Pay fine and fix emissions problem or buyback?

bowen47

New member
Joined
Sep 25, 2015
Location
Irvine, CA
TDI
'15 Audi A3
Ask VW / Audi for a buyback program

Hi everybody,

Please sign the petition (and share it with your peers) to help the ~500,000 owners of faulty VW / Audi cars have the option of a buyback program.

As a side note, have any of you try to contact their dealership for a buyback? If so, what did they say?

https://www.change.org/p/michaeal-horn-president-and-ceo-of-volkswagen-group-of-america-ask-volkswagen-audi-to-offer-a-no-fee-buyback-program-for-all-their-toxic-cleandiesel-cars?recruiter=391965087&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink
 

rocketboy

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 30, 2011
Location
Winnipeg, Canada
TDI
2006 Jetta HL TDI & 2014 Passat HL TDI
Or just have VW fix your current one so it can have worse fuel mileage and better emissions.

99.9% of these people did not consider the environment when purchasing a TDI.

Real concerned "environment" people take a bike, bus or electric car. not a gas or diesel....

/story
 
Last edited:

croppz

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2015
Location
Mooresville, North Carolina
TDI
2013 DSG Jetta TDI
Why? They aren't going to give you what you paid for on your Audi to take it back.

Stop being hasty and wait to see what happens with the situation. Knee jerkers
 

Jetmobile

Member
Joined
Sep 25, 2015
Location
Ontario
TDI
2015 Jetta
There are certainly a lot of variables to consider. A buy-back, after having read more of this tread, seems to make virtually no sense unless there is no other solution.

However, if VW does create a fix, would it be a mandatory requirement? How would all that even work? Also. A few people have said it may not be fixable. So what?
 

Jmartz

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 21, 2014
Location
New Jersey
TDI
2015 Golf SEL
All I can say is I drive my car to Vermont with 4 bikes. 2 on a roof rack and 2 on a hitch rack. I can get 400 miles and still have a quarter of a tank of gas even with all those bikes on the car going 65-70 miles per hour. If they do a software upgrade and I have to fill up before I arrive to my destination next summer its going to be a little annoying. In my JEEP I was running on fumes when I would arrive to the same destination and had a tank that was double the size... I went with the TDI because I wanted the economy. 45 MPG is double what my Jeep got... if I loose 10 MPG then I should have just bought the gas model... lets hope this doesn't happen!!
 

ChemMan

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2015
Location
Earth
TDI
2011 Volkswagen Jetta SportWagen TDI
All I can say is I drive my car to Vermont with 4 bikes. 2 on a roof rack and 2 on a hitch rack. I can get 400 miles and still have a quarter of a tank of gas even with all those bikes on the car going 65-70 miles per hour. If they do a software upgrade and I have to fill up before I arrive to my destination next summer its going to be a little annoying. In my JEEP I was running on fumes when I would arrive to the same destination and had a tank that was double the size... I went with the TDI because I wanted the economy. 45 MPG is double what my Jeep got... if I loose 10 MPG then I should have just bought the gas model... lets hope this doesn't happen!!
I can't see anyone losing 20% fuel economy. I was reading some on SCR and it looks like fuel economy cost is like 1% to 3%. Now if they have to retrofit something after the fact is might be worse but I would lean closer to 2% than 20%.
 

edwinstar100

Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2015
Location
Gibsons Canada
TDI
2015 Golf TDI
I have just written the dealer and told them I was considering suspending my car payments until I am assured that the car I was sold is the car I end up with in terms of mileage and performance, or compensated for the loss in re-sale. I owe more than it is worth at the moment. I really don't expect the dealer to respond as financing is through VW. I guess I will wake up one morning and the car won't be there. Really bummed about this. E-star
 

Jmartz

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 21, 2014
Location
New Jersey
TDI
2015 Golf SEL
I can't see anyone losing 20% fuel economy. I was reading some on SCR and it looks like fuel economy cost is like 1% to 3%. Now if they have to retrofit something after the fact is might be worse but I would lean closer to 2% than 20%.
I just hope I don't notice it... whatever the fix is I hope it doesn't change anything. I like this golf A LOT. I really REALLY REALLY like the car just the way it is... I don't want to get a new car or deal with a buy back, I am happy.. I just shake my head when the same government that just "accidentally" dumped hundred of millions of gallons of polluted sludge into the Colorado river over the summer and did nothing to punish itself is going after a car maker... I guess they have to look like they are being proactive. This has been going on for YEARS and last I checked we are all still alive.
 

Jmartz

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 21, 2014
Location
New Jersey
TDI
2015 Golf SEL
I have just written the dealer and told them I was considering suspending my car payments until I am assured that the car I was sold is the car I end up with in terms of mileage and performance, or compensated for the loss in re-sale. I owe more than it is worth at the moment. I really don't expect the dealer to respond as financing is through VW. I guess I will wake up one morning and the car won't be there. Really bummed about this. E-star
Just remember credit agencies don't care about you or what your reasoning is for not making the payments. If you're willing to trash your credit over this... then go for it but good luck buying another car with a 600 credit score... or less!
 

pparks1

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Westland, Michigan
TDI
2013 Passat TDI SE
Seems that folks here are posting about buybacks based on what they'd like to see happen with their own situation...car value, loan outstanding, etc. That's like pricing your house for sale based on what you owe and how much cash you want out of it instead of its market value.
True, but then again you probably aren't talking about a house that was sold to you under false pretense either. For example, if you bought a house that had a bad foundation and it was covered up, you likely would stand to get more out of it.

I'd really have to get a fabulous deal to want a buy back. Like I said earlier, I am 1/2 way through payments and i want to be done with payments soon, not starting over at square 1. Then, I have the stuff that I have added to this car like the husky floormats, my tinted windows and my winter tires and wheels. A trade incentive isn't that much of an incentive as I'm unlikely at this point to do another VW. And even if they fix my car, I'd be worried about possible problems with the emissions system and future repairs. I'm already concerned just because it's a VW, add to that a diesel, and add to that one under this scandal. It's hard sometimes to sleep at night.
 

tadawson

Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 14, 2013
Location
Lewisville, TX
TDI
2013 Passat TDI SEL, 2015 Passat TDI SEL
Or, they would cover it under warranty, just like here, nobody would get butthurt, and nobody would stick thier paw out to collect for imaginary damages . . .

- Tim
 

IndigoBlueWagon

TDIClub Enthusiast, Principal IDParts, Vendor , w/
Joined
Aug 16, 2004
Location
South of Boston
TDI
'97 Passat, '99.5 Golf, '02 Jetta Wagon, '15 GSW
True, but then again you probably aren't talking about a house that was sold to you under false pretense either. For example, if you bought a house that had a bad foundation and it was covered up, you likely would stand to get more out of it.
People who bought houses in 2006 or 2007 expecting values to continue to rise as they had in the preceding 5 years might feel they bought under false pretenses. That's why we still have a record number of homeowners who owe more than their houses are worth.

This reminds me of a line from It's a Wonderful life." "Potter's not selling, he's buying! He's buying because we're panicking and he's not." Ride this out for 6-12 months and see where we are then. Let cooler heads prevail.
 

pparks1

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 13, 2013
Location
Westland, Michigan
TDI
2013 Passat TDI SE
People who bought houses in 2006 or 2007 expecting values to continue to rise as they had in the preceding 5 years might feel they bought under false pretenses. That's why we still have a record number of homeowners who owe more than their houses are worth.

This reminds me of a line from It's a Wonderful life." "Potter's not selling, he's buying! He's buying because we're panicking and he's not." Ride this out for 6-12 months and see where we are then. Let cooler heads prevail.
I bought my house in 2000 when the market was booming. Around 2008, we tried to sell to get our daughter into a better school district. We found our value, because of foreclosures was only about 30% of what we paid. We ended up staying and got into a charter school. I am down to about 1 year left on my mortgage. My value is still only about 60% of what we paid.

But there was never a guarantee. Houses don't always go up. You hope they will.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk
 

tjsadler

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 15, 2013
Location
California, USA
TDI
2014 Passat TDI SE 6m
For all of you comparing this to the housing market, you are WAY off base. This is not market conditions adjusting naturally. This is the result of deliberate fraud by VW. The only way to compare it to housing is if a bunch of different builders were selling houses in different parts of town. We all bought houses from one of them because the houses were priced well and had nice styling and we were told that they were built with a new technology that made them "greener" and more energy efficient. "Your heating and cooling costs will be better than any of the other builders!" they said. Now we find out that they were knowingly and illegally dumping toxic waste on our lots and then building the houses on top of it. Now our houses are worth almost nothing while everyone else's houses are still at their normal value.

That is also the difference in this and all the other recalls in recent years. VW deliberately and knowingly defrauded everyone involved. The people saying "Oh, it's fine! I don't like the EPA or the government anyway! I'm keeping my VW and not fixing it and I don't want any compensation or fix!" are ridiculous in my opinion but that's fine. It's a free country and you can think and do what you like. That's why VW will likely offer several options to try to keep unhappy customers off their backs.
 

newbeetleman

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 13, 2004
Location
NE
TDI
none
For all of you comparing this to the housing market, you are WAY off base. This is not market conditions adjusting naturally. This is the result of deliberate fraud by VW. The only way to compare it to housing is if a bunch of different builders were selling houses in different parts of town. We all bought houses from one of them because the houses were priced well and had nice styling and we were told that they were built with a new technology that made them "greener" and more energy efficient. "Your heating and cooling costs will be better than any of the other builders!" they said. Now we find out that they were knowingly and illegally dumping toxic waste on our lots and then building the houses on top of it. Now our houses are worth almost nothing while everyone else's houses are still at their normal value.

That is also the difference in this and all the other recalls in recent years. VW deliberately and knowingly defrauded everyone involved. The people saying "Oh, it's fine! I don't like the EPA or the government anyway! I'm keeping my VW and not fixing it and I don't want any compensation or fix!" are ridiculous in my opinion but that's fine. It's a free country and you can think and do what you like. That's why VW will likely offer several options to try to keep unhappy customers off their backs.

agreed, that is why I told them the only option is to fix this without losing any reliability and mpg. I would consider trading in for a car of equal or GREATER value, and given a guaranteed value for my car. Otherwise, I will have no option but to seek compensation through the courts.
 

roostre

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 2, 2012
Location
Puget Sound, WA
TDI
2012 Golf TDI DSG

newbeetleman

Veteran Member
Joined
Jan 13, 2004
Location
NE
TDI
none
Reading the referenced Hyundai article reminded me how VW handled the HPFP issue in a way that did not affect reliability.

They extended the HPFP warranty for some vehicles if certain conditions were met.

yeah, what I think, and what they do, are totally different things for sure. :)

HPFP is a clear indicator that they will probably do the cheapest option instead of doing an actual recall to fix it properly.
 

peterinvan

Member
Joined
Aug 27, 2006
Location
Vancouver, BC
TDI
2011 Sportswagen TDI, 2006 Jetta TDI - DSG
Hi everybody,
.......
As a side note, have any of you try to contact their dealership for a buyback? If so, what did they say?
I got a trade in quote from my dealer yesterday:

2011 Golf Sportswagon TDI Comfortline (DSG), 64,000 km (40,000 miles).
Cost new $34,000 (CDN)
Trade in offer $15,000.



The recall has been announced this morning, but no details of the fix yet. German government has given VW a deadline for detailed plan: Oct. 7th

I believe that a software only fix will reduce power, resulting in a safety situation during highway overtaking. :mad:

At a minimum I would expect the throttle kickdown to give me the power I am used to.
 
Last edited:

n1das

TDIClub Enthusiast, Veteran Member
Joined
Jun 11, 2002
Location
Nashua, NH, USA
TDI
2014 BMW 535xd ///M-Sport, 2012 BMW X5 Xdrive35d, former 3x TDI owner
Or just have VW fix your current one so it can have worse fuel mileage and better emissions.

99.9% of these people did not consider the environment when purchasing a TDI.

Real concerned "environment" people take a bike, bus or electric car. not a gas or diesel....

/story
Or you could just keep driving your TDI as is and get the most out of it. When I sold my 2002 Golf TDI in 2010 at only 361k miles on the ODO, it was still way too early to tell how much life was still left in it.

Although it may seem counter-intuitive, I actually DID consider the environment when I bought my TDIs. I specifically chose DIESEL as the more environmentally friendly alternative to gasoline or gasser-hybrids or EV. It was based on RESEARCH and not on a car manufacturer's propaganda. While NOx emissions have always been a challenge for diesels, emissions from the CR TDIs in all of the other categories of regulated emissions are significantly LOWER than most same model year gassers. TDI emissions are well under those limits and by one or more orders of magnitude whereas a lot of DI gassers are only marginally under the limits in all categories. Aside from NOx being out of spec, TDIs are still very clean cars. Nobody wants to talk about this and the media certainly doesn't. Instead the media puts their spin on things with misinformation and knee-jerk assumptions because that stuff gets ratings. Lots of FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt) gets spread around.

I have owned 3 TDIs over the past 13 years (02 Golf, 05 PD Jetta Wagen, 10 JSW) and the last 2 of those years have been with BMW diesels. I also had an 08 Ford F350 SuperDuty truck for a while and with the 6.4L PowerStroke Diesel. I have logged more than 1.2M miles in diesel vehicles since getting my first TDI in 2002. There is absolutely no way I'm ever going back to gasoline again if I can help it.

I say keep your TDIs and keep driving them and you decide whether to get VW's "fix" applied to your TDI when it becomes available.
 
Last edited:

dieselgrandad

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2002
Location
Fond du Lac, WI
TDI
1997 Silver B4 Passat
Ride this out for 6-12 months and see where we are then. Let cooler heads prevail.
NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! :mad: Don't listen to IBW!
PANIC! Everyone should panic! Get rid of your cars and flood the market, soon!
(I am back in the market after an 18 year hiatus and was looking at leftover TDI SportWagens - but I be just as happy with a low-mileage one if I could get it at a firesale price)
Silliness aside, IBW's right. Take a deep breath, relax, and have a beer.
Here's a question for all you panicked owners: "What did the EPA estimate on the window sticker say as far as mileage?"
 

dieselgrandad

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2002
Location
Fond du Lac, WI
TDI
1997 Silver B4 Passat
Hey, DGD, good to see you back. B4 still around?
Yeah, wannit?


BTW I never did get around to installing that bug deflector. Do you still take returns after 6 years?? ;) :D


OABTW quit giving the noobs good advice will ya? You're screwing up my plans on cornering the market. :D
 
Last edited:

IndigoBlueWagon

TDIClub Enthusiast, Principal IDParts, Vendor , w/
Joined
Aug 16, 2004
Location
South of Boston
TDI
'97 Passat, '99.5 Golf, '02 Jetta Wagon, '15 GSW
I like silver, but I already have one. Hang on to that bug deflector, they're out of production. Never know when you'll need one. :)

And I think a fire-sale CJAA JSW with an Adblue retrofit would be a great car.
 
Last edited:

dieselgrandad

Veteran Member
Joined
Apr 17, 2002
Location
Fond du Lac, WI
TDI
1997 Silver B4 Passat
I think a fire-sale CJAA JSW with an Adblue retrofit would be a great car.
The hell you say!

No, seriously ... what the hell did you say? I've been out of the loop so long I have no idea what any of that means. :confused:

(sigh) guess I'll have to start searching - got a lot of catching up to do.
 

TDI2000Zim

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 23, 2010
Location
NJ
TDI
VW hat meinen '14 Passat TDiSE getötet.

Jimmy Coconuts

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2015
Location
Henderson NV
TDI
2009 JSW, 2010 Jetta, 2011 Q7 Prestige, 2012 A3 Premium, 2013 A3 Premium Plus, 2014 Beetle, 2015 Jetta
I think anyone who owns an affected car is ticked off, but selling right now is a guaranteed way to get bent over on the sale price.

Unless your cars are falling apart, may as well just drive them for now. It will get sorted out.
 

bubbagumpshrimp

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2013
Location
Virginia
TDI
'13 Jetta TDI
Buyback or enough $$$$ to make it worth my time to keep it. By that, I mean that anyone that would keep these cars has to look forward to the "What Part is Going to Grenade First?" game. You know...parts (i.e. Emissions related) that they apparently never intended to get much of a workout all of a sudden being expected to get a real workout.

I think anyone who owns an affected car is ticked off, but selling right now is a guaranteed way to get bent over on the sale price.

Unless your cars are falling apart, may as well just drive them for now. It will get sorted out.
I agree. From a financial standpoint, I do not get the people that have already run out and panic dumped their TDI's. Sure...I get not being happy with your car (I'm pretty pissed with the situation), but I don't get going out and voluntarily bending over and letting a dealer do you dry just to get out of a car that's going to be recalled sooner or later. Just my $.02...

Edit: As far as what's most cost effective...them getting on their knees for the EPA (begging for reduced fines) and fixing the cars. No way do I see them buying back all of these cars.
 
Last edited:

bubbagumpshrimp

Veteran Member
Joined
Jul 12, 2013
Location
Virginia
TDI
'13 Jetta TDI
When you finally get that settlement claim from 12 years of arbitration in federal courts on a civil suit, let me know. I have the 96 cent stamp to mail in the $1.00 claim check for you.

Being a lawyer, I know how this will play out.
No $h1t, lol. The only way I'll see a cent is if VW decides that the four new cars that I've bought over the years warrants them throwing a few bucks my way in an attempt to motivate me to not abandon ship. I won't hold my breath on that one though.
 
Top