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General Automotive General automotive discussion. This is intended to be a discussion about other not VW and Diesel cars you may have or interested in.

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Old December 9th, 2018, 14:26   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BamaB4S View Post
Originally Posted by 2.2TDI View Post
"Seriously, people need to stop putting vw and their tdis on a pedistal, especially after what they did.."

So what motivated you to register for this forum?

The VW TDI deserves to be on a pedestal due to their lengthy history of durability and performance. Casting stones at the TDI won't resolve any buyer's remorse you may have with the TSI.

LOL


Buyers remorse? Yea a little, only because I still like diesels for what they are.
Had I bought a tdi, it would've only been because of the emotional factor. Instead I chose to use reason in making my purchase and I came to the conclusion that a diesel was completely useless for my given situation, considering that I don't drive enough to ever recoup the 4000-5000 dollar premium that a diesel would've cost me over the TSI

Why am I a member? because I had an ALH tdi for almost 3 years. I truly did like that car, it was great in many respects, and terrible in others... each engine and car has both good and bad

While there are definitely some things which are blown out of proportion regarding diesels to make them look really bad and sway people away from them, I believe the reality is that they are dying and people here seem to want to deny facts and try to blame someone or something because of it...

You guys can keep drinking the diesel koolaid and I would love to do the same, but I am being realistic about what is going on in the world. People in Europe are starting to dump their old diesels as it is becoming harder and harder to register them, or keep them road worthy due to laws becoming stricter. Not only that, their resale value is starting to drop, and at some point the resale value will be utter garbage... just go take a look at Euro 3 or Euro 4 diesels on the market now in some countries. New diesels which are Euro 6d certified have it easier but there are only a handful of them and not everyone is able to afford the latest and greatest technology...

I really don't care what you all think at the end of the day, I just get annoyed with people who have tunnel vision and refuse to believe anything else other then what they think is good. I swear this thread is like 87 vs 91 octane threads in other forums. Some people literally refuse to believe facts and continue with their 91 is good theory based on their feel good assumptions and armchair expertise, or they will find every small factual detail to nitpick about why the 87 may be bad so they make 91 look good. You can easily do the same with the TDI VS TSI debate in this case... go on any other car forum... BMW, Mercedes, Audi or even something like Golf MK7 and see how quickly someone will point out how many things are wrong with a TDI or diesel and will shut down any diesel lover, especially if it's a petrol dominated forum

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Old December 9th, 2018, 22:21   #62
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They had a good 20 year run. But technology marches forward. The diesel/gasser efficiency gap has basically closed now, with cost of ownership favoring the gasser. I loved my father's old two stroke Saab, but it was a filthy machine and life expectancy would be noticeably reduced if everyone drove one. I think tdi nostalgia will have a similar fate.
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Old December 10th, 2018, 04:52   #63
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The diesel/gasser efficiency gap has basically closed now, with cost of ownership favoring the gasser.
I wonder if this is true. I know there's a big gap between gasoline and diesel prices right now, but that tends to fluctuate, with diesel usually costing the same or slightly more than premium unleaded.

I drove my GSW up to Maine and back yesterday. Little bit of traffic, mostly ran with the cruise set at 75 or 78. Temperatures in the teens. I saw 41 on the cluster, which with calibration reads about 1/2 to 1 MPG low. I wonder how a 1.8 TSI would do in the same use. I know people are seeing high 30s in those cars, but I suspect they're the same people who would get 50+ MPG in a TDI because they drive so gently.

I'm attracted to the '19 Golf with the 1.4 TSI and a 6-speed for local daily driving, and using the TDI for longer drives. But i suspect in real world use I'd see low 30s in that car. The GSW does close to 30% better in similar use.
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Old December 10th, 2018, 05:47   #64
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The economical gap is manipulated.

I was under the impression diesel was less involved in refinery processes, yet it costs more?

If it's actually cheaper before taxes and sur charges, then there's the answer.

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Old December 10th, 2018, 06:10   #65
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There is no "economy" when this is your 60k PM:



The first cold weather snap, and these start pouring in.... literally, LMAO. Got another one here that chucked its chains, dead on the lot. *Almost* made it to 100k miles. Almost.
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Old December 10th, 2018, 06:24   #66
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Originally Posted by IndigoBlueWagon View Post
..........
I drove my GSW up to Maine and back yesterday. Little bit of traffic, mostly ran with the cruise set at 75 or 78. Temperatures in the teens. I saw 41 on the cluster, which with calibration reads about 1/2 to 1 MPG low. I wonder how a 1.8 TSI would do in the same use. I know people are seeing high 30s in those cars, but I suspect they're the same people who would get 50+ MPG in a TDI because they drive so gently.
I'm attracted to the '19 Golf with the 1.4 TSI and a 6-speed for local daily driving, and using the TDI for longer drives. But i suspect in real world use I'd see low 30s in that car. The GSW does close to 30% better in similar use.
Girlfriend has a 1.8 TSI Passat and we regularly see 38-40 MPG on a 500 mile round trip with 250 miles at 75-80 and 250 miles at 60. She drives the same car back/forth to school/work and gets mid 20's in the cold winter and right about 30 in the spring/summer/fall. She does not know how to drive for economy. A couple co workers have 1.4 TSI Jetta's one has a ~100 mile highway commute and gets very high 40's and the other has a ~40 mile city commute and he gets mid 30's.

I'd have to agree as stated above that the performance and MPG gap between gas and diesel has more or less closed. Weather the complexity of gasoline direct injection will become a problem - we'll have to see. But I have confidence that a community like this will come up with solutions for them.
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Old December 10th, 2018, 07:21   #67
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There is no questioning the fact that diesel as a fuel in the economy is being targeted massively... Just look at what is going on in France right now. It's all part of the plot to get rid of diesel.

Yet 10-15 years ago, European governments were flocking to diesels because it was proven they are lower emitters of greenhouse gases then their equivalent petrol counterpart. While that is great, the NOx effects of diesel are substantially worse... At least from the old ones they are based on emission requirements from back then (and the fact diesels were never anywhere within those regs). As much as I hate to admit that, it's the reality. Now which continent actually pollutes more NOx is a different story as there are so many variables to consider, but the data here isn't much in favour of diesels either.

If you want to ignore these facts and live in a fairly tale world, that's your prerogative, but that's the reality of things.

Oilhammer, quit getting such a hard on for diesels and wake up to reality. I understand you see a lot of broken gassers everyday, including a bunch of new vws, but I'm curious to know how much your perception is skewed because of this hardcore affection for diesels. If you worked in Europe, you would see numerous amounts of diesels with problems after problems... Because there are many, many catestropic diesel engines which never had a chance to make it over to North America... I know you're going to ignore what I say and continue with your ways, but that is the reality of the matter

I guess ignorance truly is bliss sometimes

As for fuel economy, my tsi is averaging 29mpg since I bought. Most of that is city driving, but since my commute has changed, I have been averaging around 32-33mpg over the last couple months. Yea it's not 40 plus mpg, but with diesel around 30 cents more per liter then 87, the savings of the diesel would've essentially been negated...i did the math when I bought my tsi and it would've taken me somewhere around 5 years to make my money back if I drove 30000km a year, and I wasn't even doing close to that at the time, but I guess numbers don't matter either when you're a fanatic of something

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Old December 10th, 2018, 07:32   #68
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No, YOUR ignorance is on display here. I NEVER said diesels were superior, and gave some examples of some really, really good VAG gasoline fueled engines. Reread my posts.

If they made a diesel version of this idiotic EA888 engine with a plastic water pump housing buried under the intake, it would be an equal level of craptastic fail. Just so happens they don't. The 1.4L turbo gas engine so far has been pretty decent, too (but they are still young). The EA888 engine has now a decade of proven, repeated, constant, failure. Der Fix has yet ANOTHER article on them this month (as they do almost every month it seems).

This is not a gas vs. diesel thing, never was. I own two great spark ignited Volkswagens. 100% reliable, no issues with their engines, and they have already proven their durability. I also have a spark ignited Ford. It, too, will outlast ANY EA888 VAG engine.... probably by several orders of magnitude, LMAO....
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Old December 10th, 2018, 07:52   #69
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No, YOUR ignorance is on display here. I NEVER said diesels were superior, and gave some examples of some really, really good VAG gasoline fueled engines. Reread my posts.
If they made a diesel version of this idiotic EA888 engine with a plastic water pump housing buried under the intake, it would be an equal level of craptastic fail. Just so happens they don't. The 1.4L turbo gas engine so far has been pretty decent, too (but they are still young). The EA888 engine has now a decade of proven, repeated, constant, failure. Der Fix has yet ANOTHER article on them this month (as they do almost every month it seems).
This is not a gas vs. diesel thing, never was. I own two great spark ignited Volkswagens. 100% reliable, no issues with their engines, and they have already proven their durability. I also have a spark ignited Ford. It, too, will outlast ANY EA888 VAG engine.... probably by several orders of magnitude, LMAO....
Congrats

I am not ignorant at all. I realize that the EA888 has its flaws and that there is a possibility that I may have issues in the future. However, I don't go touting around pounding my chest at how great one engine is and how **** another is and how it's guaranteed that it will fail. Last I checked, the EA888 1.8 TSI won a wards best engine award back a few years ago... I don't how much value I'd place on that, and agree that at the time it was also a new engine, but I imagine it must count for something just a slight bit.

With the way you've been displaying your attitude towards the EA888 engines, amongst other gasser engines around here, it shows off as having quite a biased opinion...

My problem with you oil hammer is the way you exagerate and blow things out of proportion. Instead of saying something like "yea these weren't the greatest engines, they tend to have these issues" you just go ahead and post pictures of broken parts and make it seem as if the engine will blow at an minute.

Anyways, I've made my final points so I'm done here
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Old December 10th, 2018, 08:12   #70
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Good, go away. Enjoy your new car. I'll enjoy my old ones.

Oh, the Mustang II and Chevrolet Vega also won awards.
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Old December 10th, 2018, 08:13   #71
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oilhammer isn't alone in pointing out issues with EA888 engines. We have a small local shop here that recently had three towed in for chain issues, in a two day period. All had 80-100K miles on them. And one of our team members here used to work at a VW dealer. These engines were notorious for coming in with multiple failures. And this doesn't even include oil consumption issues. One of our customers got rid of his Audi with a version of this engine because he grew tired of adding a liter of oil ever 1,200 miles, which is not enough consumption to merit any attention from VW or Audi.

TDIs aren't bulletproof. They do have issues, but usually they are with external components, often emissions related. Otherwise they're pretty durable.

There are a number of VW/Audi products I find appealing, but this engine's history keeps me away.
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Old December 10th, 2018, 09:04   #72
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As an aside, anyone know why the '19 Golf 1.4 TSI with an 8-speed auto shows mileage at 24/33, and the Jetta with the same drivetrain shows 30/40? Is this an error?
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Old December 10th, 2018, 17:01   #73
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As an aside, anyone know why the '19 Golf 1.4 TSI with an 8-speed auto shows mileage at 24/33, and the Jetta with the same drivetrain shows 30/40? Is this an error?
That's interesting and disappointing if true. Seems like an error. Are they both torque converter automatics? I hope a manual is an option. My golf is going back this month and I don't know what I'll replace it with yet. A 1.4 tsi manual golf sounds pretty sweet if those fuel numbers are wrong. I also like the gti, but I'm a bit wary after hearing oilhammers experience with those engines. I might get an old '91-95 civic hatchback as a temporary ride until I can make up my mind on a new/newer car.
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Old December 10th, 2018, 17:03   #74
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The 1.4 TSI Golf has a 6 speed manual this year. Nice setup. I've driven a '19 Jetta with the same engine/transmission and it's a nice combo. Not exactly TDI torque, but quick enough. And the engine is pretty smooth. I'd have to get used to the rev hanging between shifts, but I guess that's a necessary evil these days.
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Old December 10th, 2018, 17:15   #75
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Awesome. A 1.4t manual Golf is likely at the top of my list now. Provided it can do better than 33 mpg highway.
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