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VW MKIV-A4 TDIs (VE and PD) This is a general discussion about A4/MkIV Jetta (99.5-~2005), Golf(99.5-2006), and New Beetle(98-2006). Both VE and PD engines are covered here.

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Old March 25th, 2002, 14:19   #1
flappie
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Default VW TDI common rail

NEWS!!! I have seen (not yet driven... [img]images/icons/frown.gif[/img] ) the new Volkswage TDI - engine, With Common Rail.

The had built it in a large Transporter (LT) (it's a large Van overhere in Holland)

This probably the answer to the polution quest(?)
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Old March 25th, 2002, 17:04   #2
solstar
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

The end of the Turbo Direct Injected (TDI) Motor and the advent of the Rail! [img]images/icons/cool.gif[/img]
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Old March 25th, 2002, 17:21   #3
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

I'm waiting for Michael Moore to get us all the part numbers and pictures so I can piece one together here. [img]images/icons/tongue.gif[/img] [img]images/icons/grin.gif[/img]
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Old March 25th, 2002, 18:02   #4
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

Quote:
Originally posted by solstar@ev1.net:
The end of the Turbo Direct Injected (TDI) Motor and the advent of the Rail! [img]images/icons/cool.gif[/img]
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Are common rail and TDI mutually exclusive? I thought MB CDI engines were both. [img]images/icons/confused.gif[/img]
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Old March 25th, 2002, 18:10   #5
John C
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

Since TDI stands for Turbocharged, Direct Injection, common rail and TDI are not mutually exclusive. Common rail uses a high pressure pump to pressurize a 'rail' above the injectors, which are then operated by electric solenoids (really fast acting!)rather than by fuel pressure from the rotary pump on earlier TDIs.

This fuel system allows more flexibility in reducing noise and emissions by rate shaping the fuel delivery to the cylinders rather tahn just dumping it in when a pre-determined pressure is attained. An example is called pre-injection, which shoots a small amount of fuel into the cylinder to light the fire before the main charge is injected. This reduces the 'Diesel knock' common to most Diesels at idle, for instance.

It also has future capabilities in emissions lowering scenarios, of which I'm not allowed to discuss! Suffice to say, 2007 is not an impossible hurdle for Diesels!
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Old March 26th, 2002, 06:50   #6
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

I was not aware that VW has gone common-rail? [img]images/icons/confused.gif[/img] I thought they were pretty steadfast on Pumpe-düse?
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Old March 28th, 2002, 01:29   #7
flappie
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

According to me TDI stands for Turbo Diesel Intercooler ( also accoriding a german brochure???) Because evry Diesel is injected!

So SDI stands for Sauger (to suck in german) Diesel Intercooler...... [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif[/img]
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Old May 18th, 2002, 15:56   #8
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

I don't think a SDI has an intercooler. I think it doesn't need one as the air doesn't get hot due to the turbo.
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Old May 19th, 2002, 02:36   #9
MUNICH_DIESEL
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

TDI = turbo direct-injection
SDI = "sucker" direct-injection

the new european engines with 100/130/150 hp have the add "PD" which stands for "pumpe duese" (pump nozzle)

the Benz-CDI's technology is different (and makeable for gas engines as well, the Japanese already released some GDI-cars = gas direct injection, and a new mercedes 2.0 L CGI = common rail gas injection has been released)
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Old May 19th, 2002, 09:14   #10
PackRat
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

Quote:
Originally posted by flappie:
According to me TDI stands for Turbo Diesel Intercooler ( also accoriding a german brochure???) Because evry Diesel is injected!

So SDI stands for Sauger (to suck in german) Diesel Intercooler...... [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif[/img]
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I wodered what the S in SDI stood for.
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Old May 19th, 2002, 16:56   #11
think diesel
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

Flappie:

1) TDI stands for Turbo Direct Injection
2) SDI's do not have turbos or intercoolers

I am 150% sure of both of those facts.
Whatever you are reading is a misprint or you have misunderstood it. Sorry.
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Old May 19th, 2002, 17:03   #12
think diesel
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

FYI: Volkswagen uses pumpe-düse on it's smaller TDI engines, like the 1.4 liter 3 cylinder and 1.9 liter.

The larger engines such as the 3.3 V8 TDI in the Audi A8 and the V10 5.0 liter TDI mack daddy engine are COMMON RAIL, not pumpe-düse. I am not sure if this is for engineering reasons or what, but that is the way it is. Common rail VW/Audi TDI engines ALREADY exist and are on the road. It sounds like the news here is that they are replacing the 102(?) hp 2.5 liter TDI Transporter engine with a more powerful common-rail unit (the current motor uses rotary injection like our the quaint 90 hp antiques we still get here in the U.S. [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

I am not sure if there is a pumpe-düse TDI V6 yet. I beleive the 2.5 liter 180 hp V6 TDI is using the older rotary pump design, but maybe I am wrong. Anyone across the world there know?
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Old May 20th, 2002, 01:45   #13
flappie
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

I'm sorry guys, according to a german brochure TDI stands for
T= Turbo
D = Disel
I = Intercooler
and
S = Sauger
D= Diesel
I = Intercooler
and according to ETKA a SDI also has a intercooler and a low pressure turbo to suck the air throw the intercooler... [img]images/icons/rolleyes.gif[/img]
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Old May 20th, 2002, 01:48   #14
flappie
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

I have spoken with the local VW dealer, The common-rail TDI engine is only going to be put in a LT (Larg Transporter) (Big Van overhere in europe) They do this to see what is better PD or Common Rail...)
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Old May 20th, 2002, 05:01   #15
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Default Re: VW TDI common rail

Quote:
Originally posted by think diesel:
FYI: Volkswagen uses pumpe-düse on it's smaller TDI engines, like the 1.4 liter 3 cylinder and 1.9 liter.

The larger engines such as the 3.3 V8 TDI in the Audi A8 and the V10 5.0 liter TDI mack daddy engine are COMMON RAIL, not pumpe-düse. I am not sure if this is for engineering reasons or what, but that is the way it is. Common rail VW/Audi TDI engines ALREADY exist and are on the road. It sounds like the news here is that they are replacing the 102(?) hp 2.5 liter TDI Transporter engine with a more powerful common-rail unit (the current motor uses rotary injection like our the quaint 90 hp antiques we still get here in the U.S. [img]images/icons/wink.gif[/img]

I am not sure if there is a pumpe-düse TDI V6 yet. I beleive the 2.5 liter 180 hp V6 TDI is using the older rotary pump design, but maybe I am wrong. Anyone across the world there know?
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Interesting, I think I've read somewhere that V10 is a PD.

EDIT: Yes, V6 180 hp is a rotary Bosch pump (059 130 106 E), and the place where you can read that V10 is a PD is Volkswagen Technik Kompetenz, go to www.volkswagen.de, select Kompetenz from one of the menus and then click on the V10 TDI on the left.

[ May 20, 2002, 04:27: Message edited by: PTC ]
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