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Go Back   TDIClub Forums > VW TDI Discussion Areas > TDI Power Enhancements

TDI Power Enhancements Discussions about increasing the power of your TDI engine. i.e. chips, injectors, powerboxes, clutches, etc. Handling, suspensions, wheels, type discussion should be put into the "Upgrades (non TDI Engine related)" forum. Non TDI vehicle related postings will be moved or removed. Please note the Performance Disclaimer.

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Old January 11th, 2017, 10:11   #16
mk1-83
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SqBlqdeP3uE

video of bosch ve pump at 6.00 min you show the 2 types of plunjer
zero pre stroke like tdi ve have little more injection duration
the pre stroke have a grove in top of plunjer and little less injection duration on same camplate
because the filling port only closed when its have a bit lift so you loose bit injection duration time

the zero stroke plunjer like tdi the port closed by rotation
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Last edited by mk1-83; January 11th, 2017 at 10:14.
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Old May 2nd, 2017, 04:58   #17
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Any more news ?
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Old May 11th, 2017, 10:39   #18
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Wouldnt one think the pre stroke is actually benefical as it could start with a smoother pressure rise in which the primary stge of the dual stage DI injector squirts a smaller amount of fuel initially, just like a pilot injection in a CR engine.

Even as this might come over to you as a longer total inj event. I think it will still be beneficial.

Example: in a CR engine run without any pilot injection, the time between start of injection and start of heat release is fairly long, what happens is a lot of fuel is already in the charmber evaporated before the self ignition occurs. this creates a pretty steep rise in pressure, making a louder combustion and more shock load on piston/rod assy. also higher PCP.

A CR with one or 2 pilot events will start earlier with injecting a tiny amount of fuel (1-2 mg), this will start to burn pretty soon creating a higher pressure and temprature in the chamber. by the time the main injection is released this increased temp/pressure will cause the main injection to ignite more quickly, so by the time it ignites, a smaller ratio of the total qty is in the chamber and the peak rate of pressure rise will be lower.

Its clear that in both examples one adjust start of main injection to optimal (alpha 50% burn approx 7 deg AFTDC)

pure BSFC wise single injection is usually better at high loads, but it causes more strain on the engine hardware and makes for a louder combustion.
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Old May 11th, 2017, 13:51   #19
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Hi ruben the ports are closed later so build inj pressure late when cam rotates and plunjer lifts
But im found thate with a k 3.4 mm setting the groove sits above filling port

So then it use all camplate lift for fueling and dont loose anything by plunjer rotate to close ports and pressuraised it. Yes im now what you mean to say little pre inj to speed up for main inj
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Old September 21st, 2018, 18:50   #20
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*Bump*
There were two graphs that showed about a dozen cam plate profiles. However, with postimg.org down, they seem to be non-existent now.

Did anyone else here save the images out to their hard drivers? This was in a section of data I lost so it is a no go for me.
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Old January 27th, 2019, 01:15   #21
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Hello,
Maybe a little bit out of topic question but I replaced factory plunger with 12mm preload plunger (1.9 tdi, 81 kw, Seat Leon, 2004)
And now I can't get timing right, I advanced pump timing to 14 BTDC and now is cold start (-20C) good. I advanced timing with VCDS as much as possible (under Adaptation, Channel 4) got it 5.5 BTDC. At least now there are some timing advancing by computer when I am driving. But still there are 9 degree difference between pump and computer timing.
Look like needle lift sensor measures needle lift from zero. So it shows pre stroke not main injection.
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Old January 27th, 2019, 02:17   #22
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Strange. Tbh I would set timing by looking in normal meas block in channel 4 (not basic setting) and then with warm engine the req timing will be close to 0, then advance pump till you have 2-3* btd with duty cycle close to 0, this means that the timing at idle will be mechanically 2-3 deg without intervention from the n108. This way if case pressure is decent you will easily get 20* of dynamic timing with stock timing piston/cover.
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Old January 27th, 2019, 09:16   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WarmStart View Post
Look like needle lift sensor measures needle lift from zero. So it shows pre stroke not main injection.
I don't think it measures from needle lift, but when the needle strikes the travel stop, fully open.

On mine at warm idle the 'timing (actual)' goes blank and n108 duty cycle defaults to a fixed 44%
if it were measuring the needle's initial opening it wouldn't do that, but if it is measuring the needle's end of travel fully open it would make sense, at hot idle there just isn't enough fuel going in to fully open the injector.
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Old January 27th, 2019, 22:03   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [486] View Post
I don't think it measures from needle lift, but when the needle strikes the travel stop, fully open.

On mine at warm idle the 'timing (actual)' goes blank and n108 duty cycle defaults to a fixed 44%
But it have to measure from zero or pre stroke (on my car) because it is only explanation why pump mechanical timing and computer asked timing is so much off. There are -20 C. cold outside and engine with 14 degrees advanced timing start like normal engine. When it was advanged 8 degrees it was much harder start.
Maybe there are G80 different sensors, some are more active then others or ECUs are reading them differently.
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Old March 31st, 2019, 11:50   #25
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Has anyone tried DE177 camplate?
Lift is 3.5mm.

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Old April 2nd, 2019, 01:57   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WarmStart View Post
Has anyone tried DE177 camplate?
Lift is 3.5mm.

From where? Pump number or engine model / code ?
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Old April 8th, 2019, 21:04   #27
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This camplate is from ford focus VP30 pump.
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Old April 15th, 2019, 10:47   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WarmStart View Post
Has anyone tried DE177 camplate?
Lift is 3.5mm.

This is b.s.

I have DE177 and stock 10mm pump camplate DE110 in my hands. Both have same lift, like 3.1mm or so. Profile is little different.
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