Common '09 and up MkV Suspension Problems?

Well, they're getting older, and mine is one of them... ('10 Jetta)

I have a kind of clunk on the front right side, only when there's diagonal force, like when turning. Doesn't happen when I brake or accelerate in a straight line. Its a solid clunk, but with a bit of resonance like the spring is involved, or just vibrates with the sound. Sometimes I can hear it when I yank the wheel back and forth when not rolling, sometimes not. Gets quieter or even disappears as well, perhaps with colder weather? Other times its solidly there.

Any idea which suspension part(s) might be the one? Hoping for some of the TDI guru mechanics to chime in here. I have a bit over 90K, also had some Koni FSD shocks put on about a year or so and about 20k back, but probably not part of the issue. Let me know if there's other testing to do to diagnose.

I remember there being lists of what typically went bad with age on the earlier cars. Also remember that the MkV cars are supposedly blessed with longer life bushings.. but 90K is probably where our better ones start having issues. Would be nice to have a list of MkV car items to look at, as well, for those wanting to freshen up their suspensions.

No guru here, but IIRC, the MkV springs can sometimes rust out near the base, breaking off a small portion of the spring. You're in CA, so that doesn't sound likely, though.

You might look into this also, https://store.034motorsport.com/034...etta-gti-gli-r32-passat-8j-8p-audi-a3-tt.html

This may not be your issue but a very common noise problem is the front sway bar links. The boot tears at either end and weather does the rest. These are metal-to-metal joints so they can make a racket when play develops.

It may be hard to detect play just by lifting the wheel. You may have to detach one end of the link so that you can manipulate the ends and check for play.

Detaching them can be difficult, too. Attempting to undo the nut can make the stud spin. The stud does have a triple-square socket in the end (the ones that I have run into) but, if the nut is sufficiently corroded on there the triple square could strip out. It is very thin-walled. A torch would help here but sometimes cutting them off is the answer. In that case you better have a new one on hand.

Appriciate the suggestions. Keep em coming! Could be useful for others later.

I really need to look up some diagrams of the suspension, as well as get under there to look for obvious things. I know enough to have vauge, probably incorrect ideas. Also, I know it's often hard to determine what's wrong without unloading or dismantling stuff. I've seen that on other suspensions I've refreshed.

Any of these parts easy to test for issues, while still on the car?

I was chasing a clunk in my 2006 and everything helped. The rigid collars (got mine from ECS) improved lots, but finally changing the swaybar links put an end to all the noises.

I have squeaks but no clunks, and I know its my springs. My 02 had clunk and it was the the swaybar bushings, I would start there too.

Most of my customers mention sway bar links too. Another common one is the rubber bushings in the control arm brackets.
-BB

Well, being in SoCa, we (usually) have very little moisture to rust springs with.

The sound is occurring more often now with the steering wheel yanking. How can I separate loose subframe from a control arm or whatever? Or the sway bar links? I don't have any effect on steering when I go on or off throttle, i.e. no torque steer. Will see if I've got the tools to unbolt the sway arms to check them out.

Just bought a dogbone mount stiffener, wonder if that might change things @nd give a clue. Probably not, since engine torque doesn't seem to affect thongs.

get under the car and mark the mounting bolts for the subframe and subframe bracket with some paint.

that should let you see if they are moving around.

mine were easy to see due to an oil leak that was not completely cleaned up.

you also could snug up the bolts, or get a new set, replace, and torque to spec.

have you closely examined the parts? a close look can sometimes reveal movement where there should be none, or broken springs.

The A5's suspension seems to be pretty good from what I have seen. They've been in service for over a decade now.

I see a few broken springs, and they usually just break at the lower part, one coil will break off, so it isn't like the car collapses and sags a couple inches or anything. You often have to lift the car up just to find it.

I see a few creaky/dried out sway bar links that if let go long enough will develop some play and those will make a lot of noise that sounds much worse than it really is.

OK, took it to the local dealer today, to get the 23O6 or whatever the number ECU update. My reg renewal comes up on the 16th, can't wait much longer...

Told them about the noise, with some careful dancing got them to check things out without a standard $135 "diagnosis". They gave me a confusing and vauge "Uh, there were some non standard suspension parts found, but that wasn't it. They tightened some things up that were loose". (I have a set of Koni FSD's) Me: Was it the subframe? Service Guy: "Uh, yeah, and they tightened things up". "We'll have you talk with the Shop Manager, he knows more about it, get a test drive, etc"

Waited another half hour, couldn't find him, left at 2hrs on a 40min estimated job. Took my number to call me back, never did. Punch line, paperwork says "found aftermarket suspension parts that were loose, tightend them up".

The guy was also saying if this didn't do it, they'd probably look at the Steering Rack.. I'm wondering how likely that might be, or is it just the most expensive part possibly connected with this...

Went back to work (this was missing time with a long lunch) then went home. A bit of noise, maybe different, still similar. If the car sits just right, you can make it clunk pretty good cranking the wheel right and left when stopped.

Got someone to crank on the wheel while I was under, just a quick laydown next to the car and feel what I could reach... it's definitely the R side, and maybe in the shock tower. Was able to feel the sway bar joint, (maybe a bit of motion?) rear trailing arm bushing (nothing) and a few other places. (bit of wheel bearing play?) It kept disappearing on us, then I'd back it out and put it back, roll back and forth, etc, to get it to come back. Seems braking from forward motion was best at "setting" it for clunking, but it would eventually stop after some steering wheel work.

Questions:

1. How much motion of the shock/strut tower and spring is normal when the front wheels turn?

2. (with engine off) There is a bit of motion before the full effort of moving the wheel in the steering, kind of feels spring loaded, with a rather small bit of mechanical noise. Normal? I've noticed this from day one, maybe the tiny clunks there are a bit worse now.

OP - DriverJon - Your car dealership experience as much as it is unfortunate and fruitless ,,,,, Its all to common, still.

Many "Service Guy's" fail to grasp customer engagement value.

Is the right side noise (location-edit) "high" or "low"? Yeah, I know, always difficult to be certain.

As struts (FSD-install) were the last mechanical work,,, possibly the rubber strut mounts were incorrectly oriented? Are the strut mounts new or original? Maybe the noise source is the upper strut bearing? Presumably, with 70,000 mi on the clock and when fitting new struts/dampers the associated bearings/rubbers/hardware was replaced? Maybe no?

PS. I'm also chasing a noise source location in the rear axle area for a "clunk". The trunk is bare empty, etc .... Maybe time for a physician like stethoscope; A Craftsmen, Snap On tools version.

Not sure what you're asking abt high or low... Where's the sound coming from? Not sure...

Don't think any other parts were changed, maybe should have asked abt getting strut bearings changed back when. Have any comment on whether the struts should turn or be fixed, when you turn the wheel? I'm guessing if it's called a strut bearing, it does.

I'll do some more looking at stuff tomorrow. Hope I can find the mechanic's contact info, not finding the shop online now.

Harbor Freight has a usable mechanics stethoscope for $4.95 or so...

Can anyone give me an idea how likely it could be the steering rack, and more importantly, how could I diagnose it?

Also, where might I find a good set of online diagrams for the MKV suspension?

erwin or alldatadiy.com

you can also get a good idea from one of the online parts sellers, aka dealers, who let you enter vin and see parts blow up with part numbers.

http://www.vwpartscenter.net/auto-p...ne/front-suspension-cat/front-suspension-scat

on my car, the bolt that holds the bracket (17 above you can see the bolt head from below through the hole in 9) was loose and the whole shebang would clank and move on takeoff in a turn.

Gotta luv a schematic - See #8 rubber/strut mount. #7 bearing/strut mount and #14 link to sway bar.

IIRC ...With our TDI, the Koni FSD strut was a struggle when fitting into #1 knuckle .

The customary VW spreading of the knuckle to accept the strut fitment was unusually difficult..!! Either the Koni strut diameter was larger than normal or the knuckle's "strut cup" was not opening wide enough.. Either way, fitting the Koni FSD strut to the knuckle was memorable. I had used the same brand-name VW strut/spreader tool .. of many years.

Possibly the OP's noise source is rooted in the strut/only install? ??

Our Koni FSD F&R set + parts was USA purchased and installed in May of 2015 @ 150,000mi or so. OEM Sach's units owed me nothing.

Well, after an inconclusive feeling for motion test earlier, where I was feeling things under the car, I finally got another round in last night. First thing, I can feel the top of the front right strut moving round in the bushing when my "assistant" cranks the wheel around. And, that's the clunk.

Any reason that would loosen up, or be hard to tighten, other than it just came loose?

Doesn't give me a warm fuzzy feeling about my under new management dealer, that they wrote on the invoice they found aftermarket parts loose, said they tightened them, and it was clunking more after I left. I'm also up to 4 calls now where they were promising to call back with info, and havent.

Where's a good torque reference... I'm about to try it myself.... (off to order some Locktite)

item 7 above is a bearing, it is supposed to rotate freely.

Nobody answered my earlier question about this, bu by your comment I assume the strut normally turns with steering motion. Is it #7 turning inside of #8? And #3 the strut, is firmly attached to #7?

What I'm feeling is not just slow rotation, it's an occasional lateral pop or jerk, and THAT is the clunk I hear. Either the bearing is bad, or the strut isn't tight on it. The outer cap on the body (#8) isn't moving.

The bearing is supposed to let the spring move with the knuckle, wheel bearing, tire,...

while the strut mount is firmly attached to the body of the car.

The tension of the spring should keep it in contact with the bottom of the bearing.

this is why you need a spring compressor to take the mount off the strut. (be very careful and know what you are doing before messing with this. there is a lot of energy in the spring.)

did they/you replace the bearings when you put the Koni struts in the car?

might want to take it all apart again, and put new bearings/strut mounts in.

but before you order parts, double check for intact springs.

Yep, I am aware of and have great respect for stored energy... I know not to loosen the tower with I'm spring uncompressed.

So, the reason I keep sounding like an idiot, is that I'm not clear on how the strut is attached to the bearing. I see how it needs to turn, but don't know if the strut is loose to the bearing or the bearing has play and can clunk back and forth.

The mechanic who put the fronts in for me (didn't have spring compressor, etc) thought at 60-70K the bearings were not worth changing yet, so he didnt. As said, I put the rears of the FSD set in, mech did the fronts.

I guess nobody can tell me w/o taking it apart if it's the bearing vs the strut mounting bolt loose? Do you need a special tool to tighten said nut?

http://www.idparts.com/front-springs-pair-a5mkvisportwagen-p-4241.html

the top of the spring is wound to be flat and just sits in the bottom of the bearing, while the bottom end (closer in the idparts photo) has a spot in the strut to fit into.

more info at http://www.myturbodiesel.com/wiki/strut-shock-installation-and-replacement-mk5-vw-tdi-and-audi-a3/





the tension from the bolt against the partly compressed spring holds the spring against the bottom of the bearing.

if you can safely get near the installed strut while a trusted friend turns the wheel you should be able to see what part is catching.

might want to put the front on jack stands and take the wheel off.

you can watch the top mounting while you turn the wheels, but you have to pull up a plastic part to see the top of the strut



would be obvious if the three mounting bolts are loose.

Great thread. My 2006 will clunk when making a left turn into a drive way or over a speed bump but never when approaching either head on.

My best guess, and only a guess is the upper strut bearings. I tried to duplicate the problem with the car on jack stands and couldn't duplicate the clunk.

I'm at 160K+ miles, so I probably am about due for a suspension refresh anyway.

Broken front suspension spring

I had a knocking noise coming from the cowl area and a loud knock when turning the steering wheel L & R. Sounded like it was spring related. Took car to the stealership and they had to replace broken R side spring due to the strut bearing being frozen. Of coarse they could not just do one side, so entire front suspension was rebuilt costing $1482 including front end alignment. I received my VW loyalty cards a week later so could not use them at that time.

Ouch!! I'd argue with them long and hard on not letting you use the cards to offset that. Also sounds a bit avantagous to do the whole front end, but what do I know...

Well, after 5 phone calls with promised callbacks, I finally got a hold of the guy at my dealer who knows something technical. He had called me at about call 3 or so, they gave him the wrong number.

So, it is thought to be the strut bearing going bad. What they did 2 wks ago, was to tighten the lower end bolt and the sway arm, on the shock (s) which were loose. You can't tighten that upper, easily. He said the upper nut was not an issue, if that was loose, every bump of the road you'd hear it rattle. Not the subframe, there would be sounds just about only during acceleration and braking, not what I hear. He described several conditions and symptoms for me. Jeeze, all the info I needed to understand this, and from a dealer. Too bad it took this long to talk to him. Apparently the guy first handling me is new, doesn't know much, and worse was just agreeing with my questions rather than saying I don't know.

This shop manager guy I talked to, will give me an estimate, even offered to do just labor if I wanted to source the parts, saying I'd probably save money from the prices at the Parts department. Hmmm...

So, for someone reading this in the future, tl;dr If you wonder if it's your strut bearings, here you go:

Does the noise occur only when your turning, not in a straight line, or as you go over bumps in a straight line?

Can you put your finger on the center of the shock (threaded rod in center of the shock tower pic above, and feel it jerk and pop laterally rather than only smoothly turn, when someone moves the steering wheel? (Note, you should hear your sound when this happens)

Do you feel any motion of the strut tower end cap, or of the 3 bolts holding it down, when the steering wheel is being cranked?

If it's YES to the first two, and NO to the third, you can be pretty sure it's the strut bushings.

JETaah said:

Detaching them can be difficult, too. Attempting to undo the nut can make the stud spin. The stud does have a triple-square socket in the end (the ones that I have run into) but, if the nut is sufficiently corroded on there the triple square could strip out. It is very thin-walled. A torch would help here but sometimes cutting them off is the answer. In that case you better have a new one on hand.

Click to expand...

I just did front and rear swaybar end links, and rear swaybar bushings on my 06 Jetta yesterday. I wasn't expecting much, but holy crap what an improvement. I had some light clunks in the front and rear, so I wanted to do the whole works in one shot. I'm really impressed with how much better it is now. City streets are pretty rough here, and the car feels much tighter now.

But...holy crap were they a pain to remove. I had to cut all 8 nuts off. Only the two rear link lower nuts were easy since I removed the whole swaybar with the links still attached and cut those two off on the shop floor.

Yesterday was a hoist envy day.

The good news is that the parts are relatively cheap.

Wow... I remember this thread...

Glad to hear it was worth going through all that. Hopefully I have a ways to go on thse myself...

After reading this again, I realized I never posted the end of my story.

I got a pair of the Audi TT strut bushings from ID Parts, and had my shop put them in. Fixed it, and added a noticeable bit of front end tightness, without noticable added noise, vibration or harshness.

I'd recommend them, and as I recall, they hardly cost more than stock.