think the fact that I bought a car a day after at ANOTHER VW dealership makes my case any stronger?

Get a copy of what you signed. It's the only thing that matters.

If you signed the CC slip (sorry, but why the heck didn't you get a copy of at least that?) then your dispute with the CC company will likely be rejected, as you have signed the slip pursuant to your cardholder agreement and must honour the charges as stated on the slip with your signature.

Trust me. I've been there on both sides. I've worked dealerships for many years and know the system.

You need to know what it is you signed. If it is not a bill of sale for that specific car (VIN included) than you have a very strong case to get your money back. If you did sign a bill of sale (8 1/2x11, three carbonless copies, writing on both sides) than you will have to fight for your money, and may not see it even then.

If you did sign a bill of sale, and they will not refund your money, ask them in writing for a statement of liquidated damages, which will at least force them to tell you in writing why they are keeping it.

if you ask for it in writing, they have to provide it.



This all hinges of course on knowing just what the heck you signed...


Get a copy of it!

*shakes head*

hey windex..

based on your description of carbon copy paper etc... it was definitely NOT a bill of sale. IT was on a regular white sheet of paper.. one page.. that was all.

(Thanks so much for your help).

Well, that sounds better, but you're not out of the woods. Was there writing on both sides (preprinted), or was this something hadwritten on the spot?

If it did not have a clause stating (typically in really tiny print, on the back) that the dealership reserves the right to keep deposited moneys on vehicles not picked up, then you have a case.

Also, if they take the position that they have a signed bill of sale (contract), then they have to send you (registered mail) something called a demand letter. It is a letter informing you that the car you signed a contract for is ready for pickup, and that yu have to pick it up. If you don't pick it up, the letter will also typically state that you will forfeit your deposit. If they send this letter and don't have a real contract to back it up, you will win a dispute if you file one with OMVIC.

As above, get a copy of whatever it is you signed, pronto.

wow.. thanks so much for your advice man...
the paper I signed.. was in no way any type of official ANYTHING. Everything was written by hand and on the spot (aside from the NAME: , Tel: ... Car type: etc).. like those headings. Even the 500$ thing was written by hand...
i'll get a copy of it for sure.

Also good. Something handwritten like that likely doesn't have enough detail to stand up in an OMVIC dispute.

If you go to the dealer (feel free to mention which one, so others may avoid your fate) and get a copy of some handwritten note with no clause for deposit forfeit, tell them simply that your next stop is OMVIC, and that they can refund you now, or they can refund you when this worthless peice of paper is laughed at by the OMVIC mediator, along with a blemish on their OMVIC record.

Their choice.




Anyhoo, I've been up since 4am and I'm tired. Time for bed. Feel free to post or PM for any other issues or updates.

-Adam

thanks for everything!

Have you even checked with the credit card company to see IF there is a charge or even a hold on your card account?

Never leave without a copy (look at it BEFORE you sign it) of everything you sign. Everything!!

Bill

wow.. this sucks. next time maybe shop around before plunking down money?

I'd dispute it.. for sure you will win...

As long as the dealer has not spent any of that money for the car you want they have to refund your money 100%. If you are buying brand new then usually this means 100%. If its a used vehicle it could be a bit tricky.

The dealer has to show that he has spent that money on the vehicle to get it ready for you. Meaning, if you requested new tires to be put on a car that you were going to buy and you paid 500 down as a deposit and you changed your mind about the car, then the dealer could legally keep your money bc of the tires. This was something you had asked for.

Read the back of your contract agreement, it should say if the deposit will be refunded or not. As long as it says yes, or it doesnt manetion anything then they will refund.

We are ALL protected by the "Consumer Protection Act." First things first, dispute the charge with your CC company.

Listen, lets forget the conflict here. Just call the Consumer Protection Branch or email them yourself:

Consumer Protection Branch
5775 Yonge St. Suite 1500
Toronto, ON M7A 2E5
Toll-free: 1-800-889-9768
Call in Toronto: 416-326-8800
TTY: 416-325-3408 or 1-800-268-7095
Fax: 416-326-8665
E-mail: info.mgcs@ontario.ca

I would also visit www.ripoffreport.com to file a formal complaint or at the very least, tell the dealership in question that you intend to contact them and the local Consumer Editor of whatever newspaper your city deals with.

Going in on a busy day to cause a scene would be an option. Believe me, they would not be willing to lose other business for the sake of $500. They are banking on the fact that you wont do sh!t. Prove them wrong.

What dealership is this? Give us the heads up! This is how they conduct business? Unbelievable.

Or try newsgroups, etc.

I bought a VW years ago from a Ford dealership. I got it inspected by a VW dealership and one of the things they found was a seized caliper and parking brake cable. Took those findings back to the Ford dealership, and the condition of sale was that they fix everything VW found for when I buy the car. I found out a few months after I bought the car that they never replaced the caliper, just the brake pads, so the new pad had of course been destroyed since it was constantly rubbing. I had to pay to get it fixed. A year later I for some reason thought of this again and got really angry, so I drafted a nice post that I put on a newsgroup, and sent a copy of that post in an email to the Ford dealership, letting them know that I was still annoyed and was letting everyone know. I got a response the next day asking how much I paid to have this fixed (and it included a cash payment to a backyard mechanic for which I had no receipt) and the following week I had a cheque for the full amount in my mailbox. A year later! The $400 were not worth damaging their reputation on a newsgroup.

I have a friend who sells bikes and 3 months after the bike was delivered, the purchaser called MC and told them he didn't want it and they gave him his money back. When they called the dealer they just told them the situation. No questions, no options, just that they were taking back the money paid in full.
Call your CC company and let them deal with it.