Looking to make serious power out of an ALH, need BIG turbo advice

2000tdijettafast · May 12, 2018

Hey guys, let me start with saying im rather experienced in big turbo builds, im just looking for advice from people who have built the extreme end of things, I have maxed out the GTB housings so i want something bigger, i think ball bearing.

What i have now: jetta, ALH 81.5mm bore, CNC ported head, big valves, stage 3 colt cam, 12mm pump 6 speed, rather well built car, runs a 12.9@108 in the 1/4. I have a chance to sell the GTB2568vk on the car so i think im going to use it as an excuse to go larger

Any suggestions on large turbos? the car is pretty much just a 1/4 mile car
Thanks!!

Yourbuddysatin · May 12, 2018

What’s the current internals?

2000tdijettafast · May 12, 2018

Internals are .5 over BHW pistons and I.E. rods

TDIMeister · May 12, 2018

There is no such thing as a GTB2568vk. That came from Garrett anyway.

mrchill · May 12, 2018

where did you find someone to cnc a head? But yes...the ball bearing turbos work well.

Macradiators.com · May 13, 2018

im sure it's a hybrid, that turbo is good for 400 hp, i dont see how you max it out with 12.9 seconds/402m
traction issues?

2000tdijettafast · May 13, 2018

yes that turbo was a 2260 that i had changed,

the head came from marko p NPSheads, i would highly suggest him, hes a stand up guy! made me a few over time.

You would be surprised how hard it is to push a little jetta into the 12s. its a full interior jetta. my buddys 2260, 6 speed car runs a 14.9 for comparison, the track is a little tough and uphill

Yourbuddysatin · May 13, 2018

2000tdijettafast said:
Internals are .5 over BHW pistons and I.E. rods

Might want to convert to a pd bottom end since they are stronger. Sounds like you are in the right track though. Fueling is usually the problem for making the power you want. Might want to compound turbo it. Large turbo might be too laggy.

[486] · May 13, 2018

hx35 9cm housing

2000tdijettafast · May 13, 2018

The bottom end is very built, the only stock part/ difference would be slight crank journal size, and i wont have a crank problem in an alh! they are stout and very short! ahah im leaning to staying with the 2568 but maybe going v so its roller and larger housings.

My only real concern for spool is 3500-5500 rpms, i launch it at 5500 and shift at 5500 so it shouldn't really see below that

Yourbuddysatin · May 13, 2018

Over my head I’m out haha

KERMA · May 13, 2018

one word: compounds

2000tdijettafast · May 14, 2018

Charlie! haha I had a thought about it but i figured it would be about pointless because unless the car is at idle id doesn't see below 3500 rpms. The car is really just a 1/4 mile car, i could care less about driveability at this point in its life.

I'm debating between an hx35 and go for it or have a BMW ball bearing hybrid turbo made somewhere around the size of mine now.

nitec · May 14, 2018

He351 - hx35 turbine, hx40 compressor...but I do agree that you need something smaller ahead of it to help you get rolling...

KERMA · May 14, 2018

dude you are already making serious power what are you talking about "'need to make serious power" lol

I'll say it again, compounds. Or a blower, now that would be cool. Fit it in place of the a/c and use awic

or common rail swap if you feel (really) ambitious, and we'll set the benchmark for the future that everyone will strive for. Since this is a bona fide dedicated motorsports application the sky is the limit as to what we can do.

TDIMeister · May 14, 2018

There's no real need to reinvent the wheel. If you could care less about daily driveability, there are guys in Finland already pushing over 350 HP with S356V turbos.

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=475325&highlight=S300V
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=487882&highlight=S300V
http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=351543&highlight=S300V

pdtdiarl · May 14, 2018

Isn't PD fuel injection with nozzles better for those numbers?

Votblindub · May 14, 2018

Is swapping to a motor with more pistons an option?

[486] · May 14, 2018

dodge/cummins takeoff turbos are dirt cheap

HX35, HY35, HE351, HX40, HE351V whatever, they're all going to light up plenty snappy at 3500 rpm with fuel behind them

the vane ones will need some computer junk figured out but that's doable with a lot of time investment
the dumb wastegate ones, look for one with under say... 14cm volute and don't bother to hook up the wastegate can to anything, if you want more than that'll make, weld the gate shut, dodge guys do it all the time and they're driving it with 3 times the displacement.

diffas · May 15, 2018

Forget holsets. Bw s200sxe series, seriously.

2000tdijettafast · May 15, 2018

Thanks for the replies guys! This is going to be out of order but ill try to address everyone! haha

CR would make more power for sure, as well as a PD fueling system. No we cant add more cylinders, I have some of them fancy V8 cars I also add crazy boost too

The reason i want a ALH single charger is because that's what i deal in. I build cars for customers so i use this as my business card!

And that's why i was thinking HX35 ish, i dont street it and they are dirt cheap around here!

sltlytwkd · May 15, 2018

North American Turbo has a very good rep for modifying holsets in the cummins world...

[486] · May 15, 2018

diffas said:
Forget holsets. Bw s200sxe series, seriously.

sadly, there aren't nearly as many on the used market here
also they're all a little bit small, like 50mm inducer

Fix_Until_Broke · May 15, 2018

Definately not in my experience wheelhouse, but what about a stock duramax or powerstroke variable geometry turbo? Those are typically good for 500+ HP with PR's in the 4+'s while being pretty cheap/easy to find. The variable geometry should help it spool up and then get out of the way to make "big" power at 3500-5500 RPM. They spool well at 1500 RPM on 6.6L so it should start coming to life by 3500 RPM on 2L I'd think?

TDIMeister · May 15, 2018

Fix_Until_Broke said:
Definately not in my experience wheelhouse, but what about a stock duramax or powerstroke variable geometry turbo? Those are typically good for 500+ HP with PR's in the 4+'s while being pretty cheap/easy to find. The variable geometry should help it spool up and then get out of the way to make "big" power at 3500-5500 RPM. They spool well at 1500 RPM on 6.6L so it should start coming to life by 3500 RPM on 2L I'd think?

I looked into this. Both Powerstroke and Duramax turbos use a different electro-hydraulic vane actuating mechanism (AVNT) and there doesn't seem to be any easy way to adapt a vacuum canister. That being said, I read around and learned that the Duramax AVNT solenoid uses 140 Hz PWM, so if you can convert that to 300 Hz that the N75 uses (and yes, you can do that) and figure out the oil supply, which should be very easy since you already have the lubrication to the CHRA, you should be able to get it to work. OEM to the Duramax is a GT3782VA and would make a great LP stage or, stand-alone stage if not interested in low-end torque and response.

Edit: It was some months ago when I last looked into this so I had the PWM frequency wrong. Googling again, looks like it's more like 3300Hz. Still no big deal, could be done with dedicated circuitry for someone who knows what he's doing, or an Arduino or Raspberry Pi board.

diffas · May 15, 2018

[486] said:
sadly, there aren't nearly as many on the used market here
also they're all a little bit small, like 50mm inducer

Sxe has only 52.2 and 57mm compressors and capable over 500hp. And the new ones are cheap, like 600€ or so.

[486] · May 15, 2018

Good used HX35s are like a hundred usd here. 85 euros
I'm a bottomfeeder, can't justify the marginally better efficiency when the old tech is so cheap.

TDIMeister said:
I looked into this. Both Powerstroke and Duramax turbos use a different electro-hydraulic vane actuating mechanism (AVNT) and there doesn't seem to be any easy way to adapt a vacuum canister. That being said, I read around and learned that the Duramax AVNT solenoid uses 140 Hz PWM, so if you can convert that to 300 Hz that the N75 uses (and yes, you can do that) and figure out the oil supply, which should be very easy since you already have the lubrication to the CHRA, you should be able to get it to work. OEM to the Duramax is a GT3782VA and would make a great LP stage or, stand-alone stage if not interested in low-end torque and response.

Edit: It was some months ago when I last looked into this so I had the PWM frequency wrong. Googling again, looks like it's more like 3300Hz. Still no big deal, could be done with dedicated circuitry for someone who knows what he's doing, or an Arduino or Raspberry Pi board.

the 6.0 ford garrett oil actuated one I was looking at a while back was just two wire PWM fed straight to an oil control solenoid, so frequency doesn't really matter. Amperage however will likely be more than the N75, so you might need to make a simple little transistor amplifier.

Big huge problem is spending the time to tune it proper. Been procrastinating on flashing more fuel into my tune for the last month or more, and that's just real easy edcsuite type changes...

BigTurboAlh · May 16, 2018

[486] said:
Good used HX35s are like a hundred usd here. 85 euros
I'm a bottomfeeder, can't justify the marginally better efficiency when the old tech is so cheap.

im with ya on that cheap reliable cheap and easy to rebuild. flows decent too.

3L3M3NT · May 18, 2018

You could try the GTD2872VRK from Darkside. https://www.darksidedevelopments.co.uk/products/darkside-gtd2872vrk-billet-hybrid-with-vacuum-conversion.html

TDIMeister · May 18, 2018

Gotta love the creative made-up designations. I'll have my money ready when there's a GTZ9999ABCDEFGHIJLKMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ.

Looking to make serious power out of an ALH, need BIG turbo advice

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