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TDI Power Enhancements Discussions about increasing the power of your TDI engine. i.e. chips, injectors, powerboxes, clutches, etc. Handling, suspensions, wheels, type discussion should be put into the "Upgrades (non TDI Engine related)" forum. Non TDI vehicle related postings will be moved or removed. Please note the Performance Disclaimer.

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Old September 22nd, 2015, 11:28   #1
Wankel7
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Default DLC520 - ALH - what flow stage have you gone with?

I have been emailing with DBW about this but I wanted to see what others have experienced.

I am looking to upgrade my ALH manual with injectors and possibly a Malone 1.5 tune in the future but not 100% sure. I don't want to over power the stock clutch and don't want smoke.

DBW recommend going with a stage 3 flow on the injector setup. I tried searching but I really haven't turned up much information on this topic.

Thanks!
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Old September 22nd, 2015, 11:46   #2
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Originally Posted by Wankel7 View Post
I have been emailing with DBW about this but I wanted to see what others have experienced.

I am looking to upgrade my ALH manual with injectors and possibly a Malone 1.5 tune in the future but not 100% sure. I don't want to over power the stock clutch and don't want smoke.

DBW recommend going with a stage 3 flow on the injector setup. I tried searching but I really haven't turned up much information on this topic.

Thanks!
Found a chart for you.

Stage I: 90-130hp (Standard Flow Setting for most cars)
Stage II: 100-130hp
Stage III: 110-130hp
Stage IV: 120-150hp
Stage V: 130-160hp

When picking out a nozzle, the main thing you want to ask yourself is how far you want to go with mods to the car. You can always send it back to get the flow setting changed, but then, you are without nozzles for a few days. I'd tend to go on the higher range of what you want to accomplish so you have a little room to experiment with if you want to. You can always change the IQ via hammer mod or VCDS once the nozzles are in. Adjusting the IQ would turn down the flow until you wanted to go bigger.

Last edited by panthers89fan90; September 22nd, 2015 at 11:49.
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Old September 22nd, 2015, 11:51   #3
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A little high for DLC520 ^^^^^

Flow Settings:
Stage I: 90-130hp (Standard Flow Setting for most cars)
Stage II: 100-130hp
Stage III: 110-130hp
Stage IV: 120-150hp
Stage V: 130-160h
I originally found the statistics for the DLC Race520s instead of the DLC520s. It has been updated. What are your power goals?
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Old September 22nd, 2015, 11:56   #4
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I originally found the statistics for the DLC Race520s instead of the DLC520s. It has been updated. What are your power goals?
For my clutch not to slip

Sorry I can't be more descriptive that that.

From what I have read DLC520s and a Malone 1.5 should keep me under that threshold. What do you think?
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Old September 22nd, 2015, 12:06   #5
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For my clutch not to slip

Sorry I can't be more descriptive that that.

From what I have read DLC520s and a Malone 1.5 should keep me under that threshold. What do you think?
No one can tell you how far you can go without your clutch slipping. When modding, you are taking chances with something that wasn't originally designed for the car. A slippery slope indeed. If your clutch is in good shape right now, it would most likely last awhile as long as you aren't constantly hammering on it. But everybody is in a different situation. I have a stage 3 tune and I'm still on my original clutch. My clutch is just now starting to give me problems after several thousand miles on this tune. But most likely only being a Malone 1.5, if the clutch is currently in good shape, it should last awhile.
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Old September 22nd, 2015, 12:19   #6
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Good advice thank you

I guess I am having a hard time understanding what the different levels of injector flows mean.

Will a stage 1 injector put the same amount of fuel into each combustion stroke as a stage 3?
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Old September 22nd, 2015, 18:33   #7
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They are flow curves based on pump output.

Just select the power range you are looking for and that is what will be set.

The factory settings are "Stage I" and some refer to this as "Maximum Fueling" which it is not.

Flow curves are used by VW/Bosch for different pump and injector configurations to achieve an optimal performance range for an injector pump combination.

If you are worried about a clutch slipping, Stage I.

Stage III would still keep you under that margin, but it does widen the flow range that the ECU can control.

A tune CANNOT control or adjust the output of the injector, just the control collar. The flow curve is what determines the optimal performance of the Pump/Injector combination and its why you should have an idea of the power you are looking for. This insures the best fuel economy, best performance and least pump stress for a given output of the fuel system.
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Old September 22nd, 2015, 18:39   #8
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So when you look at the potential power that a Malone 1.5 tune makes (137bhp/212lb-ft per their website) that kind of power isn't available if you choose the stage 1 flow injectors...and it would stress injection pump?
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Old September 22nd, 2015, 19:25   #9
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If you want 137hp Select stage III on the flow (Select the Modified Pilot to insure cleanest combustion).
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Old September 23rd, 2015, 03:08   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wankel7 View Post
...and it would stress injection pump?
Every time you start the car.... You stress your pump...

But the good news is that with any nozzle that flows more than stock...the stress is always less...
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Old September 23rd, 2015, 03:24   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wankel7 View Post
I have been emailing with DBW about this but I wanted to see what others have experienced.
I had my injectors overhauled with stage 1 and DLC520 nozzles installed not all that long ago. My car is an otherwise bone stock 03 Golf TDI.

The car works fine and the DLC nozzles provided a little boost in power, but certainly nothing that would bother a clutch...not with the way I drive at least...lol. My mileage stayed about the same.

I tried an ECU tune briefly, but I didn't like it and switched the car back to stock. I know everybody raves about ECU tunes, and they are just fine, I just didn't need it for what I do. I'm a MPG guy, so any more than 90-ish HP is a waste for me.

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Old September 23rd, 2015, 08:40   #12
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I have 4 cars with DLC 520 nozzles setup by DBW. Running Malone stage 2 on 3 cars (with 11mm pumps) where DBW used stage 3 on the injectors. Seems like a very nice combination. One car running stage 1 Malone tune where nozzles are set to stage 1 (stock original 5 speed clutch and my daughter has a very heavy foot). This was a mistake. Should have used stage 2 on the nozzles at least.
Also have one car running a Malone stage 2 tune with PP764 nozzles set to stage 1 with 10mm pump.
I would use the stage 3 setting DBW suggests again without hesitation.
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Old September 23rd, 2015, 08:45   #13
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One car running stage 1 Malone tune where nozzles are set to stage 1 (stock original 5 speed clutch and my daughter has a very heavy foot). This was a mistake. Should have used stage 2 on the nozzles at least.
Can't beat first hand experience!

Could you expand on why you feel the lower stage / flow was a mistake?

In an untuned car would would injectors set to stage 1 make the same power as injectors set to stage 3?
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VCDS -HEX/CAN & VagTacho available

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Old September 23rd, 2015, 08:46   #14
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The Kerma description of the stages are a little different ....

STAGE 1- LOW SMOKE FOR CLEANEST OPERATION [ IDEAL FOR STOCK OR LIGHTLY MODIFIED VEHICLES, OR FOR MODIFIED VEHICLES SEEKING BEST FUEL ECONOMY ]

STAGE 2 - LOW SMOKE FOR TUNED VEHICLES
PLEASE NOTE: STAGE 1 IS THE MOST POPULAR SETTING AND WE CAN ALWAYS RECALIBRATE

STAGE 3- FOR VEHICLES WITH TURBO, TUNE, CLUTCH AND ALSO EXHAUST, CAMSHAFT, AND INTERCOOLER UPGRADES
PLEASE NOTE: STAGE 1 IS THE MOST POPULAR SETTING AND WE CAN ALWAYS RECALIBRATE


STAGE 4 - FOR VEHICLES WITH ALL OF THE ABOVE AND FULL UPGRADES INCLUDING CAMSHAFT, EXHAUST, INTAKES AND CYLINDER HEAD WORK HIGHER SMOKE, REDUCED MPG'S AND NOT FOR DAILY DRIVERS

STAGE 5 - EXTREME CUSTOM SETTINGS FOR VERY HIGHLY MODIFIED VEHICLES
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VCDS -HEX/CAN & VagTacho available

Last edited by Wankel7; September 23rd, 2015 at 08:54.
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Old September 23rd, 2015, 14:03   #15
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Originally Posted by Wankel7 View Post
Can't beat first hand experience!

Could you expand on why you feel the lower stage / flow was a mistake?

In an untuned car would would injectors set to stage 1 make the same power as injectors set to stage 3?
Pretty much for the reason you site from kerma. My car meets more the definition of what he lists for stage 2. I have zero smoke and I cannot even get a slight haze. IQ is set to 2.5.
DBW could best answer your second question.
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