what a mess

ok i bought i 2001 jetta tdi about 6 months ago. i new the injector pump was going bad because it was making the tell tell noise. i told the guy selling it, he said thats what the dealer said but the mechanic who did his timing belt said that didnt make any since the pump was in the tank. (i should have ran)

I put a stethoscope on the valve cover and the pump and it was definitly the pump. 2 weeks ago im going down the road and i get a sound like a bunch of marbles going threw the motor(might be an exageration). the noise stopes then it drives a mile then and dies.

i order a pump and a belt kit since i cant trust his mechanic. the old water pump was not changed or any of the small rollers(one was bad). and the new tensioner he used was crack and the spring was coming out the side.
also the cam is cracked were he torqued it using the cam holding plate.

now the problem. i put it all together and it runs great. (thanks to the great how to on doing the timing belt here). the problem is that i have noise like a bad lifter. i put my handy stethoscope on it and the pump makes noise but is acceptable. i couldt get the cam exact because of the slack in the bracket. could the cam being off cause the car to "diesel". this is what the car sound like but i know they are not to be loud for a diesel.

is it also possible that when the pump when and the belt was under tensioned that the timing belt sliped and ive got some valve damage(would it run so good). or do you have a better idea.

thanks for any suggestion.

ps i will spell check this tonight when im on a computer with spell check. lol

Off with her head!

i was afraid you were going to say that.

ditto... sounds like the mechanic screwed up 2x... I'd bet he didn't have it done correctly... were there any marks on the belt path?

no belt looked right plus i think he used the right tools, but not right, since he cracked the end of the cam.

how hard is it to take head off. ive done several heads before including a honda and couple american v8s. if its ok what should i replace before putting it back on gasket and anything else. also if its got dent valves cant i check the compresion or do i have to pull the head.

Pull the valve cover first. Look at the lifters. They will often tell the tale.

Are any of the lifters domed/cracked/shattered? If so, head has to come off.

i looked at them when i did the timing belt didnt see any damage will look again tonight.

see if you can pull the camshaft and pull all of the lifters out... look on the top of each lifter where the keepers are... any mushrooming? it's a good time to take a look at/replace lifters as well... I've started doing mine at 100k miles...

it runs so good. i would think that if i had valve damage it would run bad. ill look at the lifters tonight and see.

im not mistaken about these engines am I? they dont sound like a diesel. I know they sound a little like a diesel. but ive been next to other vw tdis at lights and they dont sound like this. i might have heard pds. this sounds like i put a cummins under the hood.

is your electronic timing set too far advanced?

45 at 144. i didnt even have to adjust it after the belt replacment.

the only thing that might be off a little is the cam since the tdc holding bracket is real sloppy from were the cam it brocken on the end.

Is it an auto or stick?

megha_jones said:

it runs so good. i would think that if i had valve damage it would run bad. ill look at the lifters tonight and see. . . .

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Unfortunately, this is not always the case--sometimes during a botched timing belt job a valve and piston will meet and the valve gets slightly bent, and I emphasize 'slightly.' The motor runs fine after the work is done, but the valve stem is on a path to certain failure as it gets stressed every time the valve is closed. One day a few months later, BAM, valve breaks off and causes massive engine damage.

This is why it is so critical to have somebody who really knows what they are doing working on your engine.

Now I'm not saying that this is what is wrong with your car, but it would be wise to rule this out.

There are other things such as a sticky injector, leaky injector sealing ring, or air in an injector line that can cause excessive noise as well.

with the cam off, could you not make an adapter to screw into a gp hole to allow you to fill the cylinder with compressed air? If a valve was not seating correctly (bent or burnt) you would hear air escape out either the intake or exhaust side. I've done this with gas-powered engines. Do need to keep in mind the engine may turn over a bit when filling with air, but with all the valves up, it shouldn't hurt anything.

auto_tech said:

with the cam off, could you not make an adapter to screw into a gp hole to allow you to fill the cylinder with compressed air? If a valve was not seating correctly (bent or burnt) you would hear air escape out either the intake or exhaust side. I've done this with gas-powered engines. Do need to keep in mind the engine may turn over a bit when filling with air, but with all the valves up, it shouldn't hurt anything.

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__. It's good when this works but on a diesel, you're talking about *very* strong springs. That's the problem -- the springs will pull that valve closed and seal it off but it's pulling the valve straight when it's bent. The valve stem becomes like a wire coat hanger bent back and forth a few times. Except a wire coat hanger won't drop the head off a valve into your combustion chamber .

then its not just a head but pistons.

ok cam was a little ahead but not much fixed this and its a little quiter and has better power but noise is still there.

how much time to take the head off. and if its ok do i only need a new gasket.

oh all the lifters look good of course i didnt pull the cam out just looked as i turned it over.

no one ever answered my question about how much noise these cars make. i still have the dampining off the bottom of the engine. and it just might be me.


its a five speed bob.

you sure this is not just the noise that our beloved tdis make and not an unusual noise?

The pd's are a lot quiter than the ve engine's. Mine is noisy like a diesel should be.

I have all of the sound insulation off of the car... it sounds like a baby diesel... my wife thinks it's cute...

yea im thinking its just in my head. pardon the pun. everything looks good runs good and the belt never broke. the pump whent out.

im might just pull the head and check out every thing out. a new gasket, lifters and some head bolts cant hurt. whats it take 4-5 hours?

that beats having to buy a new head and pistons latter.

go for it.

mrGutWrench said:

__. It's good when this works but on a diesel, you're talking about *very* strong springs. That's the problem -- the springs will pull that valve closed and seal it off but it's pulling the valve straight when it's bent. .

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Wow, why is a diesel valve spring stronger than a gasser valve..
A new one on me and one for the books..

my past experience with springs is that they vary and the ones that have the closest tolerences have to be stronger to eleminate floting at high rpms. this eliminates a piston to cylinder colision at high rpms. so i would think that since diesels are impact engines the would have rather strong springs. stonger than a yugo's but not as stong as a race gaser engine right.

dont know for sure.

but now for a real question.

i ordered a set of the ARP head bolts. then called my vw dealer to see if they had the head gasket in stock. he said that they need to know if i have a 1,2, or 3 holler. insert your own joke here since thats what i did. my question is is there any way to know before you take the head off or is their a universal head gasket or somthing the dealer doesnt know so i can have it ready so im not waiting for parts once i have the head off.

megha_jones said:

my past experience with springs is that they vary and the ones that have the closest tolerences have to be stronger to eleminate floting at high rpms. this eliminates a piston to cylinder colision at high rpms. so i would think that since diesels are impact engines the would have rather strong springs. stonger than a yugo's but not as stong as a race gaser engine right.
.

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Think about this. diesels are low RPM engines as compared to any gasser. Under your assumption the gasser should have big heavy, strong springs, yet they don't either..

dont know for sure.
.

Click to expand...

then why make a post if you do not know

StarTechMB said:

Think about this. diesels are low RPM engines as compared to any gasser. Under your assumption the gasser should have big heavy, strong springs, yet they don't either..

then why make a post if you do not know

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Most gassers aren't inference engines and those that are still have a lower CR.

Has anyone compared cam profiles?

Bob_Fout said:

Most gassers aren't inference engines and those that are still have a lower CR.

Has anyone compared cam profiles?

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Its obvious you are just guessing for the sake of posting something.

It detracts from ones credibility to do this.

StarTechMB said:

Its obvious you are just guessing for the sake of posting something.

It detracts from ones credibility to do this.

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You only addressed one part of megha_jones' post, and not the other part. I was asking about the other.

Since you know, inform us about cam profiles and CR of TDIs and gas engines that are interference. Compare and contrast.

ive worked on alot of gasers and have seen smaller cams and larger cams than my tdi. ive also delt with lower compression and higher compression. i would then asum that some gasers have softer springs but I know that a race gas engine has stronger spings, if it doesnt have 2 springs on each valve. so i think its a question that cant be answered unless you compare it to one motor or more to the point, a stock intake spring out of a 1986 mustange with the 351 in it you cant know.

oh yea any one know about the head gasket. what is difference between 12 and 3 hole modles.

ok i got my answer thanks kermatdi.