Meyle Coil Spring? Quality?

Hello all!

My first post so I appreciate any help on this one.

Long story short I recently acquired a 96 Passat TDI and I'm going through everything. I've put a ton of new parts in it fixing random issues and I'm getting near to reliable DD.

I had a 98 Jetta already and started borrowing parts off it. I installed the front struts/springs because the strut/bushings/bump stop/bearing were new less then 5k miles ago. This poses a problem because the springs are softer and struts not as tough and the TDI actually dropped about an inch. (No good!) Doing this fixed my shimmy issue as the old bushings were shot and I was tight on cash.

Does anyone have experience with the Bilstein and Meyle coil spring combo? They are both pretty cheap on AutoHauz AZ right now. I can use the old springs if I have to but the TDI has an unknown milage as the cluster was changed at some point to a VR6 cluster by the PO so I believe they are well over 200k miles and original.

Thoughts?

Your drop in ride height is probably because the struts for a Jetta are designed to ride a little over an inch lower when installed on a Passat..... read through this thread....
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=487968

That was my thought as well, comparing the two side by side the spring seat is definitely an inch lower, and I'm sure the spring itself also has something do to with it. I'm not happy with my ride height and I'm wanting to get back to stock ASAP.

I agree with the comments on that threat but I'm talking more about the spring. I've read through everything I could search on the springs but most only discuss the struts themselves. I'm wondering if anyone has experience running the Meyle springs and if they hold up well.

anything that says meyle on it is questionable, of course the price is good, buy better springs, the shocks bilstiens are real good. they come in several types. 1 is about a stock setting, nice ride, good quality, lasts a good time, there are different stiffness as the types i said, up to street-n-strip, very stiff.

I hear you on that, but on that college budget so I might have to try them. If I pull the trigger on it I'll keep a running log to keep others informed. I picked the Bilstein TC's for the shocks so we shall see how the Combo works. Updates to come.

as it turns out i happen to have a car with them on(meyle springs). i didnt buy them, its not really my car, i didnt install them. they are at best ok, its like the kyb shocks, meh, ok at best. they re soft like a little softer than stock springs. i much prefer VW stock springs. they are ok, like i said. anything that is marked meyle is about bottom-of-the-barrel as far as quality, it ll be/seem affordable, no wonder, they are not *very good, just ok.

I would run used springs before I put Meyle springs on my cars.

Is there a reason as to why you say that? I've seen you post before about staying away from Meyle springs but I can't find a whole lot of information on them.

I have only found the Meyle HD strut mounts to be even remotely non-garbage, every other Meyle part has failed early. I have never used their springs but have used plenty of used ones with great results.

as it turns out my mk3 has lo-mile springs, oem. when we got the car, quite some time ago the suspension was switched, lowered springs(eibach me thinks), and a set of those adjustable &stiff konis. well to say i doubt i ll ever lower a car again. oil pan got rubbed (good) for years, can we all hail how the oem german oil pans held up?? and one of the jack points took a beating. when that same set up was put in another car(mk3 as well, obv.) it didnt last long in that car, some months later because of the lowering kit it lost the oil pan and i had to fix the problem, where it lost oil pressure and stalled. that car is now on that other set of springs, hate that brand name. anyways the original springs that were taken out, many years ago, i made sure to set-up with my new b4 bilstiens. works out nice, very lo-usage on that set of springs.

Abacus - I will probably use the old springs, I'm only concerned that the used springs will cause my struts to go out early. Good thing they have a great return policy and I'll end up putting the money into OEM or suplex springs from IDparts.

iluvmydiesels - I hate how close my pan is to the ground right now, it scares me every time I pull out of my drive way. I'm fabricating an aluminum skid plate next. Can't seem to find a vender that sells one anymore. Good call on the bilsteins. I can't wait to get mine on!

TBOxnitemare said:

iluvmydiesels - I hate how close my pan is to the ground right now, it scares me every time I pull out of my drive way.

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for stock ride height there should be little if any worry of oil pan getting close to ground, a couple of points i can make. my point in above post is i had that kit was Waay low. as low as a mk3 can go, in my estimation. 1 i assume this is your 'new' car, you acquired. so you may not know prev.owner, in anycase its a good bet you have about no idea on maintenance(even if you happen to have a few prev.records). so its a good bet the old struts(and suspension in general, prob in its entirety) have gone that far, if so it may well work on the springs, in that case it may be a good idea to swap in new (preferably VW)springs. and while your at it work on all new suspension parts. like i do, i just last spring swapped in all new suspension, this includes a-arm bushings(get them pressed in), and everything else, tie rod ends, bearings(front and rear), ball joints, you get the point. and i work on new parts as well for my brakes as well, while im doing this suspension work(again front &rear both). <new fluid, prob a good idea new M/C, and i like to do axles as well(napa are about $50 each axle-complete), not a bad idea here to swap in new P/S fluid, just to complete job and system and such, dont forget the new rubber(if you can), and i take to one of my favorite shops for a good alignment to finish off the work, and drive away>>>.

I don't mind the stock height but a skid plate never hurts. One less thing to worry about you know? You've done a lot to your vehicles but I guess I should expect that from TDIclub members at this point!

Oh I've been going through this car 100%. The PO didn't do anything. I have a long list already including timing belt, water pump, fuel filter, air filter, valve cover gasket, air oil separator, all new calipers and pads and rotors, new lower control arm bushings, tie rod ends, lower ball joint. That is just the start, the list is much much longer!

TBOxnitemare said:

You've done a lot to your vehicles but I guess I should expect that from TDIclub members at this point!

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most / all contributing members have good experience, as you can tell we work on our own cars! some may own related business. these cars arent too difficult to do your own work on. i suppose VW designed them with this in mind(from the early '70s, and perhaps before). that stopped (industry wide). as you may be able to tell these cars can be reliable. i dont know for sure about mk3s and 4s, i do have good reliability and such with mine(mk3s), early mk1s and mk2s were very reliable, and can still be running. 3s with all the engine electronics, and management, and later years design i do believe lack over all longevity, yet many, like ours are still going.
so anyways aside from a long post,history lesson, it looks like you have a lot planned for your new acquisition, and maybe can handle it. hope you have a manual for it. think its the red book, mine is red(& a jetta), then again checking you have a 96, so its 2years earlier than mine, cannt be sure which book(color). so hopefully, on your budget, you can get her straightened out. gl. will be here.

While it's arguable that the Mk3 tdi cars were built better or were more reliable than their gas counterparts it's not a stretch to think that they were less problematic than the gas cars or were treated better.

The AAA VR6 cars often were beaten because they were power houses. The ABA cars were basic transportation and they had some faults that angered their owners. Also they were not powerful so they were pushed about as hard as a driver could in an attempt to get them up to speed. Once both these were into the high miles and in the secondary market it was all over as a complete car, especially for AT cars where failure was assured, that is unless it was a GTI VR6 car, which was more what the kids were looking for, Jetta GLX too I guess.

The above scenario is very dissimilar to what happened to the Mk3 TDI cars, which for the most part went to people who 1) had been waiting for VW to return diesel to the US market for years and 2) recognized that they were important in an environment where fuel prices were very high (remember $5 diesel and $4+ regular gas in 2008?).

A lot of the TDI cars did not suffer the same fate as their gas counterparts, they went to owners who were very much interested in making them last for the long haul, and that's why we have owners and cars on here with 350k-450k miles and still going up. And people who are not afraid of cars with that many miles either, which says a lot for this engine.

I'm sure my take is skewed a little but that's what I see as pretty reasonable view on the situation.

Steve

I like your view point. My dad and I have a similar situation to your statement above! He has always been a Honda fan until the last couple years when he purchased a cheap, beat up Jetta from a woman who knew nothing about cars. She claimed that the car would not run and had a blown motor. This was the 98, 2.0 L manual if I remember correctly. My dad gave it the once over, pushed it in gear and found good compression so he took it home for pennies. All it needed was a new battery and fuel pump and she fired right up!

All this to say I believe VW has gotten a bad rap over the years. Simple maintenance on the older models kept them running. Large engine bay, easy to understand parts, and functional design are the backbone of VW. Most are either to lazy or don't care enough to want to fix them.

Thank you for the input Steve, I'm glad I pulled the trigger on this TDI.

one thing steve points out. a lot of vws have gotten beaten on and had lasted a good while. about the only 'bad rap' VW has gotten, thats correct is a lot of dealerships had under-par service, as far as you bringing you car in and getting work done. they in the past have had a very low industry rating. do your own work, and when you need a shop for help and/or such as alignment--know one!

As far as replacement Springs go, ID parts is carrying both the Moog brand and the Suplex brand. I realize the Moog brand Springs may not have the highest rating but if they were that bad idparts would not sell them.

I saw the suplex but I didn't notice the moog. I'll look at those.

I also found a set on Bora parts but they have no description on where they are from or who makes them. Set is $50 so I emailed them asking for more information.

Update:
I installed the Bilstein TC struts, Meyle springs, CPR bearings and mount, Febi bumper, and Meyle strut cover. The build was pretty straight forward. I forgot to purchase top spring seats so I reused the old ones and they seem to hold up fine. What a difference in height! Even my old Passat struts must have been completely worn out because the car sits 2 inches taller.

So far they seem great, not super stiff but not soft either. I like the combo but I'll keep updating if something new happens.

TBOxnitemare said:

Update:
I installed the Bilstein TC struts, Meyle springs, CPR bearings and mount, Febi bumper, and Meyle strut cover. The build was pretty straight forward. I forgot to purchase top spring seats so I reused the old ones and they seem to hold up fine. What a difference in height! Even my old Passat struts must have been completely worn out because the car sits 2 inches taller.

So far they seem great, not super stiff but not soft either. I like the combo but I'll keep updating if something new happens.

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You're ok reusing the old metal bits as long as they're not completely rusted out and weakened, so upper spring seats are ok used. I've reused metal items (excluding strut bearings) often, only the rubber bits are the things that need to be renewed.

On my B3V conversion I used lower mile used front struts from a 97 Mk3, which is fine because those are actually pretty close to being the same as what they used on the B3 originally, but they will need to be replaced soon. The springs are also Mk3 but they're striped for HD AC/AT cars.

The rear are KYB installed new 23k miles ago so they will be on there for a while longer. I have new Sachs for the rear when the time comes. Rear options are getting few and far between....

Steve

Nice save on the front strut conversion!

I plan on getting Bilstein TC rears and I'm not sure on the spring brand yet, probably something from ID parts this time. They are also a little soft but I didn't have the cash for now. They for sure will get updated before the end of next month!

I'm grateful my rear bearings are in decent shape and I added some grease. Considering doing all of the rear suspension including bushings etc.

the front strut upper spring seats can be tricky. i have at least 2cars(mk3) that those upper spring seats are a fit for the plus suspension.(im not 100% sure if the plus suspension is the vr6 set-up. anyways>). if you put the std suspension spring seats on the top of the shocks(im mean struts) and springs and they dont fit that specific car, i think the cap bearings dont turn. can be problems. so you need the seat that came off what you took out. so i tend to have ordered a set for a car. (after finding out which one).

TBOxnitemare said:

Considering doing all of the rear suspension including bushings etc.

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if i recall correctly. the rear has bushs in the crossmember that the arms come out of/from. bolted in. im not sure of other -rear- bushings. unless you also have a rear roll-bar.

iluvmydiesels said:

the front strut upper spring seats can be tricky. i have at least 2cars(mk3) that those upper spring seats are a fit for the plus suspension.(im not 100% sure if the plus suspension is the vr6 set-up. anyways>). if you put the std suspension spring seats on the top of the shocks(im mean struts) and springs and they dont fit that specific car, i think the cap bearings dont turn. can be problems. so you need the seat that came off what you took out. so i tend to have ordered a set for a car. (after finding out which one).


if i recall correctly. the rear has bushs in the crossmember that the arms come out of/from. bolted in. im not sure of other -rear- bushings. unless you also have a rear roll-bar.

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All Mk3 cars, 4 & 6 cylinder, post-1996, got the better front strut mounts / bearings from the "Plus" suspension that was first used on the VR6 cars.

There really shouldn't be a Mk3 TDI car in the US that has the older style mk2 mounts in front. Same for the spring hats in front, those are specific to the Plus mounts and ditto for the coil springs as well, those are specific to the Plus spring hats.

You will have to use the Plus mounts and (separate) bearing on any Mk3 TDI car here in the US if it's equipped with the original style coils in front.

There is no way I would want to refit a car that used the Plus components in the front back to the older type Mk2 stuff, those really don't last all that long and it would be a hassle to find the springs to work with the older Mk2 stuff anyway.

Steve

Steve is correct on my style struts/springs in the front. The seats are separate and the bearing rests on top. I find the design quite interesting.

Update April 29th: Noticeable difference between old set up and new set up. My front end vibration is gone and the Meyle springs are quite nice with the Bilstein TC struts. I've had them on since last Thursday and about 500 miles so far with no issues.

Steve Addy said:

There really shouldn't be a Mk3 TDI car in the US that has the older style mk2 mounts in front. Same for the spring hats in front, those are specific to the Plus mounts and ditto for the coil springs as well, those are specific to the Plus spring hats.

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i hadnt realized, directly, those hat and set-up were based on a mk2, although definitely are similar. the manual doesnt make it clear that (should be all cars) fit the plus suspension.
the spring top hat and bearing(cap)set up that (supposedly)fits the 'normal, or standard' suspension set-up i dont think fit or work in the shock mount opening that shock/strut fits thru (in body), and 'bolts down'.

iluvmydiesels said:

i hadnt realized, directly, those hat and set-up were based on a mk2, although definitely are similar. the manual doesnt make it clear that (should be all cars) fit the plus suspension.
the spring top hat and bearing(cap)set up that (supposedly)fits the 'normal, or standard' suspension set-up i dont think fit or work in the shock mount opening that shock/strut fits thru (in body), and 'bolts down'.

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The opening is the same between the newer and the older strut mounts. The early Mk3 4 cyl cars, 1993-96, used the Mk2 mounts which were a combination of a rubber mounting with a bearing permanently installed. The 97-99 Mk3 4 cyl cars got the mounts/spring hats and coils from the Plus suspension first fitted to the 94 Jetta GLX and the 95 GTI VR6.

I never much liked the Mk2 type mounts, the center core tended to pull away from the rubber, the later style was a big improvement.

Steve

I haven't been driving the car at all as I was waiting for a new turbo. I was under the car today and the springs are seated correctly and still look great. I'll be driving again by the end of the month and hopefully have some more miles on them.