Excessive fuel consumption.....DUH

Recently I've become a proud owner of a 115 HP Bora TDI. It's an excellent car with a lot of extras, runs like hell. It's just (in my opinion) a bit too high fuel consumption that bothers me. For example: I tank it full and drive about 500 km before the reserve alert goes on ('Bitte tanken' message on MFA). Considering the tank volume of 55 liters (sorry, I'm not very good at American measurement standards), it's about 10 l per 100 km (orabout 23.5 US MPG, according to Fred's converter). Before I pop the question I'll also mention that I've made 2000 km with the car so far and about 90% of that driving was done in the city.
Do I have reason to be concerned about the consumption, because I read that the TDIs need quite a lot time to break in? And how long actually the TDI takes to break in (approximately, in kms or miles)?
I've reported it to the service and got an answer that it's completely normal for 115HP TDI to "drink some more" than usual.
Thank you all in advance.

It seems you already have all the answers to your questions.

One can expect fuel consumption during the first few thousand kilometers to be higher. You can be sure that as the mileage increases, fuel consumption will noticeably improve.

City driving and a heavy foot also significantly influence fuel consumption in any car; a Diesel is no exception, but is not so much affected than petrol ones.

Last thing to keep in mind is that the fuel reserve is quite generous in VW's. I drove for a further 200km on a 90hp B5 Passat TDI after the reserve light first came on (I was in Denmark driving back to Germany and didn't want to pay the much more expensive cost for Diesel there). I probably could have gone farther but didn't want to risk being stranded on the Autobahn in Northern Germany late in the evening.

The Passat has a fuel tank capacity of 62 litres, therefore given the range I drove, I estimate the reserve to be about 12-14 litres; I expect the reserve on your Bora to be similar.

In conclusion, you may have only used only about 43 litres to cover 500 km, equivalent to 8.6 l/100km, which would be more respectable for a new 115PD Bora driven in the city.

Sorry this is not concerning the topic, but is Ljubljana, Slovenia, now with all of the changes in eastern Europe, the same Lubijana(sp?) in Yugoslavia. (Serbia???) No offense if I got the name or spelling wrong, but my grandfather was from Lubianna (sp?), Austria and came to America in 1912. Is that part of Yugoslavia now called Slovenia?

NORM!!!

I don't know guys...my first tank of fuel (from the dealer) got 52 miles to the gallon. Since then I haven't brokwn 49.8</P>

Bora's fuel tank volume: 55 l
reserve: cca 7l
When it reaches the reserve (and the 'bitte tanken' shows up), I fill it up with about 48l of fuel (not 42, as tdimeister stated).
SO: if I travel about 500 km (actually less than 500, I just rounded the number up) with 48 liters, it's almost 10l/100km.
And the MFA2 displays average consumption of 8.6l/100km (and rising). Well I never believed it too much anyway...

Bora isn't Passat and doesn't have the same tank nor reserve capacity. Unfortunately...

PS Should I go bother my dealer with this problem or just wait some more and see if the things will get better?

[This message has been edited by PumpeDuse (edited June 25, 2000).]

[This message has been edited by PumpeDuse (edited June 25, 2000).]

I've been driving 23.500 km with my Bora PD now. I haven't calculated what my overall rating is but I can tell you this:

1. The fuel consumption gets less after about 10.000 km.

2. My bora uses around 1 liter per 16 km now. I drive approximately 900km on a tank. I like to sprint away at traffic lights, my friends tell me I drive pretty sporty and I usually don't keep to the speed limits.

3. In city driving the car uses more diesel but I think 1 liter per 10 km is way too much.

4. I sometimes put 57,5 liters in my 55 liter tank. Wit a reserve of 7 liters you should have used around 50 liters when the light flashes on. In my case when I tank when the light flashes on I can tank only 47,5 so it look like the reserve is a little bigger.

I would keep an eye on the consumption for another few thousand kilometers, try to stay out of high rpm's and maybe consider a long distance trip to see how far you can get. Maybe during my holidays we can drive a distance together to see if there are any differences in use.

Greetings from Holland,
The Moose.

------------------
The_Moose,
'00 Bora TDI (115hp - 285Nm), Blue-Anthracit, C'line, 6-Speed Manual, Clima,ASR, CD & CD-Changer, 23.500 km.


[This message has been edited by The_Moose (edited June 25, 2000).]

The_Moose: you lucky son of a gun 900km on a single tank....

Anyway, I'll wait another few thousand km, and if the consumption doesn't fall, I'll kick my dealers butt.
I'll also take it to the other service and have it hooked to the motor diagnostics, just to see if it'll show any errors (second opinion).
I also plan to travel at least 5000 km this summer (now that I'm finished w/ the exams, I have a lot of free time). We'll see then about it.
Thanx.

PS I also like to scram at the green light, but I avoid it as much as possible. I keep it away from high revs (shifting @ 3000 rpm max). SO: my way of driving is hardly the reason for such a consumption. I'll also check under the hood to see if all the wires and tubes are where they're supposed to be.



[This message has been edited by PumpeDuse (edited June 25, 2000).]

a) What's your name, PD?

b) Till 1500km, ok. But after? Your Bora drinks too much! Passat PD in winter at 4000km ate 8 max. At 2000km, you're already over the basic breakin, so give it a spin or two. Do you havef climatronic or manual klima or none? Climatronic uses much less fuel than manual. Passat now (12.000km) eats about 6-7l/100km. Cute driving. Plus some oil. Read other posts in the forum, you'll find more figures. MFA shows a bit less than it should.

c) I wrote this once before: Slovenia has the biggest number of Fred's forums members per capita in the world! Way to go! Naimly...

d) Ljubljana is the capital city of Slovenia. Slovenia gained its independence 9 years ago from Yugoslavia after a week of war (most people were drinking and enjoing the sun but 46 died). Where is this place? Draw a line between Venice and Vienna and you'll pass Ljubljana. So, between Austria and Italy and Hungary and Croatia is Slovenija. Uuuf.
Norm, your father was born in Ljubljana, Austria, because all region was a part of the Austo-Hungarian monarchy at that time. German name for Ljubljana is Laibach and means "the city at the river". Lubiana is an Italian name for Ljubljana. Italia governed Ljubljana and some other parts of Slovenija during the first phase of WW2.

Not to confuse:
Serbia (Yugoslavia) is what NATO attacked last year.
Slovenija or Republika Slovenija is the state we're from, and Slovenija has a population of 2 mio! Hence the record in Fredmembers/1000 inhabitants.
Slovakia is a part of former ChechkoSlovakia. Slovakia is also called Slovak Republik.

Nobody here is concerned if someone confuses this three, as it happens a lot. You need a map and think it all over.

So, Norm, your grandfather was from Ljubljana? Well, many people went in the States (mainly Cleveland area), Canada (Ontario) and Argentina in the last century. If you will ever come here, you'll probably be treated as "the lost child" or something like that.


How come that so many Slovenijans drive VW, and other good cars? A normal Slovenian guy has: a house, built of concrete, in which he lives for the rest of his life. A better car than his neighbour. And he is moonlighting. Usually. That's also one of the reasons we're richer than say Greece and the wealthiest between countries to join European Union. BDP? About 10k$ plus moonlighting.
Prices of cars? Higher than in US, same as Germany.

PD will correct me wherever I've made a mistake, I bet! And send me an email (mitja.org/TDI for your oil, if you haven't read the OilForum, though)

Moose: are you coming to the seaside or is PD drving to Euro2000?
We lost already, though...

The Moose is going to the Seaside....

To relax, get away from the wind, rain and cold, and to do some sightseeing of course.
Me and mrs. Moose will tour Slovenia, Kroatia and Italy this Summer.

Four weeks of driving... mmm I can hardly wait ! 1500 km on the German Autobahn just to test fuel consumption while cruising on maximum speed !

Greetings,
The Moose.

Mitja:
You wouldn't belive. I didn't know (I mean really) where Ljubljana name came from. Thanks.

I have posted some consumption related info to the other "fuel related" thread.

Ales K.

Moose...

He, he, he... I have some friends comming here as well and the first thing I said was: no autobahn in Germany, more "stau".

There's a traffic calendar for Slovenija (just shows in which direction on the highway will be traffic jams) at my homepage mitja.org/TDI, if you wish.

ASR is THE best thing you can have: a recent drive on the wet (ultra-slippery) roads of Istria proved that VW made a good decision making it standard in PD: wheels tend to spiiiin (ok, if one wants to, but anyway - those streets and the smell of summer and slow driving with open windows is great).


Now THIS will be way out of topic, but nice:

Accordind to ancient legend, Ljubljana was founded by that excellent Greek maritime crew - the Argonauts: Jason, Hercules, Castor and POllux, Lynceus, Pellus, Telemachus (does this ring-a-bell?) Orpheus, Thesus, Meleager and Pirithus, who were travelling with their fifty-oared vessel the Argo from Black Sea up the Danube, then Sava river and Ljubljanica river, then across the hills to the Adriatic sea and back home.

But: noone knows how Celts called this place.
The modern Ljubljana does NOT derive from the name of the Roman town on this site EMONA, which is from an unknown pre-Roman source.
The new name first appears in writing as the German "Laibach" in 1144, and the Slovene "Luwigana" in 1146, which leads to another insolvable question: what is the common denominator of Ljubljana/Luwigana and Laibach?

Theories say, that Ljubljana comes from a name of the settlement of some ancient Slavic race, the Ljubljanii. Or it could derive from the name of the river Laburus. Or, it could come from the flooding of the river: in Latin "aluviana" means "flooding" and Ljubljanica did flood. Or, Laibach as the stream, running below the rocks at the constant 8C, thus called "Laubach". And Ljubljanica does flow through half of Slovenija, although it makes most of its travel below the surface (if Moose will go to Postojna and Skocjan caves...). And so on, and on.... So, no, we don't know for Ljubljana, but we think we know what Laibach means.

OK Mitja. I mean explanation about the Ljubljana name was good enough for me.

Anyhow interesting reading. Thanks for this update.

See you sometime,
Ales K.

Ales, Mitja, sorry for the off-topic post, but neither of you have an e-mail address listed, and I wanted to ask you a couple of questions.

Do either of you know of the condition called Hypophosphatasia? It is where your body has low alkaline phosphatase (ALP) detected by a blood test.

The reason I am asking is that I my wife and 2 of my 3 kids have the condition, and I have heard that it is most common in you area of Europe, and my wife's (late) father's family is from the Prague area, and we believe that the condition was in his genes.

Symptoms include increased chance of Osteoporosis, early tooth loss, and bone weakness and bone pain.

My late father-in-law's last name was Mottl. Is that a fairly common name in that region?

Thanks for your help. You can e-mail me at rwoodruff@webinbox.com if you wish.

------------------
Ric Woodruff

Braumeister von Sehr Gutem Bier
Since the Last Millennium

1998 Jetta TDI Sport

"Why be Normal???...
because it beats the hell
out of all the alternatives!!!
that's why"



[This message has been edited by Ric Woodruff (edited June 27, 2000).]

Hey all:

Thanks for the geography lesson. It was really interesting. Based on your description, my Grandfather was from your great city. We could be distant relatives and not even know it. My last name is Seitz, but I have recently found out that it was changed at Ellis Island where most imigrants to the U.S. past through on entering. Someone told me that my real last name was Zyack (sp?). I guess living in the States so long you tend to forget your heritage, so no one made a big deal about it and no one seemed to know any more about it either. My Grandfather tryed farming in the Upper Pennisula of Michigan just south of Lake Superior and when he could only grow rocks, he move to Cudahy, Wisconsin and was a cooper making barrels.

Anyway, thanks for the great update. Maybe our paths will cross in the future.

Thanks,

NORM!!!

Ric, if you have had blood work done, check to see what your ratio of calcium to phosphorus is. It should be 10:4. Low phosphorus levels plays havoc with calcium metabolism, leading to bone loss. Too much phosphorus(excessive soda pop consumption) also leads to bone loss+tooth decay. If you have a hereditary tendency, then you should be extra cautious. MTC

Your grandparents' surname must have been Zajc, which, when transcribed, turns into Seitz. Zajc is a pretty common surname here and most of its bearers aren't even related. It's derived from Slovene word zajec (rabbit). It was, obviously, popular among the old Slavs to take animal names for their surnames.

Ric, sorry, my knowledge of medcine is about 0. I'll ask my brother about it. My email is on my homepage, address above.

Norm: when I read your surname, it reads as Zajc. This is a common surname in Slovenija (telephone directory listed 956 telephone subscribers with this surname).

Due to only 2mio inhabitants, Slovenija works like a huge family - everyone knows everyone. And almost everybody is somehow related. This has some good sides and some bad sides, of course.

A joke (it happened once!) about doctors and electroenergetics (ok, electro-whatever), told by a friend: the energetics guy was repairing the hot-water-boiler at the doctors' house. The boiler was above the iron bathtub, so he was standing in the tub.

Suddenly, the doctor turned on the boiler, and, the energetic, shocked by electricity, fell into the tub, injuring his arm...

Energetic: you fool, I've said you mustn't turn it on until I finish!
Doctor: sorry, but we always test during the work to see if we're on the right way. And anyway, now I can pay you back for repairing the boiler - immediately!

Thanks again. I have now learned more about my heritage in a couple of posts on Fred's TDI Forum than I have from my relatives in my 48 years on this planet.

Life is beautiful,


NORM!!!

LOL! Thanks for the history/geography lesson; and you guys are funny to boot, too (and I mean that in a good way)