Hill holder, turn off?

For the MK7 with 6MT is there a way to disable the hill holder function?
Didn't find any other discussion except one old unanswered post quoted here.

C C said:

...I hate the automatic hill holder when stopped on inclines with gravel, too little throttle stalls and too much throws stones. Looking for a way to minimize or disable it.

Click to expand...

I have no problem driving a manual either and find the hill holding function annoying. Almost always holds the brakes harder than necessary, which means more slipping of the clutch and less smooth take off than if Left to me to actually drive the car.

Anyone know if possible to turn off, perhaps with VCDS?

Grigg

Through VCDS yes, in the ABS module adaptations I believe

OK, back to this problem.

I have VCDS but need some more info/help, what do I need to change exactly?

I did find an adjustment instructions here and have done that, some improvement.
https://sites.google.com/a/naturaln...how-to/mechanical/hill-hold-assist-adjustment

I'd still like to entirely disable the hill holding feature if possible.

Does it give the option for a total disable? Can you post a screenshot of VCDS when you are in there? Is there a long coding option?

I'm really in over my head on this stuff, I can follow instructions but beyond that I don't know how it all works and what can and can't be done.

Here is a thread and some links to follow that might help.
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=418792
From that thread a link in post #6 looks useful, link here also:
http://www.golfmk6.com/forums/showpost.php?p=690843&postcount=196


The summary from that link/instructions:

Load up VCDS, click on the Select button under Select Control Module
Click on the 03-ABS Brakes button
Click on the Coding - 07 button
Go to Byte 16 and uncheck Bit 0 - Hill Hold Control (HHC/PR-UG1/UG4) active/installed to deactivate Hill Hold Control (HCC).

Look in that link for picture of the last screen where you should be able to adjust Bit 0 in Bite 16...


My Screen shots,
Long coding helper for ABS, just noticed this warning or note that "limited coding information is available for this control module"
Perhaps this changed between those old instructions and now?


Compare this shot for Bite 16 when I tried it and the shot linked in thread above.
No options to adjust as in the other older screen shot.

Or in the "binary:" box I could change a digit from "1" to "0" or other way? but not clear to me which and if any gives desired result?

Looking elsewhere, the adaptations for ABS is this
MAS08145-Hill-start assistant: increase threshold
I tried changing from the 3% down to 0% and the hill hold still functions.
Not sure what that really means or does but probably not a way to disable it.

Grigg3 said:

Long coding helper for ABS, just noticed this warning or note that "limited coding information is available for this control module"

Click to expand...

I noticed that you are running VCDS 17.1.3. There is a newer version available (17.8). It might have more info about your ABS controller. I would update VCDS and then look again to see if there is any improvement.
http://www.ross-tech.com/vcds/download/current.php

Have Fun!

Don

I agree, update VCDS as it may have more labels in the Long Coding Helper.

Will do,
Thanks!

I was just digging though my owners manual looking for a way to disable this feature. This thread will help, thanks.

Updated VCDS and I think it also updated the HEX-NET interface.
Here's the screen shot, still no luck.

The instructions I now see were for MK6 and I'm trying this on a MK7
Still, It'd be real nice if turning off the hill holder is an option.

I have a '15 GTI in for service today, I will take a peek and see what it looks like and get back here ASAP.

OK, this GTI has the same deal, no labels in the Long Coding. I would email ross-tech support (or maybe someone from there is able to chime in here) and see if they can guide you.

In the Adaptations for hill hold assist, this GTI is set to Normal, but gives two other options for Early and Late. I would think Late would be the least intrusive, but you said yours had percentages?

I just emailed Ross-Tech and will report back if anything useful.

I did find the adaptation as you found and adjusted mine to early, some improvement but it still functions.
here's more info from previosuly linked thread.

"Hill Hold Control (HHC)"
Set new value to: 0 for normal (stock setting), 1 for early (start with low RPM's), or 2 for late late (start with high RPM's and slipping clutch)

Click to expand...

The other hill hold adaptation was about "increase threshold" which I didn't play with much.
It was set at 3% and I tried 0% thinking "nothing" ought to make a noticeable difference compared to "something"... but I didn't notice any change, the hill holder still functioned.

The guys at ross-tech are great, I expect they will be able to help you out. Please post any correspondence you get involving this issue here, though, as I too would like to know how to disable it on the A7, as I commonly have customers ask about it. I think it is a clever thing, but if you (like me) are well versed in manual driving, it becomes a hindrance and is not necessary. Like asking an olympic swimmer to compete with water wings.

My Sprinter has a hill holder function, but its G-tronic 7sp autobox disengages at idle, so it actually works well to keep the vehicle from rolling back (or forward, when I back out of my steep driveway) when you go to take off from a stand still. But in that case, you have no control over the transmission of power as there is no clutch pedal. VAG's DSGs are similar.

But a good ol' fashion manual gearbox? Nah, I can do it all myself.

Reply (very quickly) from Ross-Tech is to use the Ross-Tech Forum where I should post a complete AutoScan along with my questions:
http://forums.ross-tech.com/forum.php

I'm signing up there now and learning about taking and posting an autoscan.

Yes, the hill holder isn't all bad, but it frustrates me when occasional required to slip the clutch excessively. Then I usually stall because I know I don't need that much clutch or throttle to do what I'm trying to do. Kind of like the car and I have a quiet argument and I once again long for the upper hand in the matter.

In the meantime it mostly acts up when taking off for the first time from a parking spot so now I don't use the brake pedal, just release the hand brake and drive away so the hill holder doesn't even try to function.

I wonder if its not the hill hold feature, but the clutch delay valve (CDV) that you are experiencing?
With my '16 TSI GSW, it was awful. If stopped on an incline, when loaded down with camping gear, I had to slip the clutch to the point of burning to get moving without stalling. Not related to the hill hold at all. It was the CDV delaying engagement of the clutch and not allowing power transfer fast enough to prevent stalling when starting on hills, with a heavily loaded wagon.
Removed the CDV and it acts as it should.

Not sure if the TDIs have one, but I'd wager on "yes", as 1.8 5spd do, and 2.0 GTI 6spd also do.

Yes, they do have a restricted check valve in the clutch hydraulic circuit and that's on my list to remove, but it's not the issue here at all.
Instructions for removing that restriction.
http://www.vwroc.com/forums/topic/12185-tutorial-clutch-delay-valve-removal-manual-cars/
http://www.golfmk7.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14745

Here is the thread I started in the Ross-Tech forum about how to disable Hill Hold.
http://forums.ross-tech.com/showthread.php?11468-MK7-golf-disable-Hill-Hold

The option is an Adaptation channel in the ABS module, and as far as I was able to tell it has 3 settings, roughly equivalent to Weak, Normal, and Strong. There is no fourth, "off" setting like in the A6.

It is still invasive but markedly less so when set to the weakest option.

Right, I've got that adaptation set to reduce the annoyance.

I'm pretty sure it can be turned off altogether, it's all computer programming anyhow... just need for figure out how to do it.

Grigg3 said:

I'm pretty sure it can be turned off altogether, it's all computer programming anyhow... just need for figure out how to do it.

Click to expand...

Cap your brake lines at the reservoir, so they won't turn on.

But in all seriousness, this whole MQB car platform is even more annoying than the last.

I wonder if each car comes from the factory with different settings for the hill hold. For instance, I have noticed that it disengages at the slightest attempt at movement of the car. Let out the clutch a tiny bit and tap the throttle, then put the car back in neutral and it will roll backward and the the brake pedal has full motion, not like it feels when hill hold is engaged. If I ever get access to a VAGCOM I might disable it but I don't find it to be very annoying. The reason I do this slight throttle tap action is because I cannot stand to have the car in reverse when backing down a sloped driveway. I only put it in gear IF there is any traffic coming or any reason for someone to see that I'm reversing or if the area is poorly lit. But often this is not the case so I just coast down in N to the street, and then put it in first and carry on.
I have not heard of this CDV feature, why would they have included such a thing?

Sometimes I find myself wishing I had bought an old ALH Golf or JSW with fewer of these modern features getting in the way. Or just kept my 10 Jetta.

Grigg3 said:

Here is the thread I started in the Ross-Tech forum about how to disable Hill Hold.
http://forums.ross-tech.com/showthread.php?11468-MK7-golf-disable-Hill-Hold

Click to expand...

In that thread is now a solution, and it works perfectly.
So pleased to not have the hill holder on my MK7!

ABS controller code
Byte 25
Reads "63" hill holder works, stock setting.
Change to "60" and hill holder is disabled.

See the Ross-Tech thread for the complete details and code.

Awesome, thanks!

And once again ross-tech kicks butt!

Yes, great folks and a great tool.

Subconsciously on slight hills I was letting off the brake and then putting it in gear, effectively defeating the hill holder. Only noticed that bad habit now that it's off and it's not necessary.

With the coding changed it's been nice driving the car without the hill holder.
I can drive it like you're supposed to drive a manual.

There are probably a few occasions when that function would be OK, and or for someone that doesn't drive a manual regularly, but otherwise not worth the trouble.

This is such a worthwhile thread, I thought I'd bring it to the top in case some haven't seen it.

I just did this and love the results with my 6MT. I got sick of having to remember to change technique during a standing start on a hill vs. on the flat to overcome the hill holder. After a year with it, that inconsistency would still cause me to occasionally stall on a hill start when I would forget to change my behavior, which, after 50 years of driving manuals, I've never had to do.

Whether this will re-code will make a difference probably depends on how aggressive your normal standing starts are. I like clutch engagement with the least possible throttle and RPM, so I'm the worst candidate for this feature.

This could have been an MFA-selectable option with a description that its appropriate for certain driving situations or driver's styles but not for all. VW's lawyers would have nixed that, though.

Funny, I've noticed the hill hold, but never found it to be a problem. Its kind of an odd feeling, but I've never felt like it "held" the brakes as I'm trying to accelerate. Maybe I just naturally give too much fuel and slip the clutch when I'm on a hill!



I'm surprised that VW didn't list this feature as something that could be disabled through the MFD.

KITEWAGON said:

I'm surprised that VW didn't list this feature as something that could be disabled through the MFD.

Click to expand...

Oh please, it'd just confuse people if you had access to it through the MFD, just like a million other things that should be in the MFD that arn't

Windows down with remote anyone?

Sounds like Microsoft Windows Ten which actually is Spy-ware disguised as an operating system.

Part of MS's Windows 10 EULA should include the following:
"Since you are too stupid to know what you want, Microsoft will make those decisions for you. Do not attempt to disable any of the features Microsoft has decided you need as they will be reactivated during the next FORCED update to Window$ 10".

just bill

I took mine to a performance shop that has the electronic equipment with the long coding program. There is a menu by which you can decrease the length of time for the hill holder or zero it out altogether. I had them zero mine out and never had trouble with it again.