New clutch screech

Before coming down on my mechanic that put in the new clutch, I want to run the symptoms by the club's collective wisdom and confirm my diagnosis.

Background story goes like this.
Southbend stage 2 daily was installed 70k miles back along with a new 21lb single mass flywheel. It worked great until I overheated it badly trying to drive very slowly on a flat tire. Destroyed the disc. Long story short, it was time for stage 2 endurance.

The bill for installing the new clutch included a hefty charge for machining the flywheel. As it turns out, said mechanic had a spare flywheel sitting around, that was already machined, so he put that in, instead of mine, having told me that it was the exact same 21lb single mass. Fine. I paid the bill.

Right off the bat I thought that engagement was a little rough in 1st gear, but I didn't say anything thinking maybe it needs some breaking in.

About 1500 hard driven miles later, not only the engagement is still rough, the clutch has developed a loud screech, very similar to a brake squeak, mid-engagement, apparently upon contact with the flywheel. If I let go of the pedal slowly, I can keep the screech going for 2-3 seconds, and it hasn't gotten any better in about 600 miles since I first heard it.

Also, my motor mounts are relatively new with 70k miles on them, yet simply sitting at a traffic light idling, I've noticed an unhealthy shake every now and then. Also, there's no chatter when disengaged, that I used to hear with my previous clutch.

My worst suspicion is that I got a junk flywheel. I haven't looked at anything under the hood yet. Haven't brought it back to the mechanic either. I'd like your guys opinion on what's going on before I take any steps. Also, both slave and master were replaced as part of the install, fork, brake fluid flush too.

I'm getting exactly this
https://youtu.be/0BlJTemglq4

Not saying it is normal or OK but about 500 miles or so after installing a SB stage 2 endurance clutch kit (new) in my vehicle, I get a similar screech at same the engagement point.
It's been a couple years and still there. Does not seem to effect performance, just an extra noise.
Again, not sure if it is a problem developing or not.

All kinds of things are going through my head. Although I have little reason to doubt the installer's integrity, he did explain the heavy machining charge - $125! - by mentioning that dual mass flywheels are expensive to work on. This was over the phone, so before I realized he was talking nonsense, the conversation was over. I purchased the stage 2 endurance myself and it was for a single mass, so if I got a dual mass flywheel, I didn't get the clutch I brought him in a sealed box. A little far fetched, I know, but I've driven my stage 2 daily for 70k miles, and this one just feels very different.

I tried listening for the chatter that a heavy single mass flywheel is supposed to produce with ALH's when disengaged, the sound that took me a while to get used to. Nothing. There's practically no difference now with the pedal in or out. I can't say there's a huge difference in RPM drop rate between shifts, but I do think I lose more than I used to with the daily. Don't know what to think any more. Also, driving through a quiet block last night, I thought I heard that subtle shuffling sound that dual mass flywheels make when close to failure...

Other taking the whole thing apart, do I have other options for checking out the flywheel, perhaps through the inspection hole?

I'd suggest checking out other parts of the drivetrain (axles, CV joints) and mounts.

I think that if you pull the timing peep hole plug out and shine a light in the bellhousing area you should be able to tell whether it's an SMF or a DMF. I "think." NOTE: I did not do that on the wife's car; had established that the clutch was going to be replaced, preemptively at 200k miles; trans removed to show it had an SMF (already)! - didn't like the clutch (Valeo), so new DMF (Luk 17-050) went in as planned.

Have to wonder whether a DMF could hold the kind of power that your engine is putting out. Pretty sure there are heavier duty DMFs out there, though I don't know how available: nor do I know how one could take an existing DMF and harden it up.

Sometimes weird crap just pops up. After putting on a lot of miles on a new DMF in the wife's car she encountered some sort of really stinky smell coming from the engine bay. By the time I'd gotten my hands on the car the smell had diminished substantially. Although one could say that the smell might be like that from a disk lining, it didn't really jump out as such. And there's absolutely no slipping in this clutch: I took it and beat the snot out of it; when I'm of that mindset if something is going to break it's going to break! This has been maybe a couple thousand miles ago. Nothing since. For sure, DMFs are smoother (it's their nature/design): and the one in my Golf with the 02m is silly smooth.

I don't have an answer, but I wanted to put my two cents in on this...

I've had a similar experience with my SB Stage 2 Endurance. It was great for about 6 months, then I started getting a vibration and squealing during mid-engagement. This is with the SB 21lb flywheel. It's been doing this for about a year now... it started with the squeal every so often, now it's basically every mid-engagement.

In addition, I've also go an issue where every so often it's like my starter gear hits a 'flat spot' on my ring gear, causing a crunching, whirring sound and the engine won't start. When I hit the key again, it fires up instantly with no sounds.

Even though you're not using the SB flywheel, I think both of our issues could be flywheel related.

UhOh said:

I'd suggest checking out other parts of the drivetrain (axles, CV joints) and mounts.

Click to expand...

Coincidentally, I just had the passenger outer CV joint replaced last week, after ignoring a torn boot for about a year. That eliminated the loud knock I was getting for a good part of that year. I had the driver side up in the air checking for obvious play. Nothing jumped out at me, but i do feel a vibration under hard acceleration that feels like its on the left. Probably an original oem joint there, never serviced.

Not sure how that specific squealing moment relates to the CV joints. It's not when the wheels first move, and it's not when fully engaged. I'd say it's at like 30% of the way there. Does happen in reverse, happens on later shifts as well.

So far everyone that has recognized this behavior is dealing with a stage 2 endurance clutch, most of you with a new flywheel. Interesting... might be worth contacting SBC on this.

p377y7h33f said:

So far everyone that has recognized this behavior is dealing with a stage 2 endurance clutch, most of you with a new flywheel. Interesting... might be worth contacting SBC on this.

Click to expand...

I'm open to helping support this case if you contact them. I figure if a few people have the same issues on that clutch they might give it more attention and help rectify the issue.

I also have the Southbend Endurance Stage II. I too have the squeal and shudder about half way through engagement point. Clutch was installed about 2 years ago. All this started from day one.

I've had two SBC Stage 2 Endurance clutches in my Wagon, one with the OE DMF, and another with a 21 lb. SMF. Never had the noise described or in the video. However, with both clutches I found they were a lot smoother when you did a few hard launches every once in a while. Otherwise they would start to chatter.

Call SBC and ask for Jon in Imported Cars and describe the situation. He may tell you that you're getting some kind of glazing on the flywheel from the Feramic material on the disc (it's on the flyhweel side only). Or he may say you should send it in for warranty inspection. Our experience is that SBC is very reasonable and fair with warranty claims. But if the issue is with a non SBC component (the flywheel) or the install, they won't, of course, warranty the clutch.

dirtride said:

Not saying it is normal or OK but about 500 miles or so after installing a SB stage 2 endurance clutch kit (new) in my vehicle, I get a similar screech at same the engagement point.
It's been a couple years and still there. Does not seem to effect performance, just an extra noise.
Again, not sure if it is a problem developing or not.

Click to expand...

I have the same noise and have had it for the last 125,000 miles. Clutch has always worked fine but it is annoying.

My first SB Stage II did that as well. It seemed to have noise as described by others.

I think the issues with squealing are related to the metallic surface which is the engine side of the clutch disc. The organic side of the clutch disc is most likely quiet engaging the pressure plate but metal on metal should make some noise as this surface is contacting and grabbing the flywheel. You might even hear some quiet squealing/rattling with the clutch depressed and engine is idling.

Imagine your brakes when the pads wear out and you get metal on metal. Pretty noisy!

However, this metal on metal is the design of the clutch and should not be considered as worn out, just normal for this clutch.

Wild guess here did he use the plastic centering tool for the clutch or a socket/ wrench end? Might ask to borrow his centering tool and see if he has one. Should use the tool and put in the bolts, some of these problems sound like the clutch was not true'. Or maybe someone did not use thread lock and a bolt fell out and is jammed somewhere or a combo of both.