Why is that people think that hybrids are alternative fuel? I hate hybrids!!

BioNerd

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To my knowledge they use gasoline, and they have a slightly better mpg rate than regular engines. They have a gigantic disposable battery, and they aren't made to last.
How many Prius you see driving around with missing lights? It seems that at least that kind of hybrid is a royal joke.
Please post info here to dissuade my ignorant network from buying an abomination.
(and If you have one, don't take offense. I'm just been funny)
 

Ol'Rattler

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Because Hybrids are "PC" or "flavor of the month". My sister had a Hybrid Toyota Hylander and later traded in for a smaller Korean import. with the Korean regular gas car, she gets better millage..................

I think that it is because people are, for the most part are sheep and will buy what they think is PC.

People thinking that Hybrids are alternative fuel vehicles, I don't have a clue.
 
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kerrige

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I think everyone on this site knows better. Hybrids aren't being done correctly just yet. Plug-ins and diesel hybrids are starting to go the right direction. TDI's are still much much better. Especially when non-hybrids are creeping on hybrid mileage aka mazda 3, Chevy Cruze, ford fiesta/focus, and some others.
 

Joe_Meehan

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I am with kerrige. It is a learning phase. We will come out of it with more information, and maybe a better, more efficient car. Before we get there, we may go through several generations before we have a car that is practical for the average Joe.
 

Honeydew

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BioNerd- have you seen the license plates which the Commonwealth of Virginia issues for hybrids???

 

BioNerd

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They use gasoline to power/recharge a battery. That is their fuel, gasoline.
Without gasoline they couldn't move.

Regular cars do the same but they don't use the battery to move the car.
 

Ski in NC

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They use both gas and elec, we both know that. The regen braking, and flattening the load cycles of the engine (both of which depends on elec) is really what makes that technology shine. Pretty good engineering, even if you (and I) don't really like the car, or the snobbery that some carry with it..

I have no problem with hybrids being classed as an alt fuel vehicle. Good technology and we need more of it. It may burn gasoline, but a whole lot less.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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I think they have their place. In urban or suburban driving with lots of stops they do very well. They're great for short trips. The batteries are lasting a lot longer than manufacturers predicted.

Right now I have a five mile commute on suburban streets that I do twice a day, on average. I don't want to drive my new Golf such short distances frequently, and I know that I can carbon up the turbo on my modified wagon with a steady diet of the same use. A hybrid wouldn't be a bad option.
 

40X40

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Hybrids have their place just as TDIs do. Different tech for different needs. TDIs are best as highway transports and Prii are better as city cars. Either way the two types represent the most fuel efficient cars in common North American usage.

I'd buy one.

Bill
 

tditom

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I traded in my 05 Passat tdi for an 09 Camry Hybrid. Now I pay less per gal and get more mpg's to boot! I believe it's bigger inside too.
 

BioNerd

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I still think that, if they use gasoline as fuel, they are misclassified as alternative fuel. They have an electric motor powered by gasoline, right?

They are lower emission, fuel efficient (in some cases).

They burn regular gas to move, there is a plug in conversion that can be called alternative fuel.

Not everything that claims to be "green" is actually less impact on the environment. It takes as much if not more effort to build them. They don't seem to be built to be a "classic" in 30 years.

My verdict is that they have been marketed very well. And the philosophy behind is to build disposable cars. I hope that the research and evolution of the technology reaches a point where it makes more sense.

I love hating on hybrids. :)
(specially because they were allowed in the carpool lane with just the driver!)
 

BioNerd

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Oh, and if the exhaust fumes are so clean, why don't they hook up the pipe to the cabin? That will save some heating energy! :p
 

TNriverjet

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Hybrids have their place just as TDIs do. Different tech for different needs. TDIs are best as highway transports and Prii are better as city cars. Either way the two types represent the most fuel efficient cars in common North American usage.

I'd buy one.

Bill
I agree with bionerd totally. I still can't resolve myself to the benefits of a hybrid... Why do "we" (loose cultural reference used here) drive our hybrids 5-7 mins to the gym for a workout? Use a darn bicycle or jog there for a warmup! Not to mention... The larger carbon footprint for manufacturing a Prius. The single-source battery mfg plant location alone requires container ship transport to the assembly plant.

I absolutely love cruising down the highway and passing a Prius at 75 mph... knowing I'm getting better fuel efficiency!!!!
 

JasonG

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A balance needs to be found.
Hybrids are a good thing, I'd love a TDI hybrid.
Gas hybrids are still burning dino oil, no way around it.
Biodiesel is the only currently available fuel (Ethenol isn't sustainable) not to burn dino oil.
Run synthetic engine oil and that only leaves the tires.
 

Joe_Meehan

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There are no official "word police" words mean what the speaker means. It can get confusing, but that is what makes us different from computers.

Tell me what "cool" means! If back in my younger days, I might have looked at a girl and remarked that she is "cool." I might have been saying that I am likely to walk over there and ask her out, or I might have had better luck by offering her my sweater.

So if I say the electricity is a fuel I should know that the reader or listener, might not know which use of the word I am thinking of. If I want to eliminate the problem of the listener misunderstanding, then it is my job to be more specific.

If you understood what "fuel" meant in this situation, then all is good. If you did not understand, then maybe you might have to ask. However it appears you did understand and I don't think anyone else mis understands or at least very few people mis understands. All is good.

English is a living language. It changes almost every day. If you want words to have only one work, you are going to need to choose a different language. Maybe Latin would be good. It has been used for a number of modern purposes just to avoid such problems.
 

whitedog

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I agree with bionerd totally. I still can't resolve myself to the benefits of a hybrid... Why do "we" (loose cultural reference used here) drive our hybrids 5-7 mins to the gym for a workout? Use a darn bicycle or jog there for a warmup! Not to mention... The larger carbon footprint for manufacturing a Prius. The single-source battery mfg plant location alone requires container ship transport to the assembly plant.
I absolutely love cruising down the highway and passing a Prius at 75 mph... knowing I'm getting better fuel efficiency!!!!
Once, I saw a gal circle a parking lot twice to park in the front row to go into a gym. Your post made me think it would have been even funnier if she had been driving a Prius.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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Run synthetic engine oil and that only leaves the tires.
Yeah, right. Dashboard, seat frames, wiring looms, interior trim, bushings...much of what our cars are made of is petro based. Not to mention what runs the steel mills and assembly plants.

If you really want to be green keep an old car running and from going to scrap. Then you're saving energy.
 

VWBeamer

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Agree, I also say that oil is to precious of a resource to burn. Look at what we can do with it besides power our cars.

Yeah, right. Dashboard, seat frames, wiring looms, interior trim, bushings...much of what our cars are made of is petro based. Not to mention what runs the steel mills and assembly plants.

If you really want to be green keep an old car running and from going to scrap. Then you're saving energy.
 

Dieselducky

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I had a Toyota Camry Hybrid as a rental the fuel mileage indicator read 10L per 100km...my BMW gets 9...a full 1 liter per 100 better...i had the car for 2 weeks and reset the trip computer as well, could not get it to do better
 

tditom

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I had a Toyota Camry Hybrid as a rental the fuel mileage indicator read 10L per 100km...my BMW gets 9...a full 1 liter per 100 better...i had the car for 2 weeks and reset the trip computer as well, could not get it to do better
I'm curious how you had such poor FE with a Camry Hybrid. How did you drive it? Were all 4 tires on it? :D
 

kerrige

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A balance needs to be found.
Hybrids are a good thing, I'd love a TDI hybrid.
Gas hybrids are still burning dino oil, no way around it.
Biodiesel is the only currently available fuel (Ethenol isn't sustainable) not to burn dino oil.
Run synthetic engine oil and that only leaves the tires.
I agree a TDI hybrid would be awesome. Deadly combo to the oil business. I think synthetic or the new recycled oil are both helpful. Again though everyone needs to realize we aren't there yet, its going to take a variety of technologies to stretch the resources we have although we will never be off fossil fuels.

Your actually partially wrong about Ethanol. Corn Ethanol is absolutely not sustainable, but the brazilian sugar cane Ethanol is very efficient. Corn thus car has a 40% efficiency, but Brazilian has a 2400% efficiency. That sounds pretty sustainable to me.
 

BioNerd

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Yeah, right. Dashboard, seat frames, wiring looms, interior trim, bushings...much of what our cars are made of is petro based. Not to mention what runs the steel mills and assembly plants.

If you really want to be green keep an old car running and from going to scrap. Then you're saving energy.
Like my 1980 300D, ~32 years on the road, ~25mpg... or my 1998 jetta tdi, ~14 years on the road, ~43mpg. Both running 100% recycled used oil based biodiesel made in the USA.:)

A balance needs to be found.
Hybrids are a good thing, I'd love a TDI hybrid.
Gas hybrids are still burning dino oil, no way around it.
Biodiesel is the only currently available fuel (Ethenol isn't sustainable) not to burn dino oil.
Run synthetic engine oil and that only leaves the tires.
did you know about this? Bio-Synthetic HD SHP Motor Oil
SAE 5W40 (10 TBN)


There are no official "word police" words mean what the speaker means. It can get confusing, but that is what makes us different from computers.

Tell me what "cool" means! If back in my younger days, I might have looked at a girl and remarked that she is "cool." I might have been saying that I am likely to walk over there and ask her out, or I might have had better luck by offering her my sweater.

So if I say the electricity is a fuel I should know that the reader or listener, might not know which use of the word I am thinking of. If I want to eliminate the problem of the listener misunderstanding, then it is my job to be more specific.

If you understood what "fuel" meant in this situation, then all is good. If you did not understand, then maybe you might have to ask. However it appears you did understand and I don't think anyone else mis understands or at least very few people mis understands. All is good.

English is a living language. It changes almost every day. If you want words to have only one work, you are going to need to choose a different language. Maybe Latin would be good. It has been used for a number of modern purposes just to avoid such problems.
Huh? English doesn't require the use of words correctly? maybe that is why we use the word democracy to describe what really is a cleptocracy.
(the last word is underlined as it doesn't exist for the software, lol!)

clepto=thief, cracy=in-power

Its then very easy to sell us bronze for the price of gold and tell us that is gold.... doesn't matter its a metal... kind of the same thing.
:p
How can you describe anything with such a diluted base? that is so meaningless, literally!! I kind of makes me wonder why its so easy to lie to us... its the perfect platform then!:eek:
 

manual_tranny

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Yeah, right. Dashboard, seat frames, wiring looms, interior trim, bushings...much of what our cars are made of is petro based. Not to mention what runs the steel mills and assembly plants.

If you really want to be green keep an old car running and from going to scrap. Then you're saving energy.
Yes! Exactly!! :)
 

Joe_Meehan

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fuel |ˈfyoōəl|
noun
material such as coal, gas, or oil that is burned to produce heat or power.
• short for nuclear fuel .
• food, drink, or drugs as a source of energy : any protein intake can also be used as fuel.

Electricity is a form of energy, NOT FUEL

Ethanol is a form of energy
 

manual_tranny

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That may depend on which version of physics you are using.

Lithium ions have mass. In fact, their mass to size to energy ratio is many orders of magnitude better than diesel. The problem is that lithium ion storage tanks are so large, heavy and complicated. But I can see how someone would say that lithium ions are a type of fuel. In some situations it can be more efficient to create and store lithium ions than it is to mine, refine, transport, and then combust oil.

When Polymer-nano-carbon composites are brought to the table as fireproof ultra-capacitors in the shape of the car's body, then we'll have a lithium-ion storage tank that is worth owning.
 
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Powder Hound

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fuel |ˈfyoōəl|
noun
material such as coal, gas, or oil that is burned to produce heat or power.
• short for nuclear fuel .
• food, drink, or drugs as a source of energy : any protein intake can also be used as fuel.
Electricity is a form of energy, NOT FUEL
Ethanol is a form of energy
By the definition you provided, ethanol is indeed fuel. As such, it stores chemical energy which is transformed by the combustion process into heat, then transformed by the engine into mechanical energy.
 

01greenjetta

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I agree a TDI hybrid would be awesome. Deadly combo to the oil business. I think synthetic or the new recycled oil are both helpful. Again though everyone needs to realize we aren't there yet, its going to take a variety of technologies to stretch the resources we have although we will never be off fossil fuels.
Your actually partially wrong about Ethanol. Corn Ethanol is absolutely not sustainable, but the brazilian sugar cane Ethanol is very efficient. Corn thus car has a 40% efficiency, but Brazilian has a 2400% efficiency. That sounds pretty sustainable to me.
I think we are there, just not here. In other countries there are diesel hybrids like this 70 mpg Peugeot:

http://dieseldig.com/2011/07/11/not-for-usa-peugeot-508-rxh-diesel-hybrid/
 

BioNerd

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Yup, and Brazil is been doing it for decades.
It's like biodiesel made with corn or soy, makes no sense. But big agriculture gangsters wanna sell their stuff.


-On my way back to lush.
 
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