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TDI Power Enhancements Discussions about increasing the power of your TDI engine. i.e. chips, injectors, powerboxes, clutches, etc. Handling, suspensions, wheels, type discussion should be put into the "Upgrades (non TDI Engine related)" forum. Non TDI vehicle related postings will be moved or removed. Please note the Performance Disclaimer.

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Old September 11th, 2016, 20:28   #46
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That turbo was defective. Pure and simple. I have run 17 turbos way outside their intended tolerance with ZERO failure. The setup was a typical strong but not overdone hardware profile. The tune was typical for the setup. No failures. Til that one. As a point of interest. Long ago, when we were first running 17's, I had one in my green car. All the testing I did with pumps, nozzles, really edgy tuns and other hardware was done with that 17. Ultimately, when I was doing a new hardware profile along with special nozzles, I ultimately ran that turbo at 47 psi during testing (didnt know it would do that...surprise). It never did fail. I later had it converted to a 1752...where it still lives on. All the conjecture in the world will not change the fact that the turbo I saw, had a fatal flaw from the factory.
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Old September 12th, 2016, 06:38   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrchill View Post
That turbo was defective. Pure and simple. I have run 17 turbos way outside their intended tolerance with ZERO failure. The setup was a typical strong but not overdone hardware profile. The tune was typical for the setup. No failures. Til that one. As a point of interest. Long ago, when we were first running 17's, I had one in my green car. All the testing I did with pumps, nozzles, really edgy tuns and other hardware was done with that 17. Ultimately, when I was doing a new hardware profile along with special nozzles, I ultimately ran that turbo at 47 psi during testing (didnt know it would do that...surprise). It never did fail. I later had it converted to a 1752...where it still lives on. All the conjecture in the world will not change the fact that the turbo I saw, had a fatal flaw from the factory.


Yeah I was surprised my 1st VNT 17 failed with some momentary boost spikes of 28-30psi on a WOT.
New VNT 17 was installed over the weekend. It did have a label glued on it over some engraving as the previous one did. Bought from a different very reputable vendor.
Sent my logs from group 1,3,10 and 1,4,8 together to my tuner. Also group 11. They say everything looks great. Yet I had a boost spike of 24-25psi which was on an uphill pull fairly heavy acceleration but not a WOT. Doesn't help my confidence much as I'm already on the max boost of this turbo without doing a WOT.
I think quality control has gone down hill in my opinion on these VNT 17's. Just my .02. Hope I'm wrong.
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Old September 12th, 2016, 11:13   #48
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If your boost is maxed out at less than WOT, I suggest you to talk to your tuner.
You mention the "spike" how long did it last and what PSI did the turbo settle into on the rest of the hill?
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Old September 12th, 2016, 14:04   #49
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Yeah only lasted a second or so then dropped down to low 20's. Didn't expect to see a spike of 24-25psi.
My logs all checked out by my tuner. I will log a few 3rd gear WOT runs from 1500-4000 on a gradual uphill climb.
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Old September 13th, 2016, 00:39   #50
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The actuator rods are very short on these from the factory, especially cupra turbo's. They need to be much longer.

I doubt the spikes kill them, upper RPM creep will, boost needs to drop a lot after peak power to prevent overspeed.

A lot of customers and tuners miss this when checking logs!
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Old September 13th, 2016, 05:50   #51
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Checked prior to install. My actuator rod was 3inHg when it starts to move and 18inHg at full travel at the stop. Setup was identical to my last one that grenaded.
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Old September 13th, 2016, 06:09   #52
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if thats long enough for you then OK.
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Old September 13th, 2016, 06:13   #53
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You are exactly right Ryan.

The only setting that I have found to repeat success is lifting at 4in-hg, not 3, not 5, not any sort of stop reading. 4in-hg lift.
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Old September 13th, 2016, 06:17   #54
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Default Catastrophic VNT 17 failure

It was set that way from the vendor. They set them all up prior to shipping. Can't imagine 4inHg has much of a difference.
Prolly be kicking myself for not running a 17/22. I run them on two other Jetta's with zero issues.
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Old September 13th, 2016, 07:30   #55
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Most vendors don't set them up, they just ship them as they receive them. 4in-hg makes a HUGE difference on a tuned car.
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Old September 13th, 2016, 10:31   #56
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Default Catastrophic VNT 17 failure

That may be. But this vendor set it up before being shipped. I called them and asked about it.
The range I'm told is 3-5inHg when the rod starts to move and 18-20inHg at full travel at the stop.


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Old September 13th, 2016, 10:46   #57
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I have overboost on my vnt17 at wot 4000rpm in 4th and 5th. Duty cycle hitting 94.4%. Car has hflox 240s from Ryan. Stock tune. Actuator starts to move at 3 and hits stop at 18. I started a thread and received mixed advice, 2 posters said leave actuator alone as it's probably excess fuel which should be sorted by mapping, 2 other posters said to lengthen actuator by half or full turn before mapping. I decided to leave it alone.

Reading the last few posts here I might lengthen the actuator so it lifts off at 4. I didn't really pay much attention to when the actuator started to move as research pointed to hitting the stop at 18 as being the magical number. I rebuilt the 17 with new melett core and garett actuator and had it flow tested on a proper bench. That's why I was reluctant to adjust actuator.
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Old September 13th, 2016, 12:29   #58
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That is the problem with forums, so many people repeat the wrong information you don't know who to trust.
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Old September 13th, 2016, 16:44   #59
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OP, I would be concerned about parts going back through the exhaust manifold and getting ate by pistons.

Yes it can happen, up stream past valves only to be beat to hell by a piston.

I have a short block sitting here that suffered this same failure. I'll see if I can get some pics.
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Old September 13th, 2016, 18:12   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zuks90idi View Post
OP, I would be concerned about parts going back through the exhaust manifold and getting ate by pistons.

Yes it can happen, up stream past valves only to be beat to hell by a piston.

I have a short block sitting here that suffered this same failure. I'll see if I can get some pics.


Yeah was a concern that's why I spent a lot of time cleaning/inspecting everything. Compression check was good. Wasn't about to pull my head.
Spent a lot of time with the IC, air box, Intake, piping as most likely any shrapnel will accumulate in the IC. The exhaust turbine wheel that sheared off most likely shot out my 2.5" exhaust. I don't have any interferences with it. Everything else looked great. Yeah maybe I rolled the dice not pulling the head to inspect further. But I didn't think it was necessary.



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