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Go Back   TDIClub Forums > TDI Model Specific Discussions Areas > VW Passat Family (NMS and B7) TDIs (2012+)

VW Passat Family (NMS and B7) TDIs (2012+) Discussion area for the 2012+ Passat TDI (North American and rest of world versions versions). The North American model was previously codenamed NMS (New Midsize Sedan) and the version the rest of the world gets is sometimes referred to as B7.

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Old February 4th, 2018, 13:54   #1
MB2VW
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Default My 2015 Passat TDI vs 2012 Passat TDI Engine Power Impressions

After 46,000 miles over 33 months driving my 2012 Passat SE, the jig was up, and due to service deficiencies, such as the 80K service and tire wear, it was time to make that buy back appointment... So much for holding out until the fall....

Last week I put into service a very clean 2015 Passat SEL, with 19,000 miles. For the first time I was able to take it on a 600 mile trip yesterday.

This car had the phase 1 sticker under the hood.

What happened to the torque?. At highway speeds, the gas pedal doesn't seem to work as good! I thought this EA288 TDI was supposed to have more power and torque. Sure doesn't seem that way to me!

Did the phase one emission mods, kill these promises?

Anybody out there have a similar experience?

Do I need to look at a Malone or Kermit tune for this car, and is that a good idea?
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Old February 4th, 2018, 14:27   #2
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I think the EA288 engine feels like it has a bit less torque than the CKRA engine in your '12, and the fix makes it more apparent. I noticed it in particular at tip-in on GSW (same engine).

I have a Rocketchip tune on my wagon and it transformed the car. Power from a stop is far better, as is highway acceleration in top gear (mine is a manual). If you're unhappy with the power level consider an engine and DSG tune.
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Old February 5th, 2018, 05:32   #3
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Seconded, any tune will make the car better than a Gen 2 Passat. Tip in is great with a Malone tune.

One thing I do notice it still wants to down shift more than I'd want it to in quick stabs for a little pull.
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Old February 5th, 2018, 07:02   #4
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I know the OP has a DSG. My observations are for the manual transmission equipped cars.

My 2015 is faster, torquier, revs higher, and gets better MPG than my 2014 did. I'm not a hyper-miler or a 'drive it like you stole it' driver. The 2014 CKRA engine is all done by 4k RPM, the 2015 CVCA engine will pull to the redline, 5k RPM.

When passing I do downshift into 4th gear for decent passing power, otherwise the car is a bit gutless. So maybe it's not the type of transmission as much as that I control my shift points.

DSG tune in your future?

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Old February 5th, 2018, 09:10   #5
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I did the Malone Stage 2 tune last October. Very happy with it. I also bought the Flashzilla tool so I can go back to OEM before taking the car back to the dealer.
After I have the Pase 2 fix done by VW I'll get the DSG tune as well. Don't want to do that just yet just in case the Phase 2 does something to possibly delete it.
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Old February 5th, 2018, 09:42   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BKmetz View Post
I know the OP has a DSG. My observations are for the manual transmission equipped cars.

My 2015 is faster, torquier, revs higher, and gets better MPG than my 2014 did. I'm not a hyper-miler or a 'drive it like you stole it' driver. The 2014 CKRA engine is all done by 4k RPM, the 2015 CVCA engine will pull to the redline, 5k RPM.

When passing I do downshift into 4th gear for decent passing power, otherwise the car is a bit gutless. So maybe it's not the type of transmission as much as that I control my shift points.

DSG tune in your future?

That's prob the same disconnect of 6MT withdrawal I'm seeing in the DSG around town. The programming will have it shift to 6th at 1100 rpms at 50 MPH sometimes. Even then at 1900rpms, a quick stab of the pedal will result in a down shift even though the power is there.

Once tuned there is very little need for down shifts on highway unless your doing ~55 in 6th. 65-80 is mighty nice.
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Old February 11th, 2018, 11:46   #7
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Any members out there who like down shifting:

I drove my 2012 Passat SE TDI, and got into the habit of downshifting for slowdown's and stops.

I seems the 2015 Passat SEL has different characteristics. When a lower cog is engaged, I don't see the speed come off the speedo like the 2012. Also it seems more reluctant to match RPMs to the speed going into second gear.

Has anybody else noticed this in comparison 2012/-14 vs 2015?

Thanks.
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Old February 11th, 2018, 13:25   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MB2VW View Post
Any members out there who like down shifting:
I drove my 2012 Passat SE TDI, and got into the habit of downshifting for slowdown's and stops.
I seems the 2015 Passat SEL has different characteristics. When a lower cog is engaged, I don't see the speed come off the speedo like the 2012. Also it seems more reluctant to match RPMs to the speed going into second gear.
Has anybody else noticed this in comparison 2012/-14 vs 2015?
Thanks.
I don't have a comparison to a prior TDI, but I was disappointed in engine breaking with my 2015- almost non-existent, similar to my 2013 Focus. It's enough to prevent more speed from building (down a hill, to a stoplight, etc) but not really effective in reducing speed that's already there.
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Old February 11th, 2018, 19:18   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by joshuafail View Post
I don't have a comparison to a prior TDI, but I was disappointed in engine breaking with my 2015- almost non-existent, similar to my 2013 Focus. It's enough to prevent more speed from building (down a hill, to a stoplight, etc) but not really effective in reducing speed that's already there.
Because the intake of a diesel is not throttled, there is very little engine braking. Some diesels have a shut-ff valve that looks like a throttle, but it's full open as long as the engine is running regardless of load or RPM.

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Old February 11th, 2018, 19:24   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BKmetz View Post
Because the intake of a diesel is not throttled, there is very little engine braking. Some diesels have a shut-ff valve that looks like a throttle, but it's full open as long as the engine is running regardless of load or RPM.
Makes sense. Iím familiar with gas engines but this is my first diesels so still learning new things about them.
Would the engine not act like an air spring when no fuel is present, or does this only happen when exhaust values are locked shut, similar to a Jake brake?
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Old February 12th, 2018, 04:50   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BKmetz View Post
Because the intake of a diesel is not throttled, there is very little engine braking. Some diesels have a shut-ff valve that looks like a throttle, but it's full open as long as the engine is running regardless of load or RPM.

while not used for the same purpose of a throttle of a gas engine, there is intake flappers that believe close and open as needed, mainly for swirl and cleaner combustion.
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His: 2017 Alltrack SE, waiting for TSI to TDI conversion kits to be released.
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Old February 12th, 2018, 07:16   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 740GLE View Post
while not used for the same purpose of a throttle of a gas engine, there is intake flappers that believe close and open as needed, mainly for swirl and cleaner combustion.
For us VW guys I believe only the CVCA (gen-3) engine has this feature.

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Old February 12th, 2018, 09:02   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BKmetz View Post
Because the intake of a diesel is not throttled, there is very little engine braking. Some diesels have a shut-ff valve that looks like a throttle, but it's full open as long as the engine is running regardless of load or RPM.
You are correct if we were talking about the older cars. But in the CR cars there are 2 bona fide throttles, intake and exhaust.

They operate as part of their respective EGR systems to help regulate the egr flow. Intake throttle for HP egr and exhaust throttle (a.k.a. flap) for LP EGR.

The intake throttle does still retain the ASV function along with the egr duties.
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Old February 20th, 2018, 19:35   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BKmetz View Post
Because the intake of a diesel is not throttled, there is very little engine braking. Some diesels have a shut-ff valve that looks like a throttle, but it's full open as long as the engine is running regardless of load or RPM.

My2010 Jetta SportWagen had loads more engine braking on hills than my 2015 Passat (both DSG). This was one of the biggest surprises when I acquired the Passat. Makes me wonder if it has to do with maximizing fuel economy.
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Old February 21st, 2018, 04:19   #15
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I know one of the features of the 12 passat DSG that was different than the JSW DSG was a "freewheel" mode. Seeing the gearing has changed in the 2015, not sure if they carried over this freewheel mode.

from the 2012 Passat self study

"The 6-speed dual clutch transmission 02E in the 2012 Passat has a freewheel function. The purpose of the freewheel function is to isolate the engine from the gearbox in overrun, opening the dual clutch. The engine turns at idling speed and the vehicle coasts without any engine braking effect.

This freewheel function promotes fuel savings. The freewheel function is only possible with the selector lever in the "D" position. If the selector lever is in the "S" position or in the tiptronic gate, or if the driver presses the brake, the freewheel function does not operate. The feature reactivates when the engine is placed under load again."
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