Hey Guys Newbie with a newbie question 85 golf

hey guys new to the diesel world and to vw. my brother is a vw nut but has never had a diesel. any way, ive been searching the forum but could not find an answer to my question...

1985 golf non turbo. car has starting issues, but only when warm it seems.

bought the car off ebay for 800 bucks. bodys good except for reg east coast rust. int is in good shape but in need of cleaning. owner had a long haired white dog! black thatch interior! only has 145 on the clock. engine seems to be in good condition. small leak from power steering, small leak from valve cover, in dire need of timing belt. other than that the car ran great! had it on a 350 mile first day debute! only used a 1/4 tank! screw my damn escalade!!!!

so the guys says it starts when it wants to. well it had been sitting for 6 months with out being started, hooked up a bat pack and she fired right up! he was amazed said it never did that. we checked/changed the fuel relay as well as the glow plug relays. it needs a temp sens as the temp gauge is pinned as soon as you start it, but when it gets to norm opp temps the cooling fan does kick on?? the glow plugs do work, so whats going on...

well my brother who is a vw tech said before we leave lets turn it off and make sure it will start if i stall. well i didnt start. the car ran for 30 mins, drove up and down the block fine, then got turned off and wouldnt start. went to lunch let it cool off and it started right up!?drove 350 miles to home, turned it off went to start it and nothing. what gives???

any help is appreciated, and if this is the wrong place to post non turbo diesels, moderators please let me know were to post.

thanks in advance!

bump.

I'm baffled about the hot starting issue. I think I heard of this before. It does crank, just won't fire, right? It may be a timing issue. That should be solved when you replace the timing belt. Note that there is a special tools requirement for this job. You MUST have them, don't listen to those who say you don't need them (a dial indicator in 1/100s MM and holder for the pump timing check hole, belt tensioner spanner, IP lock pin, and cam lock plate). Follow the Bentley procedure.

There is no fuel pump relay. Fuel is fed to the injection pump by the rotary feed pump INSIDE the IP, its all mechanical.

About the radiator fan kicking on: I suspect that if the engine is not overheatibg and the fans come on, the radiator thermo switch is bad. Its in the lower left rear of the radiator (from the driver's seat perspective). You need to get the Bentley manual for the car. You can unscrew the switch (the radiator will drain its coolant when you do this), hook an ohm (continuity) meter leads to it, and imerse it in a pan of hot water with a thermometer in it. The switch should close at approximately its rated temperature.

There are two temperature sensors on this car--One for the gauge and the other for the glow plug relay. They are different, but look similar. I forget which is which. You need the Bentley manual.

--Nate

thank you for the reply.

yes the motor cranks, just wont fire.

i do have the bently manual, as well as the original vw shop manual, and the vw interactive mechanic cd. my brother has been wv trained on diesels but doesnt have too much experience on the older diesel engines. hes going to bring it to work and see what some of the senior guys have to say.

he thinks either someone set the timing with the cold start handle pulled out, or the valves are adjusted too tight and they are expanding when its hot.

hes gonna change the glow plugs, their relay, and the temp sensors. the timing belt, flush fluids. change belts, fuel filter.

what else should i tell him to do?

thanks

Check the compression after a hot soak.

IIRC, that engine is a solid lifter type that takes shims above the lifters to set the lash. I've never seen anybody need to do it, but that doesn't mean nobady has. It seems to me that if the lash was set too tight, then this car would have had this problem since its last timing belt, assuming that's when the valve cover was off last.

I agree that a hot compression test is in order.

Also, check to make sure that the fuel shut off on top of the injection pump has a good connection. High resistance in this area from corrosion could be making all of the difference. It threads into the pump.

The screw-in plug on the side of the radiator (I think is was the driver's side) is the one for the cooling fans. I don't remember where the gauge sender is on those, though.

-Rich

thanks guys. ill chime back in when everything listed has been checked!

Another thought: '85 is the last year of mechanical lifter diesel heads. Shims are used to adjust. You can check the clearances, you just can't replace the shim without the lifter depressor tool. You might want to check them. The spec. should be on the "emissions control label" under the hood. Cam lobe "up" for the lifter/cam being checked, just like any other overhead cam engine w/ mechanical lifters.

When it won't start you can also remove the fuel feed line TO the injection pump, at the banjo bolt fitting on the top of the injection pump. Check to see that the pump cavity is full of fuel. If not, pour clean diesel fuel into it and re-install the line and see if it starts and runs.

It may be possible the mainshaft seal in the injection pump leaks air in, preventing the IP from sucking in fuel.

A dry pump may also mean that there is a stoppage in the fuel line, or a clogged filter. There is supposidly a filter sock at the pick-up inside of the tank that could get plugged. That's the last place I would check, though.

--Nate

thanks