B5.5 smoking?

bypass-21

Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2020
Location
NYC
TDI
2004 Passat TDI
Hey everyone! So I have been a long time VW/Škoda owner (though they have all been petrol variants) . I recently got my hands on my first TDI, and a barn find at that! The mileage is a bit high (160k) but other then that the interior is immaculate as well as it has all the original literature. Now I picked it up with a blown transmission and I know I'm going to have to hunt around for a GMR autobox somewhere,but the other issue I found is that it smokes when it runs as well as when the accelerator is depressed, plus the exhaust smells absolutely noxious morr so then its supposed to( like a diesel truck?) The engine starts like a gem, with no lag or hesitation and acceleration is smooth and if I rev enough, I can feel boost come on. I think there was only one time where it was RPM hunting. There are no faults stored when I checked it and the oil is exactly where is should be. The car has been sitting for 5 years unmoved before I got to checking it out and trying to restore it, I was wondering if that could have something to do with it? I have 3 videos I made with the car cold and hot which I will try to upload.
Any information is greatly appreciated!
 
Last edited:

Mozambiquer

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Mar 21, 2015
Location
Versailles Missouri
TDI
2004 VW Touareg V10 TDI, 2012 Audi Q7 V6 TDI, 1998 VW Jetta TDI. 1982 VW Rabbit pickup, 2001 VW Jetta TDI, 2005 VW Passat wagon TDI X3, 2001 VW golf TDI, 1980 VW rabbit pickup,
What color smoke?

Sent from my S60 using Tapatalk
 

bypass-21

Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2020
Location
NYC
TDI
2004 Passat TDI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZeEIXYU3efQ

Here it is right after a cold start

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kf3WEo9RMf4

Here it as warming up

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g02TmXVg2-4

And that one is operating temp.

I noticed too recently that it doesn't always smoke, as strange as that may sound. I noticed the smoke is more heavier on some days and on others it is not even there, thought the exhaust stink is always there. Im really stumped as to what it could be.

Thanks again everyone
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
If it has been sitting for five years, it may have all sorts of issues that could cause that.

Injector health.

Piston rings.

Turbocharger.

If it runs OK otherwise, what I would do first is the cheap and easy stuff. Fresh tank of fuel with some pour in fuel system cleaner, we use the BG 245 stuff here, and an oil change with some crankcase cleaner, again we use a BG Compression Restoration product here. There are other brands that would work, too. Give that a shot and see if it gets any better.
 

bypass-21

Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2020
Location
NYC
TDI
2004 Passat TDI
If it has been sitting for five years, it may have all sorts of issues that could cause that.
Injector health.
Piston rings.
Turbocharger.
If it runs OK otherwise, what I would do first is the cheap and easy stuff. Fresh tank of fuel with some pour in fuel system cleaner, we use the BG 245 stuff here, and an oil change with some crankcase cleaner, again we use a BG Compression Restoration product here. There are other brands that would work, too. Give that a shot and see if it gets any better.

Okay I'll give that a shot and post on here the results. I had a friend of mine recently chime in and say that my engine is notorious for bad EGR valves? What are the chances of that being a possibility as well?
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Okay I'll give that a shot and post on here the results. I had a friend of mine recently chime in and say that my engine is notorious for bad EGR valves? What are the chances of that being a possibility as well?

Zero. And do not listen to that friend when it comes to TDIs.
 

Smokerr

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Alaska
TDI
Passat Wagon GL,2005,Silver
I don't claim this is correct, as oilhammer has noted, a number of possible causes. But it runs well which seems to eliminate injectors.

When we got ours, AK had a really bad diesel spec due to a waiver, ie, sulfur was 500 ppm (or that was what was allowed)

Ours developed the same type smoke you are showing.

By accident I found that an additive (no longer available) would stop it. In and out of the dealer several times and of course it would not smoke when it was. I just put the additive in from time to time (I have enough to go for 300k as it was low cost and I found they were closing it out so I got 7 - also 1 oz treats 20 gallons )

My take is I believe the DOC got contaminated. The additive (multi aspect) cleans it out or back more likely.

I don't know if other additives would help. This was a Racor produict, Conditioner _. Claimed to improve fuel economy, prevents corrosion, lubricant additive (the reason I got it) stabilizes fuel (why I used it at work) , contains cetane improver.
 
Last edited:

Tom in PT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2017
Location
Twilight Zone, WA State
TDI
2005 Passat sedan - SOLD; 2013 Passat DSG; both purchased new
You mention "exhaust stink" . In my car the exhaust does not "stink" , it has a peculiar smell but it is not totally nauseating. Hard to describe. I think your smoke issue may be fuel related and as Smokerr says an additive might help. I occasionally use a little Powerservice with a shot of 2-cycle for lubrication.

If your smoke has an engine oil aroma no additive will cure that.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Having restarted many piston engines after sitting over the years, I can say one constant is that sitting doesn't do anything any good. :(
 

Smokerr

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Alaska
TDI
Passat Wagon GL,2005,Silver
The stink is the emissions system settling in. If its prolonged them its an emissions issue and likely the DOC.

Good point on the fuel, stale from sitting and muck up the DOC.

Just a caution, the DOC may not like oil additives. It was fine prior to DOC, but like a Cat, wrong stuff can poison it. IE, you con't want to run leaded fuel through a CAT.

The additive I found only needed every 4 or 5 tanks. I got some surplus ones from work as the Fuel Provider decided to treat their diesel anyway with a multi spectrum additive (and not a good idea to cross additives though like oil may be ok)
 

Smokerr

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Alaska
TDI
Passat Wagon GL,2005,Silver
Having restarted many piston engines after sitting over the years, I can say one constant is that sitting doesn't do anything any good. :(
I helped a guy start a Ford Truck that had sat for 20 years, fire right up. I about fell over. Colder climate helps a lot there.

Cycles? Sheese, sit all winter and a total pain to start in spring. I just left fuel in them and fired up when we had warmer weather.

While our fuel stays a lot better due to colder temps and low temps all winter, I did have fuel tanks at work with low turnover (long story won't go into)

As those were in 75 deg all year long, you could see the diesel turning an ugly color after a couple of years.

On the other hand, we had one gen with a base tank in contract with the ground (asphalt) and it was fine. Figured the cooling made a difference.

I had a Bronco I bought that had severe varnish in one tank. I suspect they just used the main for whatever reasons and the reserved dried up. It clearly had been kept in a garage.
 

Tom in PT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2017
Location
Twilight Zone, WA State
TDI
2005 Passat sedan - SOLD; 2013 Passat DSG; both purchased new
I have boat with large fuel tanks (800 gallons total) and it takes about 2 years to go through it. Never had a fuel problem. Some percentage of that fuel is old - many years old. But the boat sits in 45-50 degree sea water and the fuel is cool. I throw in some additives on occasion but the engine (pre-WWII era design) is not picky about fuel quality and it has no emissions systems other than a large smoke stack. Lots of smoke at a cold start but it clears up nicely when the engine comes up to temp. A smoking diesel at operating temp is NOT normal.
 

Smokerr

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Alaska
TDI
Passat Wagon GL,2005,Silver
Probably 30 years ago I was working Gen service, one of the clients had distilling plant and made their own diesel (kind of a combined contaminated oils and fuels clean up operation)

Cummins installed a 855 Gen for them and agreed it was fine on the rot gut diesel they were making. As long as it was clean Cummins was ok with it. I was pretty shocked.

While not today's system it still was unit injection (Cummins version) and worked fine.

I don't know that anything knew would last more than a few hours.
 

bypass-21

Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2020
Location
NYC
TDI
2004 Passat TDI
So finally getting around to the oil change and new diesel, i added a bottle of diesel fuel system cleaner and crank case cleaner from the local parts store. While the smoke improved a bit, its still there completely and it still stinks bad (like hurts your nose/eyes) bad. The Acceleration is still good and the car cold starts like a champ still with one turn. Im still stumped :\

Any ideas?

Thanks guys!
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Well the BG products I mentioned wouldn't have had time to work yet anyway.

You can also try a diesel purge setup. How long have you driven it down the highway? Diesels don't make enough waste heat at idle to really accomplish anything that a good heat cycle would. You need to get them under load, which means cruising down the highway for a while.
 

bypass-21

Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2020
Location
NYC
TDI
2004 Passat TDI
Well the BG products I mentioned wouldn't have had time to work yet anyway.
You can also try a diesel purge setup. How long have you driven it down the highway? Diesels don't make enough waste heat at idle to really accomplish anything that a good heat cycle would. You need to get them under load, which means cruising down the highway for a while.
What is a diesel purge set up? Driving on the high way and giving it the ol' Italian tune up, it drives excellent with no hiccups or power loss. When i get to the light off the high way though, i can see a little smoke in the background behind the car and with the windows open i can still smell the exhaust, though the hard drive or the additives i put in seems to have helped the smell a bit and made it more tolerable.
 

Tom in PT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2017
Location
Twilight Zone, WA State
TDI
2005 Passat sedan - SOLD; 2013 Passat DSG; both purchased new
How is your air filter and snow screen? (the snow screen is right before the air filter itself, can get clogged with debris such as leaves and bugs). If you have unburnt fuel smell you might not be getting sufficient air into the engine.
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Diesel purge is when you rig a setup to run the engine off of an external isolated fuel source in a can or jar (something that can tolerate heat).

On the PDs like yours, you need to either disconnect the lift pump OR loop the fuel lines together under the hood. But as long as the tandem pump on the engine is properly primed (which it is, because it runs), then you can hook up the purge and run it off that for as long as it takes to use it up (but without stalling the engine).

Read here:

http://pics.tdiclub.com/data/517/LubroMoly_Diesel_Purge_Procedure_PD-VE_TDI.pdf

That is on a Golf with a BEW engine, but the basic idea is the same. Your filter is just on a bracket on the engine instead of off on the inner fender. But the plumbing and filter and system is the same.
 

Smokerr

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2005
Location
Alaska
TDI
Passat Wagon GL,2005,Silver
Did you remove the old fuel from the tank? At this point also a new fuel filter.

New fuel will dilute what is there, but you have fuel left and how much new was added?

Its possible the DOC is contaminated to the point of no longer working or recoverable.
 

Tom in PT

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2017
Location
Twilight Zone, WA State
TDI
2005 Passat sedan - SOLD; 2013 Passat DSG; both purchased new
^

Bypass says in post 1 "The car has been sitting for 5 years unmoved before I got to checking it out and trying to restore it . . . ." That old fuel needs to be removed from the tank first before a purge or other treatment is going to do anything. And a new fuel filter too, as Smokerr says.
 

bypass-21

Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2020
Location
NYC
TDI
2004 Passat TDI
Did you remove the old fuel from the tank? At this point also a new fuel filter.

New fuel will dilute what is there, but you have fuel left and how much new was added?

Its possible the DOC is contaminated to the point of no longer working or recoverable.

No, i didnt. The tank of the car when i got it was about half full with old diesel and i filled it up the rest of the way with new diesel. What are the usual signs that the DOC is contaminated? is it usually that smell?
 

bypass-21

Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2020
Location
NYC
TDI
2004 Passat TDI
^

Bypass says in post 1 "The car has been sitting for 5 years unmoved before I got to checking it out and trying to restore it . . . ." That old fuel needs to be removed from the tank first before a purge or other treatment is going to do anything. And a new fuel filter too, as Smokerr says.

Im going to see about trying to get a new fuel filter from VW, but i was wondering how i can remove all the old fuel from the tank? I imagine by now that as i think of it, 5 years is waaay past its prime for use:D
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Unless there is something contaminated with it, a half tank of old diesel isn't going to be worth the effort to "empty". But it certainly isn't helping.

An easy way to do this is just disconnect the return hose from the fuel filter and attach a long hose and run it into a bucket and start the engine. It'll slowly empty itself.

I don't think that is your problem, though. At least not entirely. I still think it just needs to be driven for a bit (500+ miles) and it will get better.
 

bypass-21

Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2020
Location
NYC
TDI
2004 Passat TDI
Unless there is something contaminated with it, a half tank of old diesel isn't going to be worth the effort to "empty". But it certainly isn't helping.
An easy way to do this is just disconnect the return hose from the fuel filter and attach a long hose and run it into a bucket and start the engine. It'll slowly empty itself.
I don't think that is your problem, though. At least not entirely. I still think it just needs to be driven for a bit (500+ miles) and it will get better.
Makes sense, so ill probably take it on a long hard drive and give it a chance to breathe a bit. Ill probably also do the Fuel filter as well since it would be a good idea with it having sat for 5 years. Ill post an update after i clock close to 500 miles:D:D
 

bypass-21

Member
Joined
Jul 13, 2020
Location
NYC
TDI
2004 Passat TDI
Before i continue to drive it, what are the chances that the DOC can get damaged by me driving with old fuel?
 

oilhammer

Certified Volkswagen Nut & Vendor
Joined
Dec 11, 2001
Location
outside St Louis, MO
TDI
There are just too many to list....
Before i continue to drive it, what are the chances that the DOC can get damaged by me driving with old fuel?
Probably zero. If it was running bad enough for that, it probably would not be driveable. The catalyst on that car is not monitored, and chances are if you lab tested 100 BHWs that have over 50k miles on them, 90 of them would have a catalyst that is not working as well as it did when new.
 

gtrosema

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 23, 2013
Location
SC
TDI
2002 Jetta
I had one that smoked like a James Bond movie. Pulled head and pressure checked it new gasket and it still smoked. Looked like white smoke to me but my son said he saw a bluish tint. Tired of messing with it I got another engine put the original turbo in it and noticed it leaking oil. So very well could have been turbo the whole time? Have you been adding oil?
 
Top