Audi Allroad TDI Conversion - 2004 Passat BHW

Hi - veteran lurker here...starting on a build worth a build log.

I found a 2005 Audi Allroad Manual with a broken timing belt 2.7 for a reasonable price and a week later I found a 2004 Passat Wagon TDI with a leaking Tranksmission for a decent price. Two road trips later...they are at my house.

The TDI runs, but pukes oil from the tranny if you try to drive it. The Allroad turns over and the transmission seems to shift and clutch operates. Both cars look totally stock and are ~175k miles on each. The AR is in really nice shape and looks garage kept.

A big thanks to wingman and the others that have done this before and shared knowledge. I am totally interested in suggestions and ideas on best ways to accomplish this swap.

So far, I have pulled the Engine and Tranny from the Passat and kept everything nice and tidy. I am tearing down the engine for a rebuild before install. There was alot of Oil in the intercooler from the Tiurbo leaking oil. I got the valve cover off tonight and it doesn't look too bad.




Cam Wear
TDI Pulled

Now for the 1st crazy idea...Since I am rebuilding anyway...i was thinking about three internal changes.

1. The engine is the Automatic BWH and has the short Crankshaft end. The Frankenclutch recipe seems good, but I was thinking about changing the crank to the one from the AVF,AWX,BGW Manual Transmission engines. Should be part #038105021K and I can get a new one for about $650 delivered or used for about $350 delivered. Crazy or good idea? Please feel invited to share your opinion...really

2. There are some aftermarket Stage 2 Cams that claim to be spiffy. Colt comes up often in searches and seems to be a quality cam. Over a grand for cam, lifters, bearings, bolts and such. Is this a worthwhile upgrade?

3. Balance Shaft delete with BRM Parts

Any suggestions besides those? Turbo, exhaust and tune will be also done...gotta get rebuilt for a start

Thanks!

For #1, I wouldn't bother.

There are at least two (me being one) 6 speed 01E BHW conversions out there with the standard crank, with about 3.5mm of input shaft engagement in the pilot bearing.

Mine is up to 160,000km/100k miles with no issues or excessive wear on the input shaft - no funny clutch engagement, just normal operation.

Changing over the crank to me is a cure looking for a problem.

Thanks - I was really trying to figure out if I was crazy on that one. Could you share your clutch recipe that you're happy with? I will plan on keeping the original crank and save the $$

Sachs SRE 240mm with OE DMF: http://www.darksidedevelopments.co....ssat-audi-a4-audi-a6-1-9-2-0-tdi-6-speed.html

Went with the organic disc and have never had any slippage issues.

Note that going with 240mm required an EU only diesel starter, and a 5.5mm spacer between the engine and trans.

There are SMF flywheel/clutch solutions out there that allow the OE starter, but can accelerate synchro wear / issues.

thanks...i apreciate it. motor going to machine shop next week for rebuild

Uhhh, nix the SMF idea. Been there done that, got a t-shirt that didn't fit. Haha

In my AR conversion, it droned so bad at 2000 RPM's I just couldn't take it and bought the SRE clutch.

The SMF works fine in my 5 speed Passat though.

Sounds like there is a consensus for the Darkside Clutch kit...When I get to the clutch part...i'll get that one. Thank for your input.

Frans sells them too. Both are great vendors

Thanks - I did not realize that he does new parts too.

I am working on finishing up the teardown of the engine to go to the machine shop next week for the rebuild. The goal is a reliable engine with a bit more power and longevity.

I am planning on a standard rebuild with new bearings, rings, valve job, etc. I will be doing the Balance Shaft Delete also.

I am trying to decide on a cam that is likely to last longer than stock and produce a bit more power. The Colt Cam seems good, but there are two other that I am aware of: Frank06 and Darkside. I suppose an OEM Can could be considered.

Since I have a proven tendency to overthink stuff...anyone want to share an opinion on what they like?

Thanks and have a great day!





Engine

TDI Engine is fully torn down and going to the machine shop this week. All the bearings looked great and I don't see anything scary. I get to start ordering parts soon. I need to work on the 2.7 removal.

I have lots of pics of the engine parts if anyone wants to see anything...

I finally got the AR Engine out and need to get the TDI Rebuild finished and start installing things.

I will need to buy Motor/Trans Mounts soon. I am doing the Balance Shaft Delete and was wondering what works best - 034 Street Firm Mounts or OEM Type?

Mine's deleted, I have a factory 240mm DMF with a sachs SRE clutch (So you know the level of vibration).

I found the best mounts (least vibration) are the factory engine mounts, and transmission mounts (hydraulic) from a W8.

I also paid special attention to engine and trans placement on the mount surfaces - all mount bolts loose > gently lowered engine and trans combo > tighten everything. So that no mount is laterally loaded.

Even with that there is a decent amount of vibration when cold (up here in Canada), but quiets down once the mounts warm up.

Don't notice at all in the summer months.

I would not want to mount a deleted BHW in a B-chassis (longitudinal) on any kind of poly mount unless you want your fillings to come loose.

/\Ditto X 10! /\

Thanks! I really appreciate your detailed reply. I'll probably replicate your solution.

morgancanfield said:

Thanks! I really appreciate your detailed reply. I'll probably replicate your solution.

Click to expand...

I wanted to clarify one thing - I used factory engine mounts for my BHW, and the factory transmission mounts from a W8 - I did not use W8 engine mounts.

I also tried the stock 01E 6pd solid style mounts for the transmission - I found that the W8 hyd trans mounts dulled the vibration ever so slightly more than the solid OEM mounts.

Also, when engaging in all my mount-related schenanigans, the greatest gain (for me) was when I replaced the transmission mounts - there was an improvement when I renewed the engine mounts, but the improvement (vibration-wise) was more noticeable when the transmission mounts were replaced.

Unless the engine mounts were leaking, I would replace the transmission mounts with the W* Hyd versions, and then drive the car to see if the NVH was acceptable.

Only if not would I replace the engine mounts - but I think you will need to get them no matter what as you are swapping out the 2.7T and will need BHW engine mounts.

If you were me...would you consider keeping a geared balance shaft? Its not too late for me to go that route...

In Nevada? Probably not.

The BSM quells second order vibrations - primarily in the 2000 rpm range.

I find that the only time the lack of a BSM bugs me is when the car is started and driven from dead cold when temps are -10c or below.

In the summer it doesn't bug me, and when the car has warmed, same thing.

The other thing to consider is cost - a new 100mm hexshaft geared BSM is something like $1300USD - the parts to convert to ALH pump with BRM gears is $300ish? I can think of a lot of extra uses for the extra $1000.

That said, there are a lot of examples of cars with BSMs that vibrate excessively, and examples of deleted cars that run very smooth - seems to be hit or miss.

There have been some AllRoad BHW conversions that vibrated excessively, but I seem to recall that was more a lack of DMF - but I might be mistaken on that.

Thanks - I even have the delete kit parts already. I have the dmf clutch from Ryan also...just need to get the beast back from the machine shop.

Go delete and DMF. Been there done that. The AllRoad really does a good job of taking out the vibrations. Same engine in Passat was much smoother in the AllRoad as if the BSM was back in it.

Happy New Year!

I have all kinds of fun going on the car...

Euro Trans, Diff coming from Dutch Auto
Steering Rack out and will get rebuilt while easy access
Rear Seats, Front Big Brake Kit and other goodies from 4Rings2Turbos Partout
Alcantara Grey Headliner from a S6
Still need to finish the motor rebuild - will get Pistons/Rods from Frank,as boring was needed.
Engine Bay is nice and clean after lots of work

Two quick Questions....

1. Anyone know the proper way to power up the car when the Engine and ECU are out? I put in the battery, but no power to car. I suspect I need to get power to the fuse panel and not kill any parts under there. I need to open the sunroof

2. Since I will have the headliner out and part of the sunroof removed, what would be a proper maintenance plan? Obvious cleaning of drains, but should I do any gaskets or mods?

Thanks!

Assuming LHD is done the same as RHD, the main power cable comes through the firewall near the wiper mechanism and bolts on to the positive battery terminal. All you need is power to that and ground and the car should power up with the key. Watch out for the other end of the starter / alternator cable since that's part of the positive battery terminal.

Subscribing for engine knowledge and swap knowledge. I was looking into doing a b5.5 tdi swap to a 6spd 4motion...but stumbled/had the idea of an AR swap, and it has won both my with and my hearts. So. Ow learning as much as I can. If you can post good info on wiring conversions that would be awesome. Mechanically I am not worried, it is just electrically and ecu coding.

I am still curious, does the AR harness conect to the BHW ECU, or do you need to unpin and repin the AR harness into the passat harness?

I am getting closer to learning the electrical answers...no practical experience yet

You can close/open the sunroof manually with the allen tool on the back side of the motor cover. If you don't have that it is a 4mm allen. Just make sure you push up when turning the allen wrench.

As for wiring a BHW to an AllRoad. It's not too bad. I spent more time studying the wiring diagrams than installing the engine and gear box just to make sure I had a home for each of the wires from the BHW.

Installing and wiring a CJAA from a 2013 Golf to a 2012 Tiguan was more of a challenge even though they were built on the same platform.

just a little feedback from me as well...

did 2 longitudinal swaps so far - B5.5 W8 Passat and a B7 A4

for the B7 I used a BEW engine so no BSM delete necessary - used stock mounts for the engine and transmission and used the 228mm Valeo SMFW kit so I can retain the BHW starter - car is very well behaved and there are no odd noises or rattles of any sorts...holding the shifter I can't feel a single vibration come through it - it's solid...now the whole car does vibrate with a normal diesel vibration but nothing I can accredit to the FW...speaking of which - that package dynoed at 310ftlbs and had no slippage...I'm at 10k+ since I installed it in the car with very heavy driving and it still feels like new

For the B5.5 I used a BHW engine and deleted the BSM - I can't tell any difference between the two cars...I also used the same clutch kit for the passat as well with the same end goal in mind - retain stock NA parts for cost and serviceability...both cars run great and I have no issues with vibrations on either...

just food for thought - imported clutches from Europe sound Gucci but I don't think they're necessary...what hp/tq levels are you going after with this build?

vwztips said:

You can close/open the sunroof manually with the allen tool on the back side of the motor cover. If you don't have that it is a 4mm allen. Just make sure you push up when turning the allen wrench.

As for wiring a BHW to an AllRoad. It's not too bad. I spent more time studying the wiring diagrams than installing the engine and gear box just to make sure I had a home for each of the wires from the BHW.

Installing and wiring a CJAA from a 2013 Golf to a 2012 Tiguan was more of a challenge even though they were built on the same platform.

Click to expand...

Thanks...any advice on where to find wiring diagrams for the bwh? I understand the bentley book does not have them...