02 Jetta TDI starts then dies NEED HELP

02BoraTDI

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Jun 26, 2006
Location
Greensburg, PA
TDI
2014 Jetta Wagon
I have a 2002 Jetta TDI with 60k on it. My wife was drivign and pulled to a stop sign and it just stopped running. After checking it out i thought it might be the fuel filter since it would start and rev on its own and immediately shut off. After getting it towed and running Vag on it i came up with the following codes:

17969 Quantity Adjuster (n146) control Deviation

17971 Quantity Adjuster (n146) Lower limit reached

16486 sensor signal too low(g70)

17946 Fuel Shut off Solenoid Valve, open or short to ground (n109)
intermittent

I just recently replaceced the boost sensor with a 3 pin. My mechanic said that the Fuel Shut off Solenoid is losing power, so is this because the solenoid is bad or is there an ECU problem, or am i looking at a pump rebuild. I am hoping the Solenoid problem is causing the Quantity adjuster codes. Might be totally off im not a mechanic.

Any help is appreciated.
 

rdkern

Top Post Dawg
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May 21, 2004
Location
Humboldt Co CA
TDI
Passat 1997 silver (sold after 11 years), Jetta 2000 atlantic blue
The fuel filter is due. Even if it's not the problem, it is due and might help.
 

alphaseinor

TDI Innovator, Gone but Not Forgotten
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Denton, TX
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'03 Jetta TDI 780,000 miles (totaled out), 01 Audi TT 225 Quattro 230,000 Miles (runs great!), 00 Cabreetle Beetle dash, ALH & MK4 harness Swap
Your QA housing took a dump...

you validate this is the problem if can get it to idle by loosening the QA housing and pushing it full right. when it's at idle you won't have any throttle at all...

it can also be an ECU or wiring harness.

It is probably going to be an injection pump... unless you know of someone who can swap a QA housing with you.

now... where are you exactly?
 

02BoraTDI

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Greensburg, PA
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2014 Jetta Wagon
Do i have to remove the Injector pump to replace all of the seals. I had a code in the past that my fuel temp sensor was bad but it went away when i cleared the codes. I know the temp sensor is related to the Quantity adjuster, could that be the problem? If i replace the fuel temp sensor and the seals, could that cure my 2 quantity adjuster codes or is there work i can do to the quantity adjuster? I had to get my 97's pump rebuilt after a bad bio-diesel batch once and it was 1000 in labor alone. Im not trying to put that much into it unitll i can diagnose the problem for sure. (by the way i dont run Bio in the 2002 with the problem)
 

alphaseinor

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'03 Jetta TDI 780,000 miles (totaled out), 01 Audi TT 225 Quattro 230,000 Miles (runs great!), 00 Cabreetle Beetle dash, ALH & MK4 harness Swap
this isn't a problem with seals... the electromechanical portion of your injection pump has kicked the bucket... I usually try to find injection pumps that have died, then pull the QA housing off... they are really quite hearty... if you can't go that direction, then I'm afraid you'll just have to have it replaced...

again, it could also be an ECU or a harness issue. either way it's electrical in nature...
 

02BoraTDI

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2014 Jetta Wagon
Alphasenior,


Would the QA from my 97 fit? I just want to make sure thats the problem before i go and drop some cash on the problem. Thanks for all of the help so far.
 

02BoraTDI

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Greensburg, PA
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2014 Jetta Wagon
Just talked to my mechanic. He says the Fuel Shut off is losing power when he has an electrical tester on it, and then the car shuts off. Looks like it is an ECU problem. Does this sound right? Any idea where i can get teh ECU tested? Any idea on a replacement price for newe or used?
 

02BoraTDI

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2014 Jetta Wagon
He has experience with TDI's but mostly older ones that dont have all the electronics. He only works on VW's. His code scanning equipment is old so i took a laptop over myself and ran the codes, and got what i mentioned above. He is going to check the 109 relay and then pull the ECU so i can take it to another guy who has REVOTEC equipmant to chech the ECU out to see if thats the problem. Biggest problem is me not wanting to throw money at it unitl i know for sure wht we are looking at.
 

rdkern

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 21, 2004
Location
Humboldt Co CA
TDI
Passat 1997 silver (sold after 11 years), Jetta 2000 atlantic blue
02BoraTDI said:
Biggest problem is me not wanting to throw money at it unitl i know for sure wht we are looking at.
There goes any potential getting a job with a dealer!. Diagnose first? Oh come on!
 

alphaseinor

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'03 Jetta TDI 780,000 miles (totaled out), 01 Audi TT 225 Quattro 230,000 Miles (runs great!), 00 Cabreetle Beetle dash, ALH & MK4 harness Swap
Did you perform the test I asked you?

the QA housing from the 97 should work, but the connectors are different.
 

MayorDJQ

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'10 Golf 2dr 6m, sold.
How long does it take for the voltage to disappear? Maybe someone can corroborate this, but if the ECU sees a no-start, it cuts power to the fuel solenoid.
 

02BoraTDI

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Greensburg, PA
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2014 Jetta Wagon
didnt do the test on the qa housing yet. Is is just the 4 bolts on the front of the injector that ahs the big wire coming out? Is there a picture that someone can post so i am sure to doi the right thing. It would also make sense if the ecu shut it down as to why it would have power at first then lose it. Is it possible for the antitheft shutdown not to throw the key symbol on the dash?

Help quick, my 84 BMW loves to suck gas.
 

MayorDJQ

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'10 Golf 2dr 6m, sold.
Maybe try hot wiring the solenoid and see if the car runs longer. Some people have used a regular 9volt battery in a pinch to get home.
 

02BoraTDI

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Greensburg, PA
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2014 Jetta Wagon


Is the Quantity adjuster to the right of the temp sensor, and is it just the 3 screws holding it on? Is it available anywhere besides the stealership? It would make sense to do the temp sensor while i have the top cracked open.

Thanks to whoever i stole this pic from on another post.
 

02BoraTDI

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Location
Greensburg, PA
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2014 Jetta Wagon
eliminating more possibilities

MayorDJQ said:
Maybe try hot wiring the solenoid and see if the car runs longer. Some people have used a regular 9volt battery in a pinch to get home.
Need some advise and knowledge......

I did some testing today since i got back from a work trip and found that the fuel shut off solenoid gets no power when the key is turned and when cranking it only gets around 3v compared to 12v when i tested the same on my 1997. Tried hot wiring it like you suggested and it started (super high RPM, so i pulled the hot wire i rigged). I also swapped the 109 relay with the one from my 1997, and eliminated that as a problem. I am thinking it is the ECU now that i have eliminated alot of possible problems. Your thoughts? I want to try to order an ECU ASAP if that could be the issue. I am also waiting on the Metalnerd tool to take the injector pump top off, so i can do the QA test Alphasenior suggested, but i need more instructions on how to do that.

Thanks
 

MayorDJQ

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Location
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'10 Golf 2dr 6m, sold.
I dunno, given the codes and the symptoms, it sounds like a compound issue.

Try tracing the shut off solenoid wiring back to the ECU. Maybe a mouse got in there and chewed on it, it might explain the solenoid short code. But if the solenoid is bad, I wouldn't think it would affect the idle speed....that may be the QA portion of the problem. Have you done the test that Alphaseinor mentioned?
 

02BoraTDI

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Greensburg, PA
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2014 Jetta Wagon
MayorDJQ said:
I dunno, given the codes and the symptoms, it sounds like a compound issue.

Try tracing the shut off solenoid wiring back to the ECU. Maybe a mouse got in there and chewed on it, it might explain the solenoid short code. But if the solenoid is bad, I wouldn't think it would affect the idle speed....that may be the QA portion of the problem. Have you done the test that Alphaseinor mentioned?

Wiring looked good, i need more info on how to do the test Alphasenior talked about. I could swap the shut off sensor from my 1997 to eliminate that as a problem as well. Is there a picture of what the QA looks like. I tried to put one in a message a few posts back but it didnt show up. Any help is appreciated.
 

02BoraTDI

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2014 Jetta Wagon
still need help

how do i remove the wire on the bottom of the injector pump that connects to the QA without removing the pump? Im sending the QA to portland to get tested.

Add a flashing glow plug light to my list of symptoms on my first post. This car is screwed up.
 

02BoraTDI

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Greensburg, PA
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2014 Jetta Wagon
Canadian_Grizzly said:
A flakey ground connection can cause weird electrical problems...have they been cleaned lately?


cleaned the connections. My VW mechanic told me to take it to another mechanic, he had no idea what was wrong. I think i have it narrowed down to the quantity adjuster. I slid it full right and the car still would not run. Starts, then stops after 3 seconds. Vag still shows the same codes i originally listed. EGR valve is moving fine. No noticible bad wires. Pump moves fuel to the injectors when i crank it. no leaks anywhere, ECU was tested and all parameters read fine. Glow plug light flashes, no brake lights out,

Is there any other thing it could be???
 

02BoraTDI

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Greensburg, PA
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2014 Jetta Wagon
Still need some advice. Just a newbie loking for some advice other than replace the whole pump, or take it to the dealership.
 

02BoraTDI

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Greensburg, PA
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2014 Jetta Wagon
BUmp to the top

Believe it or not, this car has been to 5 mechanics and still no luck. Has not ran since September. Last mechanic was able to get it to start and then run at idle speed but no throtle response. Still smoking like a crack fiend when it starts. Maybe ill just sell it, what would a 2002 with a R-title (hit in front and rolled onto side, excellent repiar , nobody can tell where it was fixed) and 60 K go for not running. Women driven all highway miles, new tires all around, Black with power everything. Sharp car. Just a feeler in case i cant get it fixed.
 

02BoraTDI

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Greensburg, PA
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2014 Jetta Wagon
no immobilizer codes. (i guess you mean the immobilizer that deals with the key) Brake lights all check are working fine as well, i guess there is a issue that comes up with a brake switch that causes a similar problem. Pump moves fuel fine, i cracked open all of the lines and it squirts like crazy so the pump is fine. I am still thinking that it might be the QA even though it was tested and the pump shop said it was fine. I have no throttle and it smoles like crazy. Any thoughts?
 
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