Audi A3 Dieselgate -- Info

PhunkFX

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2014 Audi Q5 TDI S-Line, 2005.5 Jetta TDI (BRM) 6MT (02Q)
But as another poster pointed out, the settlement might actually drive prices for diesel cars up.
I was told the same by vendors also. A similar situation happened in the mid 2000s with Passats, and the vehicles were going well over MSRP. Plus, do we know what is really going to happen with fuel prices under a new president? There are a lot of factors that could lead to these cars being well sought after, but still and from the other point, these cars are currently worth, whatever they are considered to be worth by the owner. :confused:
 

PeteZ06

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Algonquin, IL
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I was told the same by vendors also. A similar situation happened in the mid 2000s with Passats, and the vehicles were going well over MSRP. Plus, do we know what is really going to happen with fuel prices under a new president? There are a lot of factors that could lead to these cars being well sought after, but still and from the other point, these cars are currently worth, whatever they are considered to be worth by the owner. :confused:
Luckily we don't have to make a decision until Sept 2018. That will give us a better idea of what direction things will go.

So far on my plate..

E250
328D
535D
A6 TDI
A7 TDI

In 2 years all of those will be within my budget.
 

Terry270

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BG, KY
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03 golf, 10 A3
I'm guessing those of us that have close to 300k miles with DPF deletes are out of luck.
Returning the car to stock and letting them do their "fix' only to delete again would suck but for over 5k I'll do it lol
 

Tailwagger

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MA
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I was told the same by vendors also. A similar situation happened in the mid 2000s with Passats, and the vehicles were going well over MSRP. Plus, do we know what is really going to happen with fuel prices under a new president? There are a lot of factors that could lead to these cars being well sought after, but still and from the other point, these cars are currently worth, whatever they are considered to be worth by the owner. :confused:
You never know, but I really can't see it any time soon, if ever. There were no real hybrids or EVs to compete with back then. you or I might not buy one, but others certainly will. There are alternatives today that didnt exist then. Diesel is damaged goods at the moment. Last I checked there were only 2 XE diesel in the entire country. No demand, could change, but its going to take a while and likely wont happen so fast that demand outstrips supply.
 

ChinaBob

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Newburyport, MA
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2016 BMW 328d x-drive; 2015 Audi A3 TDi
You never know, but I really can't see it any time soon, if ever ... Diesel is damaged goods at the moment.
I'd would have thought so, too, before I went to the local BMW dealer yesterday to check out a 328d. The salesperson (I forget what BMW calls them) spotted the TDI on the back of my car and knew why I was there. It like she was expecting me. She said I was the 4th TDI owner she'd seen in as many days, all checking out BMW diesels.

Hmm....
 
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Tailwagger

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MA
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2015 A3
I'd would have thought so, too, before I went to the local BMW dealer yesterday to check out a 328d. The salesperson (I forget what BMW calls them) spotted the TDI on the back of my car and knew why I was there. It like she was expecting me. She said I was the 4th TDI owner she'd seen in as many days, all checking out BMW diesels.

Hmm....
Bump in the road AFAIC. Recent TDI loyalists eyeing BMWs, given we all expect to be flush with a lot of extra cash shortly, is pretty predictable. Most of us looked at them in the first place but decided the TDI represented better value. As I mentioned, there are no Jags in the US at this point, instead they've brought in tons of 4 cyl RWD gassers. Even here in the NE market, Jag thinks they stand a better shot at selling Gas/RWD then Diesel/AWD. They could be wrong about demand, I'd certainly take a hard look an XE if they were around, but it bears mentioning that the original plan was to send us the diesel and the 6 cyl and hold off the 4cyl gasser until the AWD version was ready. Clearly that all changed, no doubt as a result of the TDI situation.

At my local BMW dealership there are about 10 328d total, most wagons, and several are 2015 leftovers. When I bought the TDI they had 3x that number. Sure, if TDI owners trade in their cars en masse to move to BMW, there could be significant upward pricing pressure on the 328d, or at least long waits for ordered vehicles. But its a blip that wont last very long. Its worth noting that many first timers diesel owners have been left with a very bad taste in their mouth from all this. Those folks aren't necessarily all that excited to buy another diesel.

But heres the key set of questions. How many cars will be traded and whats going to happen to them? Given how sweet the deal is, I dont think its much of a stretch to think that most will be turned in. If so, once in the hands of VW/Audi those cars are either going to be fixed and resold or crushed (as the agreement, as I understand it, does not allow VW to simply export them and sell them outside the US). Now if 90% go to scrap, yeah, even weak demand might outstrip supply. But if most are fixed, and I think we can reasonably expect that most late model DEF equipped ones will be, the market will see, if not a sudden flood, then a constant stream of VW/Audi diesels on dealer lots all over the country. That leads me to predict that the prices of recent TDIs are far more likely to significantly drop, rather than rise.
 

Terry270

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Ive considered many times buying a 335 or 535d. They are sweet but I wouldn't even consider owning one out of warranty. I am a big BMW fan always have been, owned several of them and have an E30 m3 now. But these latest models are horrible as far as reliability. My advice for anyone considering one is let it go when warranty runs out.

Our A3 has been amazing, 192k now and all I have done to it is both front wheel bearings. Plus me and my wife both drive with a heavy foot and still gives us over 40mpg (tracked with fuelly). Hard to beat these cars I don't know what I would replace it with.
 
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Jimmy Coconuts

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2009 JSW, 2010 Jetta, 2011 Q7 Prestige, 2012 A3 Premium, 2013 A3 Premium Plus, 2014 Beetle, 2015 Jetta
Joined the A3 TDI club today, snatched up a low miles 2012 Premium. Woot

Do all A3s have the CBEA engine?
 

flee

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Joined the A3 TDI club today, snatched up a low miles 2012 Premium. Woot
Do all A3s have the CBEA engine?
Welcome to the A3 world.
From that year they do.
When Audi changed the body to the sedan in '13 I think they
upped the power to 150HP, not sure what engine code, though.
 
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5FDP

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Yo house
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Ive considered many times buying a 335 or 535d. They are sweet but I wouldn't even consider owning one out of warranty. I am a big BMW fan always have been, owned several of them and have an E30 m3 now. But these latest models are horrible as far as reliability. My advice for anyone considering one is let it go when warranty runs out.

Our A3 has been amazing, 192k now and all I have done to it is both front wheel bearings. Plus me and my wife both drive with a heavy foot and still gives us over 40mpg (tracked with fuelly). Hard to beat these cars I don't know what I would replace it with.

My E92 M3 was a total pile. Picked it up CPO with 8kmi. It was great when it worked. It drank about 1qt of oil every tank full. I got to the point I didn't bother changing oil. I figured in 5kmi I would put in 10-15qts of oil...that's more than an oil change. After putting over 40kmi on it I sold it as there was ALWAYS something going wrong with it.
 

Jimmy Coconuts

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Welcome to the A3 world.
From that year they do.
When Audi changed the body to the sedan in '13 I think they
upped the power to 150HP, not sure what engine code, though.
Thanks flee. I drove a buddy of mine to LA yesterday to pick up a sweet little 2015 A3 TDI sedan. The new ones definitely have more low end power, but I really like my 2012. So smooth!!!
 

flee

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Thanks flee. I drove a buddy of mine to LA yesterday to pick up a sweet little 2015 A3 TDI sedan. The new ones definitely have more low end power, but I really like my 2012. So smooth!!!
Yeah, I hope there is a fix so we don't have to sell 'em back!
If you are planning to hang on to yours, consider getting the DSG tune.
$500, though...
 

5FDP

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Yo house
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A3
Yeah, I hope there is a fix so we don't have to sell 'em back!
If you are planning to hang on to yours, consider getting the DSG tune.
$500, though...
The DSG Tune only fixes the 5-7mph drop into 1st gear in parking lots and only if left in auto. It doesn't allow me to take off in 2nd gear and it's also inconsistent about how it shifts from 1-2. I don't think it helps with shift times at all.
 

flee

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The DSG Tune only fixes the 5-7mph drop into 1st gear in parking lots and only if left in auto. It doesn't allow me to take off in 2nd gear and it's also inconsistent about how it shifts from 1-2. I don't think it helps with shift times at all.
YMMV, as you have an A3 with double the miles of mine.
It just drives better all around and, hey, gear indicator!
 

ChinaBob

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Feb 10, 2013
Location
Newburyport, MA
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2016 BMW 328d x-drive; 2015 Audi A3 TDi
Got a good deal on a new 2016 BMW 328d x-drive today. Everything I wanted and a bit more at a very nice price, but why didn’t I wait for October when Audi will give me a bunch of money for my 2-year old A3 with 80,000 miles? I didn't trade the Audi, I'm keeping it till the buyback, so between now and then I'll have two cars. May seem crazy, but here’s my reasoning:


There are about 480,000 cars involved in the recall. If only 1% are owned by diesel junkies (like me, it must be the fumes) that for whatever reason must have another diesel but won’t be buying it from VW/Audi, that’s 4800 cars they’re looking for. I am guessing that’s a lot more than the combined annual BMW and MB diesel car sales in the USA. Chevy Cruise anybody? They’re supposed to be coming out with a new and improved diesel for 2017. The Jag XE is still on the horizon, or maybe on the boat, who knows? In any case, I doubt there is any way all four manufacturers combined can churn out 4800 units for the USA. You can see where this is going – lots of buyers with lots of buyback cash chasing very few cars come October.


So why BMW? Very nice car; one test drive and I was smitten. Reliability? About the same as the current A3’s according to Consumer Reports and my A3’s reliability has been more than good enough for me. And because VW has screwed diesel sales for everybody, BMW dealers are offering very good deals on 328d’s right now. But as above, I don’t think it will last long as the current supply of 16’s and even a few 15’s dwindles. In addition, while the 15’s and 16’s have free maintenance for four years, 50 K miles, the 17’s are cut back to three and 36. And that’s if there even is a 2017 328d; latest word is that they are being held up by the EPA for additional emissions testing. Thanks again, VW!

BTW, just thinking, how will the buybacks be treated sales-tax wise? I guess it's for each state to figure out on its own, but if the buyback is treated as a trade-in it would save us a lot of money on the sales taxes in most states.
 
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Tailwagger

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MA
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2015 A3
BTW, just thinking, how will the buybacks be treated sales-tax wise? I guess it's for each state to figure out on its own, but if the buyback is treated as a trade-in it would save us a lot of money on the sales taxes in most states.
Congrats and best of luck!

I'm hoping, fingers crossed, that I'll be able to drop the car off, sign on a TT and drive off, xfering plates etc. I would think under that circumstance it would be viewed as a trade, but its nearly a certainty that if you take cash from Audi and then buy a different make, you're on the hook for tax on the full value of the car. I'd bet, at least here in MA, they'll treat that as the equivalent of a private sale to a third party.
 

skycrane

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Jul 29, 2016
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NoVA
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'12 Audi A3, 96 E300, 87 300SDL
New to the club as well. got an 12 audi A3 back in feb. with 87k on it. and im starting to love the little car. its much easier to get in and out of parking in DC than my old Diesel Benz was... and dont even get me started on the fule mileage im getting:)
 

Tailwagger

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MA
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2015 A3
I've just realized that I've totally miscalculated the payout. Basically theres a buyback number and theres a fix your car and we'll give you cash number. You dont get both, one or the other. Still a good deal for me as it looks like they'll be giving me about a G over what I paid for it originally, but its not the windfall I thought. A simplified chart, not including mileage stuff is available here for those interested.
 

ChinaBob

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Joined
Feb 10, 2013
Location
Newburyport, MA
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2016 BMW 328d x-drive; 2015 Audi A3 TDi
I've just realized that I've totally miscalculated the payout.
Easy enough to do; this stuff's complicated.

This is the official website just put up this week that makes all the calculations for you and registers your claim. https://www.vwcourtsettlement.com/en/ All you need is VIN and mileage, if I remember correctly.

Warning: It didn't work for me in Google Chrome, you'll need to use Internet Explorer instead. The thing is with Chrome is that you enter the basic info on the first page and you think you are done, but there are several more pages needing input. After you've finished you'll get an email confirming registration.
 
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Tailwagger

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MA
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2015 A3
Easy enough to do; this stuff's complicated.

This is the official website just put up this week that makes all the calculations for you and registers your claim. https://www.vwcourtsettlement.com/en/ All you need is VIN and mileage, if I remember correctly.
Thanks, missed the link to do the calculation. My final (estimated) number winds up a bit over $43K with an estimated return date of 11/1. Bought the car 11/8/14, so all in + tax and service plan, they're paying me $700 to have driven it for two years. Hard to complain about that. With number in hand, I'm going to see next week if I can work a deal now to order a TT for Nov Oct/Nov delivery and hopefully save sales tax.
 

Tailwagger

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BTW, according to Autoweek today, the 2017 BMWs diesels have passed certification and are clear to come in. The C-class diesels are still yet to receive certification.
 

ChinaBob

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Newburyport, MA
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2016 BMW 328d x-drive; 2015 Audi A3 TDi
BTW, according to Autoweek today, the 2017 BMWs diesels have passed certification and are clear to come in. The C-class diesels are still yet to receive certification.
Good news indeed! It gives another couple of options for those who absolutely must have a diesel. (I didn't even know Mercedes had a C class diesel in the works for the North American market.) And you can bet that with all the extra scrutiny from their manufacturers and the EPA, both of these cars will be the squeekiest cleanest diesels ever sold in the North America.

For those considering it, I'd still recommend taking a serious look at the '16 328d for two reasons: The deals are better now than they are likely to be on the 17's and you get free maintenance for the life of the warranty, 4 years, 50 k miles while the 17's will be cut back to 3 and 36, though I believe the basic warranty will stay at 4 and 50. You'll just have to pay for service starting 14,000 miles earlier.
 

Tailwagger

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MA
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2015 A3
So I stopped into my local Audi dealer this morning both to test drive a TT and try to figure out how to proceed. Given ordering takes around 3 months and my estimated return date is 11/1 we're right in the window to do an order. Unfortunately, I wanted to check out a TT-S as well, so I'm going back to next week to do that before I decide what to do. I did however get some key information in the process. I was the first TDI owner they've seen armed with an official print out. The salesman had little to offer so I wound up speaking with the general manager about the process. He examined the sheet, said, 'so you've opted for the buyout', I replied, 'given its more than I paid originally how could I not', to which he said, 'yep, it's a very good deal.' He mention that last week they had been briefed on the program at a sales meeting attended by Audi. He seemed genuine and I trust the info he related is accurate, at least as far as he's been told as to whats going on.

First, the dealership isn't involved in the transaction at all. He said they are giving an Audi rep an office in the dealership to conduct the transactions. Apparently its similar to selling a house. There's a lot of stuff to sign, they cut you a check, and that's that. As Audi is buying your car just as if it was any other private sale, the dealer isn't involved, it is not a trade in and therefore there is no sales tax advantage buying a car from them at the same time.

The second important bit of info is that after the transactions are done, Audi intends to repair the cars and then offer them back to the dealership (not clear if its the one that took it in or the one that repairs it or...) for sale. If the dealer is uninterested, the car goes straight to wholesale. The GM said nothing about what they thought they might do, but he did mention that they still are sitting on a number of new diesels, mostly 3.0s. thus it struck me as doubtful they would take very many in for resale. Anyone that thinks these cars in the near term will rise in value is, IMO, smoking crack. My son is going to college this year, my intent is to hunt around for some form of TDI in January or Feb, when the market is in general tanked and there will be many of these cars looking for new owners.

Finally, they could not confirm or deny that the pre-paid service would be refunded. They did say though that they had some experience in other circumstances where Audi gave a credit if only the first 15K service had been performed. They expected I'd likely get something out of them, particularly if I was dropping one Audi off and driving away in another. I'm hopeful I can get the service plan gratis on the next.

But will it be an Audi? Not clear. I liked the TT, but despite all its rather attractive qualities, what they say is somewhat true. There's more than a little GTI in the car, which while not a bad thing, makes its near $50K price tag a seem quite steep. We'll see if the even more dear TT-S mitigates that sensation. Given the rather stellar C&D review of the 2017 S3 refresh, and in particular the updates to steering and chassis, I could see potentially going that way. That would require a leap of faith though as the first of those cars wont be here until October. OTOH, I'm fortunate enough to have several other cars to drive and so I dont need to hand them the keys and get something else a few minutes later. We'll see.

Anyhoo, I hope this info is helpful.
 
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PhunkFX

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Hudson Valley, NY
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This is excellent and highly helpful information. Thank you. If I decide to sell mine back to Audi, they aren't just going to buy it outright in its current for right? It would have to be bone stock I'd imagine. Right?
 

Tailwagger

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MA
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2015 A3
This is excellent and highly helpful information. Thank you. If I decide to sell mine back to Audi, they aren't just going to buy it outright in its current for right? It would have to be bone stock I'd imagine. Right?
Happy to be of service. As my car's stock, I didnt think to ask. Its rather hard to say. There's nothing in the settlement that Ive seen that says if a car has been modded, they dont have to buy it back, so who knows. I'd get a hold of your local dealer and see what they have to say.

One other thing to consider. From what I was told the process is that you get an appointment date, go to your local dealer, meet with the Audi rep and after the you sign the papers, you hand them the keys to your car and they hand you a check. My guess is, as again I didn't specifically ask, that this is the procedure regardless of whether you are selling the car back or taking the fix and compensation check which means you have to hand the car over to them to get paid. If your car has mods and you want the cash there's no escape unless you just skip the whole thing. They're not going to simply mail you a check and hope you to bring the car in. Car first, cash second.
 

dopechess

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cali
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2013 A3
Thanks for the great info Tailwagger!

But, how did you figure out the turn in date of 11/1/16?

I still have about 16 payments left, i plan on turning it in the very last chance i get. Depreciation free driving? who's doesn't like that?
 

Tailwagger

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MA
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2015 A3
Thanks for the great info Tailwagger!

But, how did you figure out the turn in date of 11/1/16?

I still have about 16 payments left, i plan on turning it in the very last chance i get. Depreciation free driving? who's doesn't like that?
When you follow the instructions from ChinaBob above you register, select whether you want a buyout or compensation and at the end of the process they print a summary that has the estimated date for your appointment, in my case 11/1. Dunno if dates are assigned on a first come, first serve basis or some other set of considerations, but given there are 1/2 million cars to be processed... though far fewer are Audis... its probably all going to take a while. So if you are one of those that did want out sooner rather than later, you probably want to sign up as soon as possible. If not, keep track of whats going on and wait to register.

But my dear, dear dopechess... you are a true Einstein! Fabulous point that never crossed my mind. Assuming you do less than 1K miles a month it does seem indeed like you could keep driving, yet the buyback price remains the same. Not sure you'll be able to hold them off for a year and a half, but every month you do is certainly free money. At this point, I just want to move on, but for those that don't and whose monthly mileage isnt excessive, deferring registration as long as you can is a rather clever strategy... bravo for recognizing it!
 
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