Is CoPart a Junkyard...

....?

If you have to ask the question then you probably know the answer.

They're not a junkyard in the traditional sense. They call their business an auto auction, but if you take a look at their inventory, they definitely deal primarily in wrecked vehicles.

When I looked into this previously, I was trying to determine when a car is officially "scraped," i.e. beyond complete, never going to be a car again. I couldn't find any title branding beyond "salvage" here in CA, which as you know doesn't prevent the car from being restored.

Then I found a thread on Reddit. It linked to the following definition of "junkyard,"

“junk yard” means an individual or entity engaged in the business of acquiring or owning junk automobiles for—
(A) resale in their entirety or as spare parts; or
(B) rebuilding, restoration, or crushing.

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https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/49/30501

Whether this definition has any gravity with respect to VW buybacks, I have no idea, because we've all read stories here that TDIs have been bought back that appear to come from outside the guidelines set forth in the settlement.

But is Copart a Junkyard? I say Yes.

Of course, whether a car was bought from a junkyard is relevant only if it had a branded title on or before 9/18/15.

Admittedly I took liberties reading into that question.

Copart and their much slower counterpart IAAI never take ownership of the vehicles they sell, though. Many, many cars with rebuilt titles have already been bought back - it's nearly a guarantee that some of them went through copart, or some other salvage auction house.

The clause about coming from a junkyard, in my opinion, is there to prevent people from going to a pick-a-part yard and hauling a half-missing chassis out to sell back. That specific car is not roadworthy, and in the eyes of VW should therefore not have to be bought back. On the cars that are legally registered and driving around but were crashed and sold through copart - they are still polluting, aren't they?

That's (my opinion) of why cars that were sold through copart but are back on the road are getting bought back. The EPA and the DOJ don't care about what the history of the ownership of the car looks like, which is clear by giving the same amount for salvaged cars as clean ones. They want the polluting abominations off the road, so any abomination that is road legal and registered is included.

That's an entirely rational explanation.

Where it becomes grey is assigning a value when the market is artificial (assigned buyback values). Insurance companies total out a vehicle based on market value, so maybe today's NADA value should reflect what that vehicle is worth as a buyback, vs. what it would fetch on a wholesale lot (which incidentally, because of the buyback, is also inflated).

In other words, BECAUSE of the buyback, there is added incentive to get that vehicle back on the road, where if the buyback wasn't in play, the vehicle would *most likely* be parted out and scrapped, more specifically off the road.

And from the looks of it, all you would need is one willing (and able) buyer to go to a junkyard and buy the worst of the worst picked-apart donors and restore it to operable condition, if the buyback allowed for it.

At some point, you'd think a title would be permanently changed from "Salvage" to something like "Junked," to indicate that this "thing" is no longer a car, just a pile of parts. Although I can think of some complications and downsides to that, too.

Point taken DanB. For argument's sake let's say copart is a junkyard. How would VW know a car passed through there? Carfax does not always say that, does it? Do you think VW is running carfax on salvage title cars?

I really don't know how VW is checking that, but it seems likely that they are checking somehow. It's entirely possible that they're checking against the DMV databases to see what the history of the car is. This is part of why I didn't pursue any branded-title cars to sell back--the uncertainty in the definition of "junkyard or salvage yard", combined with my inability to prove that the car's history was OK, made the proposition unattractive to me.

I cannot confirm which databases or sources VW may be accessing to confirm vehicle history.

With that said, CF has been known to report salvage auction history and they clearly define this as a data source.

https://www.carfax.com/company/vhr-data-sources

A vehicle that has passed thru one of these auctions would likely contain the following entry on a CF report:

Auto Auction Collision damage reported
Sold at salvage auction

I personally bought two scandal TDI's from copart, you get the title signed over form the previous owner, whether it be an individual or insurance company. As stated, copart does not typically have ownership interest in the vehicles

Freezeplug, where they salvaged prior to September 2015? And, have you received a buyback offer on them?

Personally, I don't see the auctions being an issue on the 2.0L settlement, but there is an added exclusion (salvage dealer) stated on the 3.0L buyback.

Owners whose Eligible Vehicle had a Br
anded Title of Assembled, Dismantled,
Flood, Junk, Rebuilt, Reconstructed, or Salvage on September 18, 2015, and was
acquired from a junkyard, salvage yard,
or salvage dealer after September 18,
2015;

I'm fairly certain that language is in the 2.0 settlement.

PacCoastFwy923 said:

I'm fairly certain that language is in the 2.0 settlement.

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(c)
Owners whose Volkswagen or Audi 2.0-lite
r TDI vehicle (i) could not be driven
under the power of its own
2.0-liter TDI engine on J
une 28, 2016, or (ii) had a
Branded Title of Assembled, Dismantle
d, Flood, Junk, Rebuilt, Reconstructed, or
Salvage on September 18, 2015, and was acquired from a junkyard or salvage yard
after September 18, 2015;

Oh, right, the "savage dealer" bit -- sorry, I was distracted by something shiny.

Seems like a key piece is "was acquired from." Note it does not say "was sold by." "Acquired from " could mean it passed through, even though CoPart never owned it. Yet I have yet to hear of anyone denied by VW for this reason. Hmmm.

Does anyone know anyone that has been denied by VW for a branded/salvage/flood damaged vehicle?

Secondly, has anyone ever heard of a vehicle with a branded title that is only eligible for use outside the USA? I talked to a guy that was selling a flood damaged Q7 and he said it couldnt be tegistered anywhere in the US.

I've never seen a vehicle with a salvage title ineligible for use in the USA. I currently own two salvage title vehicles.

There have been a couple of posts here from people with branded titles saying they were refused buybacks. In the cases I remember, they'd filed the claim with a clean title, the car was wrecked and the title branded* while waiting for the buyback, and then buyback was refused. I expect they'll eventually be accepted, but they're kind of in limbo right now.

* This is one reason that when my car was wrecked, I put the insurance claim on hold until the buyback was complete.

Trade Wind said:

Freezeplug, where they salvaged prior to September 2015? And, have you received a buyback offer on them?

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In my case I lucked out and bought both with clean titles. I am guessing the dealers were scared and dumped them. Both were completely operable. I registered and drove them both to the buyback appointments

im looking at the JSW TDI that was totaled by insurance and sold by Copart on 3/2016, the current owner who bought it from there fixed it and registered, but hit a deer on 11/2016 and it was totaled again by insurance company. He fixed it again and drives it with no probs. If i purchase this car from him now would it be eligible for the buyback, or im missing something here?

If it had a clean title on 9/18/15, and if it can be driven under its own power now, it should be eligible.

i still dont quite get how they determined eligibility, i understand the wording, but for ex i had a jetta that was totaled on 08/2015 and i bought it from the salvage dealer on 10/2015 and it went thrugh fine, except i got 78% on the restitution portion of the BB

So if a car got into accident and totaled in March 2017 and I purchase it from Copart in April 2017, it will be completely eligible for buyback as long as it drives and looks presentable?

TDIforDays said:

So if a car got into accident and totaled in March 2017 and I purchase it from Copart in April 2017, it will be completely eligible for buyback as long as it drives and looks presentable?

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Fixed that for you.

DanB36 said:

Fixed that for you.

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Haha thanks! Time to hit up Copart lol

Good luck. Copart prices = buyback in most cases.

Prior owner may have filed a claim for the mod prior to total. You have no way of knowing and it may affect buyback.

fookin said:

Prior owner may have filed a claim for the mod prior to total.

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They might have, but how would that affect anything? If they'd actually had the mod done, that would do it, but (1) there's only a mod for MY2015 cars, and (2) https://www.vwdiesellookup.com/ will tell you if it's been done.

Danb36, I'm suggesting the prior owner might have taken the restitution payment. Will the settlement allow the next owner to then sell back?

Restitution payment as in "I'm an Eligible Owner whose car was totaled after 9/16/16, so pay me the restitution"? That's a good question, and I really don't know how that would affect things.

Otherwise, you only get restitution for the modification when you have the modification done--see above.