Tuner thinks something is wrong after trying 3.5 tune
- Thread starter MÄDDNESSS
- Start date
The tube (flex) plastic pipe that is behind the MAF to the turbo inlet,check see if there is any cracks or holes in it ,pulling in air that's unmetered.
DPM
Top Post Dawg
What kind of cams and drive are we talking about here- is there any chance either lobes or hubs could have shifted even if the marks are lining up?
Just stock, OEM, cams. Its all one piece. I had a machine shop check it, came back true. The lobes cant move without the whole shaft moving.
We used the timing belt tool pins to make sure everything was on point when we did the timing belt.
The on difference between them is that the exhaust cam that originally came on my car had a lash gear and the new exhaust cam that came with the head, does not.
The only reason for this that people speculated was that it easier and cheaper for VW to manufacture the cam without the lash gear.
I opted to use the old cam because of the lash gear. And this tool, http://techprotools.ca/index.php?ma...ucts_id=1854&zenid=7d7r6mh9nrmh8phijtv3oruab4 was about $760 after shipping and taxes. Its got the little lash gear tool to line the teeth up. Since I bought it, I wanted to use it.
We used the timing belt tool pins to make sure everything was on point when we did the timing belt.
The on difference between them is that the exhaust cam that originally came on my car had a lash gear and the new exhaust cam that came with the head, does not.
The only reason for this that people speculated was that it easier and cheaper for VW to manufacture the cam without the lash gear.
I opted to use the old cam because of the lash gear. And this tool, http://techprotools.ca/index.php?ma...ucts_id=1854&zenid=7d7r6mh9nrmh8phijtv3oruab4 was about $760 after shipping and taxes. Its got the little lash gear tool to line the teeth up. Since I bought it, I wanted to use it.
Last edited:
Could the higher MAF reading, 460 as appose to the spec'd 200-350, be because of the emission deletes?
The engine normally gets "air" from the EGR system, thus decreasing the amount of air coming in through the MAF. So if its all deleted, more air should be pulled through the MAF, right?
But that wouldnt account for why im get 100 or so less than other tuned cars with deletes.
The engine normally gets "air" from the EGR system, thus decreasing the amount of air coming in through the MAF. So if its all deleted, more air should be pulled through the MAF, right?
But that wouldnt account for why im get 100 or so less than other tuned cars with deletes.
Last edited:
named tintin
Veteran Member
What if you install back the exht cam that originally came with your head, or use both the old cam?
named tintin
Veteran Member
Just asking, if it's identical in every aspect, this is not the problem. Is the gear mesch is putting the cam in an identical position/timing?
I just suspect that because of your maf reading.
There's really nothing in the tune that cam be problematic at this point, this is just more fuel & boost, nothing more, so....
Is the turbo have been opened or reworked?
If I could, I'll send you a ''smart deleted'' tune tu rule out the electircal part of the actuator, but....
That's the problem when there is too much unnecessarie DTC code deleted, when a problem like this happens, there's no more DTC to point you in the right direction.
I just suspect that because of your maf reading.
There's really nothing in the tune that cam be problematic at this point, this is just more fuel & boost, nothing more, so....
Is the turbo have been opened or reworked?
If I could, I'll send you a ''smart deleted'' tune tu rule out the electircal part of the actuator, but....
That's the problem when there is too much unnecessarie DTC code deleted, when a problem like this happens, there's no more DTC to point you in the right direction.
AARodriguez Corp.
TDIClub Enthusiast, Vendor , w/Business number
That's actually a great direction to go in, re-activate all the DTCs and see if something unusual was hidden. If you get a Flashzilla you can do that with the stock tune option.
Yes, we spent a great of time inspecting the cams. The TDC is the same. On the exhaust cams, have a key way for the timing belt pulley. The intake cams have a key way, that only fits 1 way onto the vacuum pump. The tool I shared a link to, has all the fittings for CR engines on that jig and both sets of cams fit the same way. If either were even 1 tooth off, the jig would not sit flush with itself. I can use the extra set of cams to prove this.
I was thinking that maybe my MAP sensor has gone bad. I was told that after 165k miles it would not be out of the ordinary for MAP sensor to have run its course.
The CR170 is new. Atleast thats what Andrew told me when I bought it. The shaft had more play in it than my OE cr140 does. He assured me that it would tighten up after it got some oil in it. It was primed very well as I had a starting issue (air bubble in the fuel line) but before it finally came to life, I had drained a brand new OEM battery. Well over a minute of priming. All the while checking the oil level as it did drip due to filling the various oil galleys. I have since checked the shafted play multiple times as I have dove back into the intake track a few times trying to diagnose this issue. It still has the same amount of shaft play. The blades still touch the wall but just so. It does spin freely and I do not burn oil.
According to VCDS and everything I've found on the forums, the actuator is operating just as it should. According to Andrew, vacuum is on point. The duty cycle is the same as 2 other JSW TDIs Ive checked that are local to me.
I was thinking that maybe my MAP sensor has gone bad. I was told that after 165k miles it would not be out of the ordinary for MAP sensor to have run its course.
The CR170 is new. Atleast thats what Andrew told me when I bought it. The shaft had more play in it than my OE cr140 does. He assured me that it would tighten up after it got some oil in it. It was primed very well as I had a starting issue (air bubble in the fuel line) but before it finally came to life, I had drained a brand new OEM battery. Well over a minute of priming. All the while checking the oil level as it did drip due to filling the various oil galleys. I have since checked the shafted play multiple times as I have dove back into the intake track a few times trying to diagnose this issue. It still has the same amount of shaft play. The blades still touch the wall but just so. It does spin freely and I do not burn oil.
According to VCDS and everything I've found on the forums, the actuator is operating just as it should. According to Andrew, vacuum is on point. The duty cycle is the same as 2 other JSW TDIs Ive checked that are local to me.
AARodriguez Corp.
TDIClub Enthusiast, Vendor , w/Business number
Stop thinking and listening to the peanut gallery, last time it caused you to have to buy an expensive tool so you could put your new head together with old parts. Go find a professional to work on your car.
You picked the turbo up from our warehouse in person, brand new in the box with original packing material and manufacture documentation. Every single new VNT turbo has a shaft that is loose when dry, they all tighten up when oil is put through them.It's not going to stay spinning freely if you keep trying to make the turbine touch the wall. The turbo doesn't have a problem, you reach peak boost, just not as fast as you're supposed to.
Don't give me credit for checking your vacuum stuff, I didn't check any of your results despite you houding me...you burned up the last of your good will when I had to keep arguing with you about the 3 bar map sensor being insufficient.
That's brilliant, everyone, make a note, the 3 bar map sensor is only capable of reading 26 psiMÄDDNESSS said:
To eliminate confusion, a 3 bar map sensor is good for 29 PSI, after that you need a 4 bar.
Last edited:
Wow, 32psi eh? That must kick pretty good
Yes indeed,lots of time from Malone and it's perfect.This MADDNess guy has some troubles after reading it seems like he has a problem no one has ever had before.Although he said that he has double checked everything it may be worth it to bring it to another shop have it checked.Send some logs out and see if there is something another tuner can pick up on ??Wow, 32psi eh? That must kick pretty good
I'll let the other Malone distributors that gave me that info you think they are the "Peanut Gallery".
I didnt buy it to put my new head together with old cams. Rich and I would have needed it to put the new cams back in too. The cams had to come out to install the ARP head studs.
Yes I did pick it up for your warehouse when you had that sale for the free stage 3 tune upgrade which you aren't going to honor now. This one hasnt tighten up with oil in it.
I dont have to make it, it touches the wall without any more pressure than it took before the turbo went in.
You didnt watch the videos I posted on fb but you commented on it? Ok.
Again, after we talked about it, I understood why the requested boost wasnt the issue. I said, "oh, I see."
I was told by another Malone distributor that its only capable of 26-28 but in that post was a little confusiin on my part. I mixed 2 9BARs with 29psi.That's brilliant, everyone, make a note, the 3 bar map sensor is only capable of reading 26 psi
To eliminate confusion, a 3 bar map sensor is good for 29 PSI, after that you need a 4 bar.
Since AARodiguez isnt honoring his "buy a cr170 and get a free stage 3 upgrade" sale, I wont be taking any business to him or recommending him to anybody.
I didn't expect this thread to go the direction that it has. I'm thinking that AARodriguez needs to make things right to save face. In this day in age with social media one very public bad customer experience can sour business permanently.
I have a feeling both of you guys are on different sides of the state and really need to somehow or someway meet in the middle.
So sell him a 4 bar sensor and move on.AARodriguez said:
I have a feeling both of you guys are on different sides of the state and really need to somehow or someway meet in the middle.
AARodriguez Corp.
TDIClub Enthusiast, Vendor , w/Business number
He doesn't need or want a 4 bar map sensor, he wants a car that works correctly. The map sensor isn't going to fix his problem.
I really don't know why you would think I need to save face? He has a car with a physical problem that needs to be found and fixed.
The kid is a delusional or pathological liar... quote from a few pages back.
@Richard55....how many times has Madness asked if you wanted to smoke a bowl of weed with him?
Last edited:
AARodriguez Corp.
TDIClub Enthusiast, Vendor , w/Business number
I already installed it once and then you asked me to put the Stage 2 on, I was willing to install the 3.5 again before you left but I did advise that to be a bad idea with not knowing what the issue with your car was.
What part of this was confusing to you? I have no obligation to personally install the file on your car while you watch, less than 10% of our customers get their tune updates done in person at our shop.
Last edited:
How about because you've done nothing positive on my thread. All you've done is instigate arguement after arguement and start a smear campaign against me, when I never once mentioned you in this thread prior to you commenting.
The only person lying here is you.
You lied about me doing this work alone again and again. You lied about the coolant leak being my fault when it was you and your "free" labor that last touched on that.
How many times have I said Im gonna kill my dog if he chews up another xbox cord?
How many times have I suggested we get hookers and cocain for the weekend?
How many times have I suggested we knock over a bank to fund our car addiction.
How many times have either seen me high or drunk, or smelled it on me or seen any at my house?
Last edited:
To be clear, its not just because you havent been able to suggest a test that pinpoints the problem but rather because NOBODY has been able to suggest a test that pinpoints the problem.
Last edited:
AARodriguez Corp.
TDIClub Enthusiast, Vendor , w/Business number
This is my last reply and a spectacular one to finish on.
It's not our responsibility nor job to resolve this problem for you.Your car has had a major overhaul, tons of things have been changed. I'm not your mechanic, I'm the guy who was going to sell you a tune update but your car didn't perform as expected and you've tried to drag me into being responsible for fixing it.
If you think the turbo is at fault, pull it, mail it to us or have a 3rd party bring it to our shops. We will have Borg Warner do a warranty inspection.
The tune isn't at fault, we ruled that out but I do think it's a great idea to get a Flashzilla and put the stock tune on to bring back all DTCs.
I hope you get your car fixed, the Stage 3 upgrade file will always be available to you for free until VW does their emissions fix.
brutekiller787
Member
i agree, having spoke with andrew through email a lot, haven't bought a tune from him yet (i haven't forgot, andrew), but he is more than knowledgeable on the topic, and from reading through this thread, i am guessing there is a mechanical problem.
i work at a ford dealership, i know apples to oranges, but 95% of the time when an ecoboost comes in with "map sensor range performance" and they have a tune or something on it, it's not the tune they put on. if it is requesting peak boost properly, and actual measure boost pressure is not following as it should, there is a mechanical problem, diagnosis, as far as i'm concerned, stops there. then it's getting into turbo actuators, timing, etc.
sometimes the best way is to take it all apart again. that's what i did with both my 01 volvo and 88 celica alltrac, and both times i found major effect/minor cause causes to not start, like sensors not plugged in or spark plug wires mixed. fresh eyes never hurt anyone
i work at a ford dealership, i know apples to oranges, but 95% of the time when an ecoboost comes in with "map sensor range performance" and they have a tune or something on it, it's not the tune they put on. if it is requesting peak boost properly, and actual measure boost pressure is not following as it should, there is a mechanical problem, diagnosis, as far as i'm concerned, stops there. then it's getting into turbo actuators, timing, etc.
sometimes the best way is to take it all apart again. that's what i did with both my 01 volvo and 88 celica alltrac, and both times i found major effect/minor cause causes to not start, like sensors not plugged in or spark plug wires mixed. fresh eyes never hurt anyone
turbobrick240
Top Post Dawg
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2014
- Location
- maine
- TDI
- 2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
Nailed it. Madness shouldn't be trying to blame you or hold you responsible for his mistakes. Hopefully he can resolve his issue and share the solution w/ us. The blame shifting and petty bickering is counterproductive.
Bout time.
I didn't ask for you to come in here in the 1st place because your suggestions weren't working.
I never said it was anybodies job or responsibility to solve this issue. I brought this problem to the forum because that what we do. Thats part of why forums exist. We have an issue we can solve so we go to the forums. That doesn't mean we all this its every other members job to fix the problem we are having.
My car never performed as expected even with the stage 2 "custom" tune, it fell short of advertised stage 2 numbers.
I have not tried to drag you into fixing it. Again, I never mentioned you prior to you commenting. Ive never said you had to fix it. I never slandered you or your shop as a result of your suggestions not helping me.
I never said the turbo may be the problem. Tintin asked about it and put out as much info as I had on it. If you'd read the whole post, at the end, I also said, "It does spin freely and I do not burn oil." I said that because I dont believe it to be the source of the problem.
All of your input on here has been you just twisting what I'm saying to try to discredit me. You've spent more time in replying to responses on here than you have to my 20 emails. All but 1 of your emails being only 1 or 2 sentances.
Alisha told me the tune would be free even if VW did their emission fix. He said there would only be a $100 labor to re-upload my tune. He recommended I waited till VW had done their fix because it was only going to be a couple months and it would save me $100.
Complains about me being counter productive. While replying to a counter productive post, while being counter productive.
Where did I say my problem is his fault?
turbobrick240
Top Post Dawg
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2014
- Location
- maine
- TDI
- 2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
I can see why Andrew doesn't want you in his shop ever again. Why not just man up and admit that you royally screwed the pooch on the hardware install? Just pay a real mechanic to fix it for you.
So keep makin counter productive posts.
You, nor anybody else can prove I messed up. Im not say that I didn't but unless any of you want to pay for the nearly grand in gaskets and seals without any proof there is something mechanically wrong with my car, y'all can cram it.
If you dont have more suggestions to diagnose and pinpoint the problem, shoo.
You, nor anybody else can prove I messed up. Im not say that I didn't but unless any of you want to pay for the nearly grand in gaskets and seals without any proof there is something mechanically wrong with my car, y'all can cram it.
If you dont have more suggestions to diagnose and pinpoint the problem, shoo.