car randomly dies then no start

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TDIGuy2011

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Molalla, Oreegone
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1996 Passat TDI
Well here is what I've got going on. VERY randomly my I will be driving car and it will act just like I turned off the key. glow plug and check engine light will flash together but really fast and broke up like morse code. Try to start the car and it turns over fine but no start. Just keep trying and eventually it will start and who knows when it will do it again. The other day it did it and I finally got it started and tried to drive it to my shop and it was in limp mode for about a mile then after sitting at a light and taking off it was out of limp mode. I always carry a 109 relay with me so I changed it and it's still doing it. Any ideas. I will get codes if any tomorrow. Thanks in advance.
 
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rdkern

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Passat 1997 silver (sold after 11 years), Jetta 2000 atlantic blue
Wild Ars Guess - crank sensor. Got codes? or morse codes? 96 may have blink-codes.
 
BleachedBora

BleachedBora

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My black Albatross MK3 (BlackenedBora) did that wayyy back when; when I finally did get it started it coughed like it was the end of the world. Tried the coolant temp sensor and a bunch of other stuff. Ended up being an ECU. Once it was replaced the problems went away.

My white MK3 also did the same thing (BleachedBora). Changed the coolant temp sensor and all was well...

YMMV, good luck!
-BB
 
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TDIGuy2011

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Molalla, Oreegone
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1996 Passat TDI
another thing I can tell is after it dies the glow plug and check engine light flash together and I can here clicking noises one is in cab passenger side left side of floor board like right behind where the cup holder is. the other is in the injection pump and another is a little "air pump" turning on and off right above and behind brake booster. I'm wondering if anybody thinks key switch.
 
BleachedBora

BleachedBora

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If that's the case then you just gotta get the thing scanned - autozone for example will do it for free. It'll probably tell us all we need to know...
-BB
 
R

rdkern

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Humboldt Co CA
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Passat 1997 silver (sold after 11 years), Jetta 2000 atlantic blue
TDIGuy2011 said:
... and it will act just like I turned off the key. glow plug and check engine light will flash together but really fast and broke up like morse code.
Click to expand...
write down the code. How many blinks?

I suspece that someone here has the info as to what those blinks mean.

If you do have OBDII, get it scanned.
 
Abacus

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Generic scanners won't since you have the black cased BK ECU (the blinking wasn't an option on the silver cased ECU), only the Vag-Com will since your ECU is OBD-D and not OBD-II.

Video the blinks if you have a smartphone and then play them back.
 
Hintertux

Hintertux

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I had a faulty fuse once that caused similar symptoms... I replaced the fuse related to ignition power I forget which one. But that was a couple of years ago no issue since.

Check your fuses.
 
dzlrunner

dzlrunner

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Reno, NV
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1997 B4 Passat Sedan
I had this happen to me last summer. I was driving down the road thru town and at 35 mph the car just died, then when i turned the key is rolled over but never started. Led me to think that the fuel shut off solenoid on the pump had quit. The next time it did it to me i got out wiggled the wire going to the solenoid on the pump and boom the car worked perfectly. I would check it, I know my dad's wagon had the same issue and it ended up being that. Any other symptoms? does the car still turn over after it dies?
 
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TDIGuy2011

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Molalla, Oreegone
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1996 Passat TDI
Sorry been on vacation but I'm back now. I had an extra 109 so I changed it out thinking that was it. it wasn't. and yes when it dies it will turn over just fine. I checked all the grounds I could find and made sure they were clean and tight. Will have to check wire going to solonoid.
 
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rdkern

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Passat 1997 silver (sold after 11 years), Jetta 2000 atlantic blue
It would be handy to get a VCDS on that machine. I saw this problem occur on a 98 NB which was the crank sensor getting flaky. I would believe a code would help determine the problem.
 
KERMA

KERMA

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there is no "blink code" on these tdi. These aren't the old "ALDL" pre- OBD1 cars from 30 years ago
 
Abacus

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KERMA said:
there is no "blink code" on these tdi. These aren't the old "ALDL" pre- OBD1 cars from 30 years ago
Click to expand...
There is on the '96 Passat with the BK ECU, which is OBD-D and not OBD-II, which is the GQ ECU.

Rather than type it all out again, here is a good description from 2006.

lugnut said:
The accelerator pedal can be used to enter a diagnostic mode of the BK series ECU. The blink code is indicated by the yellow "check engine" light or, as VW terms it, the "Malfunction Indicator Lamp" or "MIL".
Turn the ignition key to ON (not start).
Press the accelerator pedal to the floor and completely release it five times within five seconds.
Watch the yellow MIL in the cluster assembly. It will blink in a pattern of four character's length, then a brief pause, followed by a repeat of the pattern. Counting the flashes will produce a VW determined fault codes. The VW code is NOT the standardized OBD II code. A specific listing of the pre-OBD II VW codes, such as that in the Bentley manual, will be needed to decode the pattern sequence. I believe the BK code for a failed upstream cat temp sensor is 1 2 1 2, and the downstream cat sensor is 1 2 1 4.
Additional fault codes stored in the ECU, if they exist, can be obtained by again pressing the pedal to the floor and releasing it five times within five seconds. Each additional pattern will be displayed by this method in numerical order until the "no more" code (4 4 4 4, iicr) is shown.
Click to expand...
 
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KERMA

KERMA

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missed the part about it being a 96
that's a weird one if it's a BK
 
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T

TDIGuy2011

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Molalla, Oreegone
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1996 Passat TDI
Ok here is a video of some blinking it's doing...can anybody make out what it's telling me? Ok I'm not real sure how to post the video right to the post but if you click on the pic it will take you to the video.
 
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R

rdkern

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Humboldt Co CA
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Passat 1997 silver (sold after 11 years), Jetta 2000 atlantic blue
Was this taken when you were trying to start ie - that is, the starter motor was spinning?

If the engine was shaking, I'd go for a bad connection/ground.
 
T

TDIGuy2011

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Molalla, Oreegone
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1996 Passat TDI
No this is what it flashed for code it turns over fine sometimes it'll start sometimes it won't sometimes it'll run for a week sometimes it won't run for 10 seconds
 
T

TDIGuy2011

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Molalla, Oreegone
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1996 Passat TDI
ok with the help of bhutchins (thank you) We hooked my car up and there are no codes present. So anybody have any ideas what it could be killing my car?
 
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oldpoopie

oldpoopie

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Id open up the ecu and see if there is any corrosion. You could also jumper the fuel shutoff solenoid on the pump to battery + (fused of course) and see if that makes it start when its acting up.
 
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TDIGuy2011

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Molalla, Oreegone
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1996 Passat TDI
ok update time I took out the ecm and made sure everything was tip top it was. I put everything back together and when I started it the sunlight was just right It started and I could see smoke coming up through the hazard button in the steering column. So I'm guessing in all of this a contact was getting hot in the key switch and opening up the circuit.
 
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