Tuned!

What are the odds, the dealer would know this has been done to void your warranty and what are the effects long term? Can the motor/trans handle this increase? I would love to do this but....worried

LokiWolf said:

I have an iPhone and a GoPoint BT1, not adding another device to the cabin. I haven't tried to get it to display boost. Isn't it an extrapolated Boost?

Not too concerned with boost. It makes more power and with a VGT, max boost isn't really where your power is, it is sustained boost. Boost won't tell me anything. It drives better and has more power.


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I am not knocking your tune! I am just interested in what they did to make the power. Its boost, fuel or both. The only reason I was wondering about the boost is because of the rumor of some failures and if the extra pressure created in the tune might have an effect on the life of our small turbo.

Thanks for the review and updates! Sounds like a good upgrade.

Did I understand correctly, a DPF delete isn't required for a Stage 2 tune? What about DEF (AdBlue) if the DPF is deleted?

VeeDubTDI said:

I'll have to look you up the next time I'm down in that part of the state.

I think the earlier link/pic of the dyno for a BV43 equipped 2.0 TDI - BV40 probably drops off a little sooner. Regardless, glad you're enjoying it.

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Just yell, I'll let you take it for a spin.

I agree it is, and that appears to be the case.


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Is the dyno for a Passat or a Jetta/Golf? If it's a Jetta/Golf the curves may be different for the Passat. The one Passat I've seen on a dyno really ran out of steam around 4K. More so than my Golf, which is really done at 4500. Those of you that have seen dynos from my ALH know this doesn't have to be the case for all diesels.

The comment about holding wastegate closed longer doesn't make sense to me. First, it's vanes, not wastegate, although they do the same thing, kind of. But if you hold the vanes closed boost will go up. If Malone is regulating boost to 1 PSI over stock then the tune can't hold the vanes closed longer, beyond what gets that extra PSI.

Looking at the curves I'd suspect most of the increase in power is added fuel, which is also probably why they're concerned about EGTs in warmer climates. I'd personally worry about driving the car too hard without an EGT gauge to help you know when to back off. And I wonder what that added fuel does to regen frequency. I haven't seen any data on that.

And are these cars really limited to 110 MPH? I thought it was 130.

I'm interested in hearing more as people live with these tunes for a while. My Golf remains my only TDI that's stock.

I agree about keeping stock for now. Until I see a few tuned CR engines with a few miles (like 50-60k or so) after the tune I am going to hold off. Plus, the factory CR engine puts out MUCH more power stock than either the ALH or PD so overall I am happy stock for now. Also has anyone found the link between DPF delete and DEF delete on the Passat? That would be a plus on that model for me.


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IndigoBlueWagon said:

Is the dyno for a Passat or a Jetta/Golf? If it's a Jetta/Golf the curves may be different for the Passat. The one Passat I've seen on a dyno really ran out of steam around 4K. More so than my Golf, which is really done at 4500. Those of you that have seen dynos from my ALH know this doesn't have to be the case for all diesels.

The comment about holding wastegate closed longer doesn't make sense to me. First, it's vanes, not wastegate, although they do the same thing, kind of. But if you hold the vanes closed boost will go up. If Malone is regulating boost to 1 PSI over stock then the tune can't hold the vanes closed longer, beyond what gets that extra PSI.

Looking at the curves I'd suspect most of the increase in power is added fuel, which is also probably why they're concerned about EGTs in warmer climates. I'd personally worry about driving the car too hard without an EGT gauge to help you know when to back off. And I wonder what that added fuel does to regen frequency. I haven't seen any data on that.

And are these cars really limited to 110 MPH? I thought it was 130.

I'm interested in hearing more as people live with these tunes for a while. My Golf remains my only TDI that's stock.

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Why? Millions TDi turbo cars are on road here in US and Europe. I don't see your logic behind. It's nothing wrong with turbo at high rmp, the case with Passat turbos are in cold starts and use too much boost on cold oil. The turbo will fail eventually, but it should be fine for 100,000+ miles.

Variable vane turbos are known to fail at high temps, 1600 degrees F is the accepted limit. If a tune adds fuel to the stock maps and allows EGTs to exceed this temperature regularly the turbo can fail prematurely.

Sure there are millions of turbo diesel cars on the road here and in Europe. And the majority of them are stock. The question is how long will they last if allowed to exceed the manufacturer's recommended exhaust gas temperatures. And most people here would be furious if their turbos only lasted 100K.

I'm actually less concerned about the turbo than the impact of added fuel on Regen frequency and DPF and DPF filter life. Tuners I've asked about this give me an "it depends" response. Hard driving will cause more frequent regens because you're dumping more fuel into the engine and therefore more to clean up down the tailpipe. If you use the power occasionally it may make no difference at all. I know of one tuned JSW owner who had two DPF filters (and ultimately the DPF) fail within 100K. Did the tune cause it? I have no idea. And it was a data sample of one.

The emissions systems we have here, especially on the Golf and Jetta, are pretty much unique to this market, and I don't know if the Passat's engine code is used anywhere else. So we may have different experiences than other markets with these drivetrains.

In the Russia VW is rated 170 hp so it should be a problem

IndigoBlueWagon said:

Variable vane turbos are known to fail at high temps, 1600 degrees F is the accepted limit. If a tune adds fuel to the stock maps and allows EGTs to exceed this temperature regularly the turbo can fail prematurely.

Sure there are millions of turbo diesel cars on the road here and in Europe. And the majority of them are stock. The question is how long will they last if allowed to exceed the manufacturer's recommended exhaust gas temperatures. And most people here would be furious if their turbos only lasted 100K.

I'm actually less concerned about the turbo than the impact of added fuel on Regen frequency and DPF and DPF filter life. Tuners I've asked about this give me an "it depends" response. Hard driving will cause more frequent regens because you're dumping more fuel into the engine and therefore more to clean up down the tailpipe. If you use the power occasionally it may make no difference at all. I know of one tuned JSW owner who had two DPF filters (and ultimately the DPF) fail within 100K. Did the tune cause it? I have no idea. And it was a data sample of one.

The emissions systems we have here, especially on the Golf and Jetta, are pretty much unique to this market, and I don't know if the Passat's engine code is used anywhere else. So we may have different experiences than other markets with these drivetrains.

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That is exactly why I was asking about the extra boost they created with the tune. I do not feel there is much over building going on in diesel engines now like there was before and without a wastegate, you are at the mercey of the tuner being good enough to know how much boost he can or will make in every situation. The 6.7 powerstroke is a great example as many of those that are tuned or even just dpf deleted have had there turbos blow. They are built to hold up to the factory tune and very little more.

phlfly said:

In the Russia VW is rated 170 hp so it should be a problem

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But do they use the same turbo in Russia?

170 HP Common Rail cars have many differences, turbo and injectors being two, along with emissions systems differences. Most TDIs in Europe (if not all) run Urea, which changes the regen process and fueling in regen.

Are you ever up towards the DC area? I am very interested in this and you don't think a dpf delete would help?

Congrats! Glad to see another NMS tuned! Wonderful, isnt it (-:

Counting down the clock

ISurvivedNMU said:

The 6.7 powerstroke is a great example as many of those that are tuned or even just dpf deleted have had there turbos blow. They are built to hold up to the factory tune and very little more.

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That's because the Powerstrokes are altogether garbage.

We have these out with over 40k miles on a Malone stage 2 with no problems. They tell me they are seeing fewer regens as well. Peak boost on a stage 2 is only raised by 1 psi. Peak boost is held longer though. Power comes from extended primary injection duration and timing improvements. We also do not increase rail pressure at all without special request.
Exhaust temps may be a bit higher than stock but we do not change any safety parameters (over boost, too high EGTs, over rev, etc) so if exhaust temps reach limits deemed unsafe by VW engineers it will still go into limp (safe) mode.

-Les

JdC Machine said:

That's because the Powerstrokes are altogether garbage.

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Or its because more of them are tuned than the TDI

Anymore comments from the OP on how he likes the tune and MPG differances?

nothing like pushing an already stressed turbo with know production issues.

Keep reporting back as the miles pile on.

I'd be tempted for the DSG tune just to smooth it out.

740GLE said:

nothing like pushing an already stressed turbo with know production issues.
Keep reporting back as the miles pile on.
I'd be tempted for the DSG tune just to smooth it out.

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I was wondering if you could do the DSG tune without anything else. I'd be interested in hearing about how well it works without the ECU tune.

740GLE said:

nothing like pushing an already stressed turbo with know production issues.

Keep reporting back as the miles pile on.

I'd be tempted for the DSG tune just to smooth it out.

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And for Ace_Deprave, the DSG tune can be done without an engine tune for the same effect.

What kind problem do you have with DSG?

I think it works perfect I like it a lot since its remind me more manual then auto. The mine tranny does engine brake even, it started doing after 9,000 miles I guess it's "adopted".

ISurvivedNMU said:

Or its because more of them are tuned than the TDI

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Even in stock form, the 6.0 Powerstrokes are garbage. PowerJOKE, PowerCHOKE. Whatever you wanna call it.

Unless it's a good one! I love mine. Yes, I put studs in. As long as the 6.0 is maintained and you run the CRAP out of it. It LOVES pulling my 30' fifth wheel!

Love mine, too. Not sure why all the hate.

The license plate is 6 LEAKER, though... for what it's worth.

VeeDubTDI said:

Love mine, too. Not sure why all the hate.

The license plate is 6 LEAKER, though... for what it's worth.

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It is pretty funny how many of us on here are also diesel trucks owners!

My toy is a 2006 F250 6.0 without studs. It will be happening soon, it's time.


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740GLE said:

nothing like pushing an already stressed turbo with know production issues.

Keep reporting back as the miles pile on.

I'd be tempted for the DSG tune just to smooth it out.

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You are making an assumption that the failures are due to stress and not a manufacturing defect.

If it goes, it goes. Like I said earlier in this thread, you pay to play! Also, like has already been mentioned, the tune only increases boost by one PSI. Mine is actually less. Mine has been logged at 22.67 PSI. So only 0.67 above the max Stock PSI. It does sustain it for longer though, so yes it could lead to some additional stress. We will see how it holds up. I put about 25K on my car a year, so I will be a good test.

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Kevinski4 said:

And for Ace_Deprave, the DSG tune can be done without an engine tune for the same effect.

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Like was said by Kevin, you can do the DSG tune by itself.


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Iknow i'm making assumptions and I'm no expert.

But going from the fact that it's a smaller turbo asked to create more boost at lower rpms than the CJAA engine, I'll still say that it's stressed more than the CJAA.

I'm all or the people pushing the tune and I look forward to seeing how the miles pile on for you.

Sounds like a good excuse for an upgrade if it blows up.