The Epic Saga of a Rare Bird

theneild

New member
Joined
Apr 19, 2017
Location
Portland, OR
TDI
2010 Jetta Sportwagen, 6mt
The buyback has not been an easy tale for me.

I own a 2010 VW Jetta Sportwagen TDI with a 6 speed manual transmission. (Manual, diesel, wagon)

My registration ran out in November 2016, so I didn't bother re-registering for a few reasons:
1. I didn't want to buy a year's worth of registration for a car that I could be giving up in a few months.
2. My car has a bad EGR (exhaust gas recirculation) valve which is throwing a check engine light.
3. My car will not pass emissions testing in the county I live in (Portland, OR) with a check engine light.
4. Replacing the EGR valve costs ~$4000, whereas deleting the egr valve costs ~$1200, but with no egr, I cannot pass emissions testing.

So, my thought was to sell back the car, which I bought for $13,000 in 2014, knowing VW would give me about that in the buyback. So I filled out all the proper paperwork and waited for the lawyers. When the registration ran out at the end of November 2016 I stopped driving the car and took the insurance off the car because it was just parked safely in my driveway. Once I took the insurance off the car, my bank (who I was paying for the loan on this car) called me up and said they will take back the car if it doesn't have insurance. So I decided to pay off the loan, with only a few thousand left, knowing that I will get all this money back from the settlement.

Then the call came, four months after filling out the paperwork. The appointment for my inspection with some random adjudicator tasked to do this job. When the day came, I pulled in to the joint Hyundai/VW dealership here in Portland, OR, thinking that this is the last time I will drive a manual diesel wagon.

But no. It was not meant to be.

First problem:
I removed the bluetooth radio the day before because I wanted to find a way to use it in my 2004 VW Passat (which was built way before bluetooth). The inspector said they cannot accept a car with no radio because it implies "intentional stripping". I was only a little bit upset. She said she would take the car with any stereo, it doesn't have to work as long as it is in the correct place, and I could come back anytime that day. So I scrambled. I looked on the forums to find a way to put that stereo in my Passat, with everyone telling me I need special tools to remove that stereo. Knowing my luck I would probably ruin more than just the OEM stereo removing it, so I put the correct bluetooth stereo back in the manual diesel wagon and drove back to the Hyundai-I mean Volkswagen dealership to meet my adjudicator again.

Second problem:
Upon going back to see my adjudicator (let's call her Kristie) Kristie again, she starts looking at the paperwork and realizes that I no longer have a loan on the car, but the original paperwork I filled out months ago says I do have a loan. She calls some kind of supervisor somewhere, waits on hold for about 5 minutes. The supervisor tells her that I need to resend my paperwork. I need to pretty much start from the beginning otherwise this won't work out.

I am a very understanding and patient person. My wife thinks I am too understanding. I empathize with all kinds of people. I saw Kristie, did a quick mental breakdown of her situation and knew she could do absolutely nothing for me.

So I left the Kia-I mean Hyundai dealership a little bit dejected. I had spent a lot of time working this out, but the whole time I knew that I would be receiving basically what I paid for this car for my troubles. I was not utterly despondent yet. I was holding onto a glimmer of hope, knowing that for the first time ever I would be able to tell people that I drove a car for free (other than fuel and basic maintenance costs) for two years. That's the holy grail of car ownership, right?

A few days after my failed appointment, I start the paperwork trail with the claim settlement company again. I fill everything out properly, scan the clean title, scan the registration, scan my driver's license. A few days pass and I receive an email from the adjudicators.

They tell me my paperwork is incorrect.

First problem:
The manual diesel wagon is jointly owned by me and my wife. And when I scanned our drivers licenses, I attached my drivers license photo to my wife's information and vice versa.

Second problem:
The registration is expired. (Remember?)

So I call our great friends at the Volkswagen Group of America TDI Settlement Support Team.

I wait on hold for about five minutes.

Finally, my new adjudicator comes on the line, let's call him Charles. I tell him my claim number, and he tells me what I have done wrong. I tell him that if he looks at the photos of the drivers' licenses I have scanned with human eyes, he will realize that they do in fact match the names of the owners on the title. I then tell him that I have already gone through the whole paperwork process just a few months ago, and ask him why I cannot just jump back to the stage I was at before; ready for my appointment.

Charles tells me that the car must be registered for the buyback to take place. I am a little frustrated here, knowing I have gone through this process in the past. I then proceed to tell him that I cannot register this car where I currently reside for one specific reason:
"3. My car will not pass emissions testing in the county I live in (Portland, OR) with a check engine light."

...
At this point, I have realized the mythical stories people tell of manual diesel wagons are exactly that; myth. This creature is too great for our world. I hear in my head the spaceship like sounds the Audi R18 TDI's make with their turbo v-6 engines, and how I will never hear that again. I think about the pondering, immortal diesel Mercedes wagons of old. I think about a car that has 230 pounds-feet of torque and instead of powering it with fossil fuel, I fill the tank with free used cooking oil I just fried 20 chickens in (I am a chef!) I think about how just days before the registration ran out on this car I was bombing it around on mountain passes breaking 120 miles an hour. It's almost as if the powers at be were doing everything they can to stop me from having the great joy of driving a car that can maintain 40+ miles per gallon when i'm driving it over 100 miles an hour.
I think about the scandals the Volkswagen group has gone through in the past. I think about Ralph Nader and how he told us all the Beetle was "Unsafe at Any Speed". I think about the Sport Quattro, and how it was too fast and spectators could die. I thought about the big Audi trans-am cars with their all wheel drive and how they were banned because they were too good. I think about the 60 minutes story of how Audi's have "unintended acceleration" and will pin you to your garage door. I think of Ferdinand Piech, how he pushed everyone around him create a better product. I don't wish to be an engineer under him, but those people created some of the internal combustion engine's greatest hits (Veyron, the R8, Phaeton, the quattro system, Le Mans winners for decades, and the 2.0TDI).
...


Charles tells me that the car will pass testing, and that I just need to tell the emissions testing office that it is part of a legal settlement. I ask Charles if they will reimburse me for the registration fees. He tells me they will. I don't believe him.

So now, a month has passed since my first failed appointment. I have not registered the car. I haven't made the time. The car has been unregistered for more than 90 days so I need to go to the DMV and wait in line and fill out paperwork and pay a fee, just go to go a different smog testing station, wait in line, pay the fee and fill out paperwork.

But today, after looking at what my options are for a replacement car, I have fully realized that I will never find a car that is anything like this ever again. Nothing compares. No wagon I can buy with a manual transmission will ever reach 45 MPG. Sure I could buy an electric. It's not the same. An electric car is a computer; the future in it's infancy. A diesel motor is a relic. A relic that has been fully realized by man and evolved as far as man can take it.

I have decided that I want to keep this manual diesel wagon. As a rational person, I have figured out that the amount of time and effort I have put into this car that i'm not even driving has been extraordinary. It's almost as if the car is asking me for another chance.

I'm ready to give it another chance. No car is perfect. This car destroys our environment. That bothers me. But no human is perfect. No matter how hard you try to be the greatest human specimen that a human could possibly be, you will fail at something. Those failures are what makes humans so beautiful. No computer with an electric motor can understand this. Internal combustion motors are living, breathing creatures just like me.

Neil Davidson
April 19, 2017
 

nick1994

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 29, 2014
Location
Phoenix, AZ
TDI
2013 VW Beetle TDI - 52k
After all this nonsense you're keeping this heaping pile of junk? A car that needs $4,000 worth of work to pass emissions? A car that needs regular timing belt replacements and is known to have HPFP issues galore? All for a few mpg?

Sorry, I've fallen off the TDI bandwagon. After it drained my bank account and wanted $5k every year in repairs I had to dump it. And the 2013 TDI was starting to be even worse. By 40k miles it had nearly $6,000 worth of work done to it and the transmission was acting up, the A/C didn't work, and the steering wheel howled like a coyote.

If you get out a calculator you'll see that mpg doesn't really matter. The 2013 TDI in m signature drove 18,000 miles per year. It's replacement is a 2016 Toyota Avalon with a thirsty V6 that gets 25 mpg. It literally costs about $8 a week more to drive, not going to be breaking the bank, the cost of a cheeseburger a week.
 

turbobrick240

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 18, 2014
Location
maine
TDI
2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
Somehow I doubt your wonderful Toyota will impinge upon your cheeseburger habit whatsoever. And what's the big deal with timing belts every 130k miles? Tdi's are hardly the only cars that require timing belts. I've been in more than one timing chain vehicle at the moment the chain broke.
 

dropnosky

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2007
Location
RI
TDI
2000 Jetta 6 speed, 2012 Passat DSG
Somehow I doubt your wonderful Toyota will impinge upon your cheeseburger habit whatsoever. And what's the big deal with timing belts every 130k miles? Tdi's are hardly the only cars that require timing belts. I've been in more than one timing chain vehicle at the moment the chain broke.
He does make an accurate point, people rarely take maintenance costs into account when they rave on excellent fuel economy.

Couple years ago for my business i unwittingly tried an interesting experiment. I had a need for a work car, and the assignment for the vehicle was 250 miles a day and 30 to 40 stops at residences for survey purposes. This would seem ideal for a tdi.

Initally i used a 99 ALH jetta manual for a little over a year. I also had a 99 ford explorer for snow situations. I ultimately sold the jetta planning to get something newer and put the ford in service for the interim, and ended up using that about a year as well until i found what i wanted. The fuel hog exploder cost less money to operate than the jetta. And this was at a 3rd the fuel economy. Yeah the jetta sipped fuel, but it required enough constant repair that the fuel savings became irrelevant.

Dont get me wrong, the exploder required work as well and had a host of other exploder related issues that were on the horizon, but it required less work, and less expensive work to the point that at 15mpg i saved money over 40mpg.

The jetta was a better car, more refined, more comfortable, drove better, and broke down more. The wife drives a dieselgate passat that operates the same way. Great car, costs a bunch of money to own. Ive replaced a lot of stuff that ive never replaced on other vehicles.
 

Trade Wind

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2016
Location
Minnesota
TDI
RIP 2012 Passat SE 6 spd MT
Sincerely, no offense to the OP, but ever notice when someone uses the term "epic" it is in fact the opposite of epic?
 

Lex Tdi

Veteran Member
Joined
Oct 4, 2016
Location
Lexington ky
TDI
2013 Passat
These are the kind of stories i have missed since vw caught up and gave everyone their money... i thought this forum was gonna die but posts like this give me hope!
 

turbobrick240

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Nov 18, 2014
Location
maine
TDI
2011 vw golf tdi(gone to greener pastures), 2001 ford f250 powerstroke
He does make an accurate point, people rarely take maintenance costs into account when they rave on excellent fuel economy.
Couple years ago for my business i unwittingly tried an interesting experiment. I had a need for a work car, and the assignment for the vehicle was 250 miles a day and 30 to 40 stops at residences for survey purposes. This would seem ideal for a tdi.
Initally i used a 99 ALH jetta manual for a little over a year. I also had a 99 ford explorer for snow situations. I ultimately sold the jetta planning to get something newer and put the ford in service for the interim, and ended up using that about a year as well until i found what i wanted. The fuel hog exploder cost less money to operate than the jetta. And this was at a 3rd the fuel economy. Yeah the jetta sipped fuel, but it required enough constant repair that the fuel savings became irrelevant.
Dont get me wrong, the exploder required work as well and had a host of other exploder related issues that were on the horizon, but it required less work, and less expensive work to the point that at 15mpg i saved money over 40mpg.
The jetta was a better car, more refined, more comfortable, drove better, and broke down more. The wife drives a dieselgate passat that operates the same way. Great car, costs a bunch of money to own. Ive replaced a lot of stuff that ive never replaced on other vehicles.
Luck of the draw. I drove a 20 mpg jeep Cherokee before buying my golf. In the 150k miles I put on each vehicle, neither needed any serious repairs. The tdi needed a timing belt job which I did myself for ~$300. Including the timing belt, the tdi has saved me about $8k over the jeep.
 

pikawel

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 19, 2003
Location
Phoenix, AZ
TDI
2013 Golf TDI
True story. I had no mechanical snafus in my 13 years of TDI ownership other than the noisy dual mass flywheel issue on my 2006.

Luck of the draw. I drove a 20 mpg jeep Cherokee before buying my golf. In the 150k miles I put on each vehicle, neither needed any serious repairs. The tdi needed a timing belt job which I did myself for ~$300. Including the timing belt, the tdi has saved me about $8k over the jeep.
 

S2000_guy

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 4, 2013
Location
ohio
TDI
2014 Sportwagen TDI
I'm at just over 50k miles on my '14 JSW TDI. I've done the scheduled maintenance, and that's all. The sunroof quit working, but it's closed and doesn't leak; I not interested in spending time or money on it since I'll sell the car back next year.

Some of the TDIs are reliable.
 

dropnosky

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2007
Location
RI
TDI
2000 Jetta 6 speed, 2012 Passat DSG
I'm at just over 50k miles on my '14 JSW TDI. I've done the scheduled maintenance, and that's all. The sunroof quit working, but it's closed and doesn't leak; I not interested in spending time or money on it since I'll sell the car back next year.

Some of the TDIs are reliable.
Or in other words, your 3 year old car with only 50k on it has a non functional sunroof.
 

dropnosky

Veteran Member
Joined
Feb 16, 2007
Location
RI
TDI
2000 Jetta 6 speed, 2012 Passat DSG
Luck of the draw. I drove a 20 mpg jeep Cherokee before buying my golf. In the 150k miles I put on each vehicle, neither needed any serious repairs. The tdi needed a timing belt job which I did myself for ~$300. Including the timing belt, the tdi has saved me about $8k over the jeep.
In the application I put both vehicles in, it really became more of an issue of which could absorb punishment and continue. The cruder design was more capable of taking the beating without constant adjustment.

The TDI was essentially reliable, but the punishing work use had it almost constantly in need of a repair. I finally gave up on getting the check engine light to stay off for more than a month at a time.

If I could use my old 1.6 NA in heavy urban traffic without fear of death, id put that in service as the best of both worlds.
 
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BleachedBora

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Oct 16, 2003
Location
Gresham, Oregon
TDI
'81 DMC-12, '15 GL350 CDI 275 hp/448 tq - '81 Caddy CJAA, '05 E320 CDI 250hp/450 tq, '23 ID4 AWD Pro S Plus
FYI OP We're local to you...

1997 Jetta TDI - BlackenedBora - Absolute pile, had everything wrong with it. Owned from 90k-150k - later on we learned it was due to the PO snaping the TB and doing a shoddy rebuild; nothing wrong with the car itself.

1998 Jetta TDI - BleachedBora - from 175k-380k trouble free; needed a MAF and glow plugs.

2000 Golf TDI - 170k-200k - Flawless

2001 Jetta TDI "Blue" (Ravenna Blue, best color out there!) - 91k-210k - 1 MAF

2001 Golf TDI - Bleached"Bora" - 105k - 240k - only problems were related to the modifications I did to the car, nothing wrong with the original design

2002 Jetta TDI - "The Swap" picked it up for $500 with 120k on the clock. It's the swap for the Caddy.

2004 Jetta TDI - Familymobile, then Dad's - 190k-256k - still going great, needed a MAF, EGR and a glow plug harness

2004 Passat TDI - Larger Familymobile - Balance shaft failed at 129k, I picked it up and threw in a long block - was flawless till 170k, sold it 2 weeks ago

2004 Golf TDI - "The Crate" - picked it up for free at 276k, needed new injectors and a MAF. Still has original clutch.

2006 Jetta TDI - "Mom's" - from 160k-190k, trouble free

2010 Jetta CUP Edition - Bleached"Bora" 3 - 29k-30k - Lots of troubles, mostly attributed to hopping it up to 240 hp. Unfortunately it's going back to VW.

2011 Jetta Sportwagen - Mom's #2 - 107k-150k - flawless, though she decided today she's selling it back because she got an amazing deal on a 2015 Sportwagen which she's also picking up today.

In my experience 90% of the troubles people have with these cars boil down to the following:

1) They don't know what the problem truly is and trust someone to figure it out; they pay for their mechanics education. Said mechanic way overcharges.

2) They drive it into the ground expecting everything to always work

3) See #1 and 2 - remember I said 90%, there are plenty of other reasons, most of which I'm not thinking of at the moment.

YMMV,
-BB
 

Debra Morgan

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 28, 2014
Location
Columbus Ohio
TDI
Memories of a fantastic 2015 Jetta
I'm at just over 50k miles on my '14 JSW TDI. I've done the scheduled maintenance, and that's all. The sunroof quit working, but it's closed and doesn't leak; I not interested in spending time or money on it since I'll sell the car back next year.

Some of the TDIs are reliable.
Ours was the best car I ever owned...considering a GTI as a replacement at some point...
 

MyTDIRocks

Active member
Joined
Apr 27, 2018
Location
New England
TDI
2012 Jetta TDI - Sold back to VW Snif :(
Sorry, I've fallen off the TDI bandwagon. After it drained my bank account and wanted $5k every year in repairs I had to dump it. And the 2013 TDI was starting to be even worse. By 40k miles it had nearly $6,000 worth of work done to it and the transmission was acting up, the A/C didn't work, and the steering wheel howled like a coyote.
Wow - you must've had bad karma and bought a lemon. My 2012 Jetta TDI has had no issues whatsoever in the last 6 yrs. Only thing I've had done is new brakes and tires. That's it. Sorry to hear of all your troubles!
 

IndigoBlueWagon

TDIClub Enthusiast, Principal IDParts, Vendor , w/
Joined
Aug 16, 2004
Location
South of Boston
TDI
'97 Passat, '99.5 Golf, '02 Jetta Wagon, '15 GSW
I don't believe Mercedes ever sold any manual transmission diesel wagons in the US. Maybe you'd see a random grey market car, but not any made for US sale.

And a manual transmission JSW TDI isn't a rare bird these days. Our local dealer has four of them for sale right now. I saw two at another local dealer last Saturday.
 

Kevinski4

Vendor , w/Business number
Joined
Aug 31, 2007
Location
Nebraska
TDI
.
Epic saga of repeated errors made by others before you. No way the egr valve costs $4k to fix. $179 at IDParts. That will/would have taken care of most of your issues right there.

http://www.idparts.com/tdi-egr-valve-03l131501k-cbea-cjaa-p-2552.html
No, it won't take care of any of his issues. He needs a new DPF. It just shows up as an EGR fault initially (P0401 EGR flow insufficient). That's why it's $4k. Although an indie shop could replace it for half that.
 

Mark_J

Veteran Member
Joined
Aug 17, 2003
Location
Deer Park, Washington
TDI
2015 TDI Passat SEL Premium, 2017 Fiat Spider, 2017 Ford F350 6.7 Diesel crew cab PU, 2016 Harley Trike, 2016 Tesla Model X P90D (I know went to the dark side)
I guess I have been very lucky because I have owned quite a few VW diesels, from the first Rabbit 1.6 to my current 2015 Passat, and besides normal wear items, IE: water pumps, timing belt changes, etc, have had very good luck with them and I usually put 350+ miles on them. Most pickup diesels still have timing chains that last forever, but most passenger vehicles do not anymore, so pretty much all passenger vehicles need regular belt changes. Have also owned 4 Subaru's and they have 2 timing belts due to the boxer engine design. So timing belt changes is not unique to VW.
 
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