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Go Back   TDIClub Forums > VW TDI Discussion Areas > Alternative Diesel Fuels (Biodiesel, WVO, SVO, BTL, GTL etc)

Alternative Diesel Fuels (Biodiesel, WVO, SVO, BTL, GTL etc) Discussions about alternative fuels for use in our TDI's. This includes biodiesel WVO (Waste Vegetable Oil), SVO (Straight Vegetable Oil), BTL (Biomass to Liquid), GTL (Gas to Liquids) etc. Please note the Fuel Disclaimer.

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Old June 26th, 2020, 07:14   #1
avcentraltias
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Join Date: Mar 2020
Location: Midlands UK
Default Using settled unfiltered WVO in a 1Z

Hi all,

For years ive been using decent quality WVO which i settle in 200 litre tank for a few months and then put straight in to my Range Rover P38 and 2.5 Di Transit without further filtering and without problem. I also used to use the same WVO in my 1x engined T4 Transporter van without any trouble.

Now ive swapped the 1x for a 1Z tdi it really doesnt like the stuff at all, even at 50 50 with dino diesel.

Is anyone here using SVO or WVO in a 1Z? What are you doing to process it to get your vehicle to run reliably?
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Old June 27th, 2020, 20:36   #2
[486]
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not veg, but I've been running WMO in my ALH for a while, biggest thing is richening up the smoke maps.
Stock maps, they will not even idle as they will not ask for enough fuel with the smaller amount of more viscous fuel that flows through the tiny injector nozzles.
At higher rpm they seem to act more normally, but at the very low injection pressures near idle it just is not very happy.

A possible 'bandaid' solution without going into the ECU would be some larger injectors, but then you've gotta watch your boost gauge with one eye, your pyro with the other, the mirror for smoke with the third, then use your fourth eye to watch where you're driving.
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Old June 28th, 2020, 04:17   #3
philngrayce
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Probably not the answer you are looking for, but in my opinion the best solution by far would be a proper two tank, heated system.

It’s a bit of an investment in time and money, and it takes space in the trunk (boot?) but the car should run for hundreds of thousands of miles on it. Plus you have an extraordinary range with both tanks full, a semi redundant fuel system and you can use many types of waste vegetable oil that would never work in the main tank. Since you don’t have to mix diesel in the tank, you may wind up buying a lot less fuel.
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Old June 28th, 2020, 08:39   #4
turbobrick240
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I met a guy at a gas station in Austin putting unleaded in the tank of his beat old dodge cummins. When I asked him about it he said he was running 90% wvo, with 10% gas to cut the viscosity and improve the burn. When I was experimenting with biodiesel production I saw some pretty horrific (and some quite good) waste oil. Running any that gunk unfiltered seems like a nightmare waiting to happen.
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Old June 28th, 2020, 09:06   #5
philngrayce
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I agree that unfiltered oil is bad news. But a few months of settling is really a very effective filtering method. I filter and settle the oil, but always felt that the settling was doing by far the larger part of the cleaning.
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Old July 5th, 2020, 21:30   #6
Nevada_TDI
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Do you want my Greasecar System? Come and take the tank out of my trunk and you can have the whole system.

I ran WVO for quite a while with .205's and a Stage 3 tune, and then my timing belt broke. When I sent my head to be repaired, Frank told me the fatty acids left on the head were a bear to get off, and said something about starting a savings account to run more WVO and use the savings to replace the engine. We settled and filtered our WVO, but never thought about the fatty acids left over. I always wondered if baking soda would work to neutralize the fatty acids, but how was the question...
I believe someone here settled their WVO and heated their WVO to 140* and add a quantity of baking soda and set the pump to recirculate. After a period of time the baking soda settles out, and the fatty acids have supposedly been removed.Long post, my apologies.
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Old July 6th, 2020, 11:27   #7
Nutsnbolts
 
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Indirect-injection engines are far more suitable to WVO because there is more combustion heat and combustion pressure when the fuel is injected. The trouble with our direct-injection TDIis that the compression ratio is low compared to the old IDIs, and the burn temperature is not hot enough most of the time (especially with dual stage pilot injection events) to completely consume the carbon chains that WVO contains. In this low-heat burn, the chains end up coming apart and linking 3 dimentionally, a process called polymerization. These large carbon chunks are VERY durable, and act like a hard plastic coating that is very difficult to remove. It eventually fouls the ring lands and seizes the rings, leading to loss of compression pressure and high oil consumption. It's not the temperature of the fuel (although that is necessary in this case), but rather the temperature of the combustion events that determine how long the engine will last.

-Rich
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Old July 6th, 2020, 11:55   #8
[486]
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that's kind of interesting being that I run into coking issues with the wmo as well, though I'm running cut pistons for even lower compression
you can knock it loose with enough violence, 50 psi of boost seems to do it pretty well

I'd thought of higher than 19.5:1 compression in the past, but never really went into it. Might be worth revisiting
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