Cold Weather Performance

It got down to 30F the other night and I had to turn the car over about 10 times before it started. I would not think this is typical behavior. There is also a 3 to 4 mpg decrease in fuel economy. For next winter I would like to install a block warmer and fuel heater.

Are there any recommendations from where to get these parts? I would like to pick up a coolant fuel heater rather than an electric one. I do not want to tap into the juice.

The only block heaters I have found are the kind that heat the coolant. Are there any of the filament type out there?

The glow plugs have been changed and the computer re-programmed by the dealer.

I live in southern Alberta and have only ever found a need for a block heater. Once you have that, a fuel heater is superfluous. For a lot of money, you can go with a diesel powered heater. For a lot less you can go with electric. You won't find a heater that fits in a frost plug for one simple reason: no frost plugs. Go with TDI heater. I put in the 1000 W model and have been very happy with it. It is basically a Frost Heater with the necessary hoses and mounting hardware to fit your vehicle.

which glowplugs and reprogram? first or second? when did you last change fuel filter?

+1 on FrostHeater

thundershorts said:

which glowplugs and reprogram? first or second? when did you last change fuel filter?

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I am the second owner and the PO had the GPs/reprogram done. I have a stack of invoices from the dealer. How can I tell if it is the first or second GP/re-program?

Don't recall seeing anything in the paperwork about the fuel filter being changed. The PO had everything done at the dealer. My first thought on the hard start was the filter.

My only reference for diesel performance in the winter is my 95 E300D. It runs very well in the winter. It does have a fuel heater in it...just the one that MB put on it, not after market.

Dr. Greenthumb said:

It got down to 30F the other night and I had to turn the car over about 10 times before it started. I would not think this is typical behavior. There is also a 3 to 4 mpg decrease in fuel economy. For next winter I would like to install a block warmer and fuel heater.

Are there any recommendations from where to get these parts? I would like to pick up a coolant fuel heater rather than an electric one. I do not want to tap into the juice.

The only block heaters I have found are the kind that heat the coolant. Are there any of the filament type out there?

The glow plugs have been changed and the computer re-programmed by the dealer.

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These cars if set up right will start easily at 30 Deg F Mine started in even very cold weather (in the signel digits F). You car has something amiss. IF the fuel filter has not been changed, change it. Have a guru look over the torsion settings etc with a VCDS or a VAG-COM. Make sure you find someone who really understands VW diesels as they would be the most help. The dealership network is not always the brightest bulb in the bunch.

if you bought the car from the po before nov 2010, the recent gp/flash has not been done. just get it done and notify vw you are new owner so you get any recall notices. then your car will start fine.

forgot to ask, did you change your battery yet?

thundershorts said:

if you bought the car from the po before nov 2010, the recent gp/flash has not been done. just get it done and notify vw you are new owner so you get any recall notices. then your car will start fine.

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Bought the car about a month ago. I will check the dates on the invoices to see when the service was done.

thundershorts said:

forgot to ask, did you change your battery yet?

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No I have not. Planning on upgrading to higher amp battery but don't want to give dealer the $$$ for the battery clamp. No time right now for car work....working 70 hours/week.

leicaman said:

These cars if set up right will start easily at 30 Deg F Mine started in even very cold weather (in the signel digits F). You car has something amiss. IF the fuel filter has not been changed, change it. Have a guru look over the torsion settings etc with a VCDS or a VAG-COM. Make sure you find someone who really understands VW diesels as they would be the most help. The dealership network is not always the brightest bulb in the bunch.

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I have a VAG-COM set up. Is there a source of info on torsion settings?

Dr. Greenthumb said:

I have a VAG-COM set up. Is there a source of info on torsion settings?

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Use search. You will find it. I do remember reading the numbers. But if the battery is original, by all means replace it. Check grounding straps. Don't cheap out on a battery. Get a good unit. The units from the dealer are actually very good. Read oilhammer's post on putting a bigger battery in the car.

In regard to the glow plug recall, the dealer may require you to bring the car in the night before, when the stars are in proper alignment, to prove a hard start, before they will replace plugs and reprogram. A diagnostic fee will likely be in order.
What I chose to do was change my own GPs for about $50 and take it into the dealer for a reprogram on my dime- about $100. It was just not practical for me time wise to play VW's game. We also don't get enough sustained cold weather and the dealer is 120 miles from home, which would require an overnight stay, when the conditions are just right.
Mine would start fine down to 20F, but anything lower was difficult. I had trouble in Col Sprgs, Thanksgiving and Christmas.
Change the FF first, then look to GPs and reprogram. Previous recall campaigns for this issue were a total failure. I won't know till next winter if mine is OK or not, but it does run better.

you really don't need the higher ah battery . as you can see, the original varta lasted a really long time. my bet is that po didn't have the latest gp recall done. all you have to do is call vw customer service to find out. if you want the bigger battery bracket, you can have mine for 10 bucks. unless you are in the frozen north or have lots of stereo stuff, larger battery is not really paramount, only a really good battery.

Wow, nearly half of the invoices were for glow plug issues. The latest one is from April 30, 2009 and about 20K miles ago. They replaced 4 GPs, replaced connector part # 028-971-782 A, and reprogrammed something. It says they performed TSB # 2017520.

The fuel filter was changed about 15K miles ago.

It does get cold enough here to cause issues starting. I live at 5300 ft and work at 7800. It gets really cold where I work. This is why I am looking into block heater, fuel heater, and the bigger battery.

Bigger battery and block heater is a good choice for that area and elevation.

thundershorts said:

you really don't need the higher ah battery . as you can see, the original varta lasted a really long time. my bet is that po didn't have the latest gp recall done. all you have to do is call vw customer service to find out. if you want the bigger battery bracket, you can have mine for 10 bucks. unless you are in the frozen north or have lots of stereo stuff, larger battery is not really paramount, only a really good battery.

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You may be technically right on the battery front, but as cars age, they can become more difficult in the starting department. By God if there is space for a monster battery, I am going to install it. Even my dealership's tech said I was smart by replacing it before it went bad and I was also smart by getting the bigger battery. I do not regret that purchase for one minute.

if the larger battery makes you feel good, do it, but if the car's systems are good, starts for 300k cars should be instantanious after preheat just as a 50k car. the ngk/flash adresses the heating cycle which wasn't too good with the bosch.

I read the write up on the FM100 filter install. How many folks here have done that upgrade? I am interested in the Stanadyne filter because it also allows for a fuel heater install on the filter mount.

My interest in warming the fuel comes from my experience with my E300D during the winter in MI. For half of my first winter driving the car, the coolant would never reach normal operating temperature. I accepted this as normal....until I found a damaged thermostat that was stuck open. I was amazed at the difference once the thermostat was changed. Not only did I have cabin heat, but the car ran a lot better. It idled smoother, had significantly less "diesel" sound, and fuel economy increased. The engine on this car supplies heat to the fuel using a heat exchanger fed by the coolant. I would expect a performance increase on the TDI if the fuel was warmed a bit on those colder days.

thundershorts said:

if the larger battery makes you feel good, do it, but if the car's systems are good, starts for 300k cars should be instantanious after preheat just as a 50k car. the ngk/flash adresses the heating cycle which wasn't too good with the bosch.

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It does, but it does beckon why VW put a smaller battery in a car with a technically bigger engine? The battery in the car now is the bigger battery that other TDI cars came from the factory to begin with.

For me it cost the same whether I put in the smaller battery or the bigger battery, so the cost factor is moot.

(last year's data):

Cost for Walmart MAXX std size battery for Passat = $77 + tax
Cost for Walmart MAXX 94R size battery (upgrade for Passat) = $77 + tax

While you have the battery area open, consider doing the plenum seal upgrade (there is a TSB and a thread here).

I believe many folks here use this frost heater in the TDI:

http://www.frostheater.com/

Tony

the fuel heater is located under the car on the bhw. it has a grid over it to protect it. it is a heat exchanger. also the circuit built into the fuel filter. when you change from the oem filter you lose that feature.

Bosch #48 is an exact fit, vented, and another 85 buck alternative to varta. first one lasted 7 years so they aren't that bad.

thundershorts said:

the fuel heater is located under the car on the bhw. it has a grid over it to protect it. it is a heat exchanger. also the circuit built into the fuel filter. when you change from the oem filter you lose that feature.

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Cool. I won't worry about the filter then. Thanks.

spend the money instead on a battery. Personally I really doubt that the 77 dollar wallyworld battery will give anywhere near the service life of a top quality unit. When things are built to a price, corners are cut in construction and materials. Wally dictates what they want to pay and Johnson controls builds accordingly.

Exactly right on Wally World stuff. If you ever see a HP personal computer with the letter w at the end of the name, that means it is a walmart unit. You can tell they take out some features that a better one from somewhere else will have. My brother is a purchasing agent and has to deal with Walmart from time to time and he has some 'interesting' tales of how they operate.

I buy everything I can from Walmart or thru Amazon. Besides helping to conserve my retirement funds, I am helping to keep the world economy afloat.

I see people knocking Walmart sales of Murphy Oil fuels. I don't have the time (or energy) to expound on how fuels get to market in this country, but let me tell you, Murphy Oil (with a big refinery in Wisconsin and one in Louisiana) is one of the good guys in the business.

aja8888 said:

I buy everything I can from Walmart or thru Amazon. Besides helping to conserve my retirement funds, I am helping to keep the world economy afloat.
I see people knocking Walmart sales of Murphy Oil fuels. I don't have the time (or energy) to expound on how fuels get to market in this country, but let me tell you, Murphy Oil (with a big refinery in Wisconsin and one in Louisiana) is one of the good guys in the business.

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I have no real knock about Walmart, it is just that they will specify slightly fewer or different components so it can come under a certain price point. With my brother the purchasing agent, he's learned to write the contracts slightly differently so his company doesn't get as stung if WM changes their minds about something.

Now if you could buy a VW TDI through Walmart, you could probably get it with roll up windows, and other features known in lesser models of VW. That is something I could embrace. The utter idea of making the TDI a "higher priced" unit is something that takes some of the economy out of the line.

outwardly, the tdi would look same, just with the engine made somewhere we never heard of instead of Poland. Not everything anymore is as it appears, Bosch batteries are made by Exide, in Tennessee. Too bad Rolls Surrette doesn't make car batteries...

thundershorts said:

Not everything anymore is as it appears, ......

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Where's that dumbed_down W_M VW...................??

A French company, Steco used to supply Peugeot with batteries. they were a designer pink. these were soon known as "stinko" by our crew as then had an internal design flaw that caused them to explode when large amounts of current were drawn starting the car. Spectacular results including buckled hoods and lots of acid ooze. we had lots of opportunities to see internals. used to buy baking soda in bulk. virtually 100% failure rate. maybe thats one reason why I'm battery aware and won't use anything but quality ones