Noise/static on AM radio?

vwestlife

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2004
Location
central NJ, USA
TDI
1997 B4 Passat TDI sedan (sold)
When I first got my '97 Passat TDI, it came with an aftermarket AM/FM/CD radio which did not have the correct antenna adapter to feed +12V power to the antenna's amplifier. Needless to say, FM reception was poor, and AM reception was completely non-existent.

I replaced that radio with a Clarion OEM "Premium Audio" radio that was originally in my sister's '96 Golf. I previously had this radio in my '91 Golf (with the regular fender-mount antenna) and it had perfect reception on both AM and FM, so I know it's a good radio. With this radio installed, I can tell the amplified antenna is working, as FM reception is about as good as I would expect and I can actually get reception on AM, not just blank channels.

But, its reception of weaker AM signals is marred by a constant loud hiss, and especially towards the higher end of the band, there is a constant "computer whine" -- the same kind of noise you get if you place an AM radio too close to a computer that's on (or, really anything with a microprocessor in it -- VCRs, fax machines, printers, etc. can all make this "computer whine" on AM radio).

The first thing I noticed is that in the Passat, the metal case of the radio is not grounded, as all it touches inside the dash is plastic. So, I took a piece of wire and connected the radio's case to a metal frame bar inside the dash. This reduced the AM radio static by a noticeable amount, but it's still there, strong enough to drown out reception of weaker signals.

Since that "computer whine" definitely sounds like it's coming from something with a microprocessor in it, I thought the car's ECM might be the cause. I pulled the fuse marked "Engine Electronics" -- no change! So, I pulled all the other fuses to try to track down the cause of the interference. None of them eliminated it completely, but I did notice the "computer whine" reduced quite a bit when I pulled the "clock" fuse (which made the instrument cluster go blank). And in other experimentation, the noise is also reduced a lot when I turn on the headlight switch, which lights up the instrument cluster's backlighting.

In my next round of troubleshooting, I unhooked the radio from the car's DC supply and powered it with a seperate gel-cell 12-volt battery. This did not cause any noticeable change, so I disconnected the car's antenna and used a piece of wire as a makeshift antenna. While this reduced the noise on AM, it also reduced the reception of even strong AM signals, as the wire doesn't have the correct length and position to serve as an effective car radio antenna.

So given this evidence, can anyone help me track down the source of this annoying AM noise/static? I know the radio itself isn't causing it, because I held the wire antenna right up to the radio's LCD display and it make a completely different-sounding kind of interference than what I've been hearing constantly.

Could the anti-theft alarm system be causing this interference? It looks like the alarm system is non-fused and is powered whenever the car battery is connected, so if it's the cause, that would explain why the noise never went away completely when I pulled all the fuses. I also have noticed that unlike my sister's '96 Golf and my dad's 2002 Golf, my Passat does not beep the horn when the alarm is armed, and I don't ever see it flash the parking lights when it is armed or disarmed. The only indication I have that the alarm is doing anything is the red blinking light in the driver's door, which does go on when the car is locked. (But this may be normal for a B4, as the owner's manual doesn't make any mention of beeping or lights flashing during arm/disarm.)

So if there any easy way to completely disconnect the alarm system, so that its "brain" (wherever that may be) doesn't receive any power? Of course, I can just disconnect the car's battery, but then the car would be undrivable. If the alarm system really is the cause of all this AM radio noise, then I can easily live without it, as it's virtually worthless anyway -- the wimpy "meep... meep... meep" of a VW alarm barely even scares away my cat, let alone a potential thief!

This is rather annoying because one of the smaller reasons why I chose a diesel is that it won't have the "AM buzz/crackle" caused by the ingition system in all the gas-engine VWs I've owned... but instead of that, I get AM radio static that is even worse, even with the engine turned off!
 

Chramiec

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2004
Location
Olympia, WA
TDI
2005.5 Jetta +'96 Wagon
If I knew what I was doing, I would have done all of the above to find out why the AM on both my B4's absolutely sucks! I'm glad to know that had I done all this I'd be where I am today. I know this whine you speak of well. With my old '84 diesel Jetta I could often fix it by turning the fan on and off, not so with the B4's... I often find myself wishing I brought my portable shortwave radio when there's an important Sonics or Mariners game. Luckily, I've been fighting the B4-AM hiss less with the M's being what they've been lately. Any help appreciated.
 

RIP TDI

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Feb 16, 2000
Location
Santa Barbara, CA
TDI
'15 GSW SE 6MT...... '01 Golf GLS 5MT.... '96 Passat Variant....
Some ideas:

Did the '96 Golf have a fender antenna? If so, it's HU may not be supplying 12V+ to the antenna. It would have sounded fine in your '91 w/ fender antenna, and may have better FM/AM reception than the aftermarket HU w/o adaptor but more subject to noise than signal loss. I have one of my Passats wired so that with ignition off/radio on, the antenna is unamplified; ignition on/radio on, the antenna is amplified. I get suprisingly decent AM/FM reception when antenna is not powered and terrific reception when it is.

Was the aftermarket HU installed with the slice and dice method (vs. harness adaptor) and could the K-wire have been cut and not currently fed to the OEM HU? If so, it probably wouldn't cause your symptom, but who knows?

Does the noise improve by having someone rotate/pull the antenna base while you listen with ignition on? If its poorly grounded, it would probably cause some reduction of signal as well noise, but worth a try anyway. And, as you know, failure of the amplified bases are not that uncommon.

Because the B4 antenna is amplified, signal-to-noise deficiencies may arise more readily under weak AM signal conditions than would the same HU with a passive antenna.

You may be onto something with grounding, but gounding the HU case might not be as effective as checking the grounds of the likely suspects: instrument cluster, light switch, etc. You might experiment with a grounding jumper from the HU's ground LEAD (not your case ground) directly to the battery and/or to the suspected component ground points.

If all else fails, get a 12V+ antenna adaptor and try the aftermarket HU again for noise comparison. I have aftermarket HUs in both my Passats and have no noise on AM, but I vaguely remember some degree of noise with the OEM HUs.
 

vwestlife

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2004
Location
central NJ, USA
TDI
1997 B4 Passat TDI sedan (sold)
Did the '96 Golf have a fender antenna? If so, it's HU may not be supplying 12V+ to the antenna.
I measured 10.8 volts at its antenna terminal with the ignition off. That's a little low, but with the ignition on and the alternator putting out ~14 volts, that should bump up to the correct 12 volts going to the Fuba amplifier.

I do find it a little strange that VW chose to combine the DC power supply with the antenna wire... that means on a car with a regular fender antenna, anyone who grabs the antenna when the radio is on is at risk for electric shock!

Was the aftermarket HU installed with the slice and dice method (vs. harness adaptor) and could the K-wire have been cut and not currently fed to the OEM HU? If so, it probably wouldn't cause your symptom, but who knows?
Thankfully, the aftermarket radio was installed with wiring adapters. I just unplugged it and plugged the VW radio into the factory connectors. And as far as I know the B4 doesn't have a K-wire... it does have a wire connected to the "ALM" (alarm?) terminal on the factory radio, but I'm not sure what the purpose of that is.

Does the noise improve by having someone rotate/pull the antenna base while you listen with ignition on? If its poorly grounded, it would probably cause some reduction of signal as well noise, but worth a try anyway. And, as you know, failure of the amplified bases are not that uncommon.
I did try jiggling the antenna and base all around with the radio on, with no noticeable change/improvement in reception. I'm willing to try installing a new antenna base, but first I'd like to track down the exact cause of that pesky RF interference.

I also tried replacing the whip with a generic one from Pep Boys, but it didn't provide any noticeable improvement in reception, and it ended up causing wind noise -- it's a testament to how aerodynamic the B4 body is, that something as small as a Fuba-style antenna can cause audible wind noise. With my A2 Jetta, there was so much inherent road/wind/drivetrain noise at highway speeds that I could put a big honkin' CB antenna on it and never hear the difference!

Because the B4 antenna is amplified, signal-to-noise deficiencies may arise more readily under weak AM signal conditions than would the same HU with a passive antenna.
I do understand that, but the AM reception on my dad's 2002 Golf TDI is fantastic in comparison... when you tune in a very weak signal, there is no noticeable noise/interference (at least with the ignition off).

At least this gives me one more excuse to keep my 260,000+ mile 1985 Mercedes 300D... it doesn't have a single microprocessor in the entire car, so AM reception (with the original German-made Becker radio) is clean as a whistle. And in my old 240D, I had a radio with Longwave and Shortwave bands... it was really neat to listen to the BBC, Deutsche Welle, or Radio Moscow on the drive home from work!
 

vwestlife

Veteran Member
Joined
Dec 1, 2004
Location
central NJ, USA
TDI
1997 B4 Passat TDI sedan (sold)
BTW, the interesting/annoying thing is that my AM reception quality can vary quite drastically from one moment to another. Sometimes it's so filled with noise and static that I give up and switch to FM... but then a few minutes later I switch back to AM and then I can actually hear the weaker stations again! I suspect a bad/intermittent ground somewhere. Can anyone identify the electrical grounding points on a '97 Passat TDI, besides the ones in plain view?
 

bmike

Thread Killer
Joined
Jan 3, 2002
Location
central CT
TDI
1998 Jetta - sold, 2010 A3 - sold
I have had the same AM static problem on my A3 and it gets better if I remove the radio and re-seat the antenna cable to the back of the radio. FWIW.
 

rdkern

Top Post Dawg
Joined
May 21, 2004
Location
Humboldt Co CA
TDI
Passat 1997 silver (sold after 11 years), Jetta 2000 atlantic blue
A quick look in Bentleys indicated that the radio is grounded beside the fuse/relay panel. I hope this helps - keep us informed.
 
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