Help me pick a car

Hi, I posted in here last year about a Jetta I was considering, and ended up not buying. Now I'm back with another one I'm thinking about...
Some history-- I'm looking to replace my commuter car which is a 2002 Honda Accord with 200k miles and a bad transmission. It was showing signs last year and it finally failed about Christmas. I've been daily driving my 2011 corvette, which isn't a lot of fun in an Ohio winter, even with the small amounts of snow.
I've considered buying something like a chevy volt, but I keep coming back to a tdi. I don't want or need anything fancy, just the best commuter I can buy for $5,000, give or take. I'm not sure what years are best. I found an 06 Jetta with 120k miles on it for $5200. Also have seen a few 03-05 with under 100k for the $2-3k range. Are either of those style generally more reliable than the other? I've still got garage space if needed and I'm only looking at well maintained cars with records.
Side note, but it seems that beetle tdi are considerably cheaper than Jettas. I was surprised by that.

03s are known to be good years... with that said they are getting old too!

Auto or manual? If manual I'd go for an 03-05 golf/jetta, if auto I'd go for a 2005.5-2006 jetta BRM with a DSG.

If you want a super simple car that still gets good fuel economy, the 8th gen civics are really well built and cheap. Will get better mileage from a mk4/5 VW diesel but they're more complicated and more likely to give you issues. Would go for a VW since you're in the rust belt, all a matter of personal preference.

How long is your commute?

belome said:

How long is your commute?

Click to expand...

^^ This Exactly. You can't own a TDI and drive it 2 miles one way to work. It will die, quite literally. In order to have a TDI live as long as possible, and keep it's peak performance and efficiency, you need to have a commute that's at least 20 minutes. City driving is fine, but a TDI has to reach operating temp and stay there for a bit for it to remain a healthy, happy engine. Anything less than 20 minutes and I'd suggest a Volt. Can't beat that electric motor and plus not using any gas if your commute is short enough.

merk said:

03s are known to be good years... with that said they are getting old too!

Click to expand...

Right. I specifically went looking for an 03 myself because I wanted the newest ALH I could get my hands on...and found one. I love the car and it runs like new, but it is 14 years old now, and I have spent thousands on it (and it's still no show car).

Knowing what I know now, I would have searched for a 2006 BEW Golf. Only because it would be the newest Mk4 TDI Golf I could buy. I'd go for manual trans, as low mileage as possible, and preferably no sunroof.

I'm not sure I'd recommend a 2006 BRM Jetta. I have one, but I was warned not to buy one. I haven't driven it much yet, so I can't comment too much about the car, but I'd be looking for a lot of paperwork proof of work performed before I'd buy one.

On a good note...the 2006 model cars are still covered under the VW corrosion warranty. There may be a few 2005 models still covered...but not for much longer. It's a good deal imho if your car qualifies.

Having had ALH's,and now a BEW, I also would go for the newest MK4 bodied car I could find.
On a side note, as I have now sold all our ALH's, as a 2nd car for all the local, short hop driving we do here in hill country, we got a 2nd gen. Honda Insight Hybrid [a gift from my 93 y/o dad who wanted "something new"].
It gets close to 40 mpg around town with none of the diesel warm up issues and it saves wear on the BEW.

Find the best '99.5 - '03 Golf/Jetta/New Beetle (if you don't mind the Beetle) for $2,500 - $3,000. You may want to look further south, perhaps in Georgia/Virginia/Tennessee. You'll be less likely to encounter rust. Further south like Florida and Texas, and you see sun damage to headlights, headliners, clear coat, and door cards.

Find the best car you can. I wouldn't be a stickler about service records, just make sure the car hasn't had any major failures. I personally would be reluctant to buy a car that's had a timing belt failure or a catastrophic turbo failure, although turbo replacement is OK. Look for manual transmission cars only. I'd stay under 300K total miles unless you find a real nice example with higher mileage.

Make you best deal and spend the remainder of the $5K on catch up maintenance. Timing belt, clutch, suspension, steering, brakes, tires, whatever it needs. You'll end up with a good, reliable, fun to drive car that won't always be requiring repairs.

Here's a couple examples:

http://greenville.craigslist.org/cto/5958178702.html

http://atlanta.craigslist.org/eat/cto/5954590627.html (higher miles but new turbo and IP)

belome said:

How long is your commute?

Click to expand...

Commute is 30 miles each way. 40 if I drop my daughter off at school in the morning.

Any MK4 car that's in decent shape and isn't beat to death. Expect maintenance work on any car you buy.

turbovan+tdi said:

Expect maintenance work on any car you buy.

Click to expand...

Exactly!

I took a big gamble on the 03 wagon. It's not the best, but it was fairly cheap. I have about $6ktotal into it so far (a bit over $3k purchase price), which includes new brakes, TB, full suspension refresh, HID headlights (w/projectors - also added fogs) and a tune. $6k was my target. And keep in mind that I didn't go low budget on anything here: one could have probably knocked off $1k for lesser quality parts (Koni Reds aren't cheap!). I have yet to drive the thing since completing the suspension work (just wrapped up a couple of days ago and am finishing the lighting work), but I figure that it would be hard to get a car that drives and performs like this one for $6k. About 160k miles on it (and compression is great, as are all vital stats).

I've decided this is what I want, but I'm gonna wait a couple of months if I need to. There's a few really cheap ones on autotrader that look good and have good maintenance. I also found a mk4 with 491k miles but it's no less money than one with 150k, so...

Finding an ALH is not as easy as it was a year or two ago, and wagons are even more rare. It took about 2 months of scouring autotemptest.com every single day. We found an '03 wagon with 240K miles, a bad automatic transmission, and a rust-free body. Got it for $2,500. The 5-speed swap added another $2,500 and my son now has a solid vehicle for $5,000.

I handed my own '03 ALH wagon (that I bought new) down to my daughter. I have taken great care of it. It has 332,000 miles and runs like new. She takes it to college in the mountains (5 hours one way) and I never worry about her breaking down.

Can't say enough about those cars.

It really comes down to how much you're willing to pay. Around my neck of the woods people are asking upwards $7 (have seen asking prices near $10k) for wagons. Many will sell for a price!

Unless you're extremely fortunate (it can happen, but only if you're patient, and most likely when you're not expecting it [as was the case with the acquisition of my blue Golf]) you're looking at at least $5k. Anything that's under that price is likely going to need the difference in repairs. And keep in mind that something can go belly-up out of the blue (heater core; IP or turbo), things that are hard to forecast at any time of inspection (might be fine but then a short while later completely fail- each is/can be right in the $1k ball-park to repair [heater core is much cheaper if you're willing to do the work!]).

Benefit for me is that I work at a dealer, so I can use a rack for repairs if I need to. My goal is $5,000 but that's just a goal. If I find a great one for $7,000 I'd consider getting it.
My wife can't drive manual, and there are some rare times that she drives my car now. I still would rather buy a manual, and that's what I'm looking for. I'm fine with a Jetta or a beetle.
Totally unrelated to tdi, but I'm finding a whole lot of newer jettas, current body style no. Tdi for under $5,000... is the tdi really worth getting a car that's potentially a decade older and with an extra 150,000 miles on it? My guess is the tdi with 250,000 miles will last longer than a gas Jetta with 120,000 but that's just a guess. Plus, I'm probably the only person in the world that just likes the way a diesel sounds.

jason0423 said:

I've decided this is what I want, but I'm gonna wait a couple of months if I need to. There's a few really cheap ones on autotrader that look good and have good maintenance. I also found a mk4 with 491k miles but it's no less money than one with 150k, so...

Click to expand...

It used to be that TDI prices showed a seasonal pattern that negatively correlated with diesel prices: highest prices in the spring and summer, when diesel was cheapest; and lowest in the fall and early winter, when diesel was typically most expensive.

There is still a seasonal pattern to diesel prices, but diesel is no longer $1/gallon more than regular gasoline from November thru February.

Still, with a couple hundred thousand fewer TDIs now on the road than there were a year ago, there could be a fairly sharp spike in prices for used TDIs later this year. Basic economic principles suggest that this could happen. So if you want to buy a TDI, I recommend buying the best one available now, and to not wait too long.

TornadoRed said:

It used to be that TDI prices showed a seasonal pattern that negatively correlated with diesel prices: highest prices in the spring and summer, when diesel was cheapest; and lowest in the fall and early winter, when diesel was typically most expensive.
There is still a seasonal pattern to diesel prices, but diesel is no longer $1/gallon more than regular gasoline from November thru February.
Still, with a couple hundred thousand fewer TDIs now on the road than there were a year ago, there could be a fairly sharp spike in prices for used TDIs later this year. Basic economic principles suggest that this could happen. So if you want to buy a TDI, I recommend buying the best one available now, and to not wait too long.

Click to expand...

I actually wondered about that, and what will happen now that they're starting to get some of the recalled tdi fixed.

Hi Jason, sent you a PM

100's of TDI's are written off a year here, plus the other engines so parts are going to start drying up,

Wagon's here fetch between $5-10,000 for diesels, sedans and Golfs average $3-$4500. I am selling a Jetta TDI to my sister-in law for $3000 and I did all the maintenance, including the timing belt.

jason0423 said:

I actually wondered about that, and what will happen now that they're starting to get some of the recalled tdi fixed.

Click to expand...

Here are some of the recalled TDIs, in the parking lot of the former Detroit Superdome. There are more at the Norton Air Force Base near San Bernardino, that closed 22 years ago, and near the Port of Baltimore.

According to AutoWeek: "the crusher is exactly where these cars are all headed if the U.S. government doesn’t approve some sort of emissions system fix. Even in that case, said fix might be too expensive to implement economically, so again, it’s off to the crusher

TornadoRed said:

Here are some of the recalled TDIs, in the parking lot of the former Detroit Superdome. There are more at the Norton Air Force Base near San Bernardino, that closed 22 years ago, and near the Port of Baltimore.
According to AutoWeek: "the crusher is exactly where these cars are all headed if the U.S. government doesn’t approve some sort of emissions system fix. Even in that case, said fix might be too expensive to implement economically, so again, it’s off to the crusher

Click to expand...

Wow... the dealership by me has about 25 new 2015 parked off to the side and maybe gen owner turn ins out back. I was hoping that once the fix came out, they would fix them and sell them at 2 year old prices but with no miles. Guess not.

What a shame. Think of the emissions from moving these things around and then in their final disposal.

Wonder if these might not end up in some other country? I know that these things would be WAY cleaner than most of the diesels currently running in the Philippines!

TornadoRed said:

According to AutoWeek: "the crusher is exactly where these cars are all headed if the U.S. government doesn’t approve some sort of emissions system fix. Even in that case, said fix might be too expensive to implement economically, so again, it’s off to the crusher

Click to expand...

What a joke, crushing those is exactly the opposite of what the EPA is supposed to be doing. Hypocrites.

Well maybe our new president will have something to say. He has already silenced the EPA. Wish he would silence and abolish CARB!!

dirtride said:

Well maybe our new president will have something to say. He has already silenced the EPA. Wish he would silence and abolish CARB!!

Click to expand...

Federal law says CARB can do almost whatever it wants. Trump cannot curb CARB with an executive order, and Congress is unlikely to change the law.

But if those recalled TDIs can be modified, then they could be sold in most other states.

UhOh said:

What a shame. Think of the emissions from moving these things around and then in their final disposal.

Wonder if these might not end up in some other country? I know that these things would be WAY cleaner than most of the diesels currently running in the Philippines!

Click to expand...

Think per the court approved settlement, the cars can not be sold in any other country if they are not fixed. VW agreed to that, and the federal court has jurisdiction on this settlement.

The 2015 cars can be fixed and even sold in California per CARB. For VW, it is a dollars and cents question. But even more important than just $$, VW has an image/ethics/criminal problem it is trying to run away from called "Dieselgate". VW wants everyone to forget about Dieselgate. That is the most important reason why these cars will be scrapped. It has cost VW $20 BILLION, melting down the buy back cars is a cheap way to get rid of the problem.

john.jackson9213 said:

That is the most important reason why these cars will be scrapped. It has cost VW $20 BILLION, melting down the buy back cars is a cheap way to get rid of the problem.

Click to expand...

I haven't been following Dieselgate too intently...no real need to really, but in seeing all these pictures of the thousands of buyback cars parked all over the US (OK, in three large lots at least), how exactly would the crushing/scrapping/junking work out? Has that been discussed or theorized on TDIclub yet?

Would it safe to assume that the cars would be at least partially stripped and parted out? I mean things like tires, aluminum wheels, body panels, interior parts, steering racks, etc...stuff that can be sold as used parts installed on gasoline models?

I would think that, and maybe this is me normalizing things...that the disassembly or "disposal" of these cars would go out for contractor tender, and then they would strip them? Or would they simply drain all the fluids and crush 'em whole?

Just curious.

I see these fields of cars and think of things I might like to buy (cheaply) on the used marked...6 spd manual trans, aluminum wheels, etc...

VW was supposed to submit its fix for the Gen 1 cars, which are the majority of the bought back vehicles, yesterday. Approval or denial is due in 45 days, IIRC. If the fix is approved VW plans to fix the bought back cars and offer them back to dealers, and wholesale the rest. Some may be destroyed/parted out because they're too old/high mileage to resell or require too much work to repair. But I am, along with many others, hoping that there will be a renaissance of CR cars on the road within a year.

IndigoBlueWagon said:

VW was supposed to submit its fix for the Gen 1 cars, which are the majority of the bought back vehicles, yesterday. Approval or denial is due in 45 days, IIRC. If the fix is approved VW plans to fix the bought back cars and offer them back to dealers, and wholesale the rest. Some may be destroyed/parted out because they're too old/high mileage to resell or require too much work to repair. But I am, along with many others, hoping that there will be a renaissance of CR cars on the road within a year.

Click to expand...

That's my hope, too. I want to get a cheap one now and make sure I like it, and then spend the money on a new one that'll last me ten years.

jason0423 said:

That's my hope, too. I want to get a cheap one now and make sure I like it, and then spend the money on a new one that'll last me ten years.

Click to expand...

You can pretty much get anything to last ten years if you put enough money into it. The measure is, well, cost. If I have an outlay of $6k for a MKIV TDI -that's all up to par- could it run ten years at a lower cost than a newer TDI (for say that same $6k but hasn't been refreshed)? For myself I already know the answer: having MULTIPLE MKIV TDIs allows me to spread the cost of parts (you know, the ones you buy and find out you don't need!) and tools; also also allows me to become more familiar with repairs (I can do a lot of repairs more quickly on another vehicle now).

Also factor in insurance and road tax costs. I tend to ignore "resale" cost because I have no crystal ball showing what people will be able to pay in the future (or even if a given vehicle is "legal" to operated anymore).

My son's Golf is like a time capsule. I'd say that it's in better condition than most two year-old cars! (and it's now 14 years old)