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TDI Conversions Discussions on converting non TDIs into TDIS. More general items can be answered better in other sections. This is ideal for issues that don't have an overlap and are very special to swaping engines.

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Old July 26th, 2019, 10:24   #31
QuickTD
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Not sure why you removed the tank, everything is accessible via the panels beneath the rear seat. Late model B6's had the B7 tank. The major difference is that the suction jet pump plumbing is internal on the b7 tank where it was previously external. If you got an A4 Quattro diesel pump assembly it should be plug and play. The suction jet pump hole size may need to be drilled out to around .050" to provide enough flow to siphon the fuel across. The gas setup has a tiny hole but got the job done by running at 60psi. The diesel transfer pump is only 15psi.

The vent lines all connect to the filler neck. I just remove the charcoal canister connection and attach a filter to the vent. The filter used on the leak test pump is suitable. You'll find the leak test pump under the left rear fender liner. It, the charcoal canister and their associated plumbing can be removed.
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Old July 26th, 2019, 11:01   #32
Koehn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QuickTD View Post
Not sure why you removed the tank, everything is accessible via the panels beneath the rear seat. Late model B6's had the B7 tank. The major difference is that the suction jet pump plumbing is internal on the b7 tank where it was previously external. If you got an A4 Quattro diesel pump assembly it should be plug and play. The suction jet pump hole size may need to be drilled out to around .050" to provide enough flow to siphon the fuel across. The gas setup has a tiny hole but got the job done by running at 60psi. The diesel transfer pump is only 15psi.

The vent lines all connect to the filler neck. I just remove the charcoal canister connection and attach a filter to the vent. The filter used on the leak test pump is suitable. You'll find the leak test pump under the left rear fender liner. It, the charcoal canister and their associated plumbing can be removed.
Removed the tank primarily so it's easier to remove the flapper and clean up anything that falls down the tube. How do you usually open it up?

Good tip on the charcoal canister delete by using the test pump filter. Do you just leave that sealed up in the compartment under the spare tire then?

I've got a used diesel FWD diesel pump assembly, I was planning on just swapping the pump over into the gasoline quattro holder. Or is even the pump itself different FWD->Quattro? Haven't yet had a chance to compare what I've got, should be opening the tank after work today.
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Old July 26th, 2019, 13:09   #33
QuickTD
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I just savage the flapper out by partially sawing it with a hacksaw blade and collapsing it. I blow the residue down into the tank and swab the whole thing out with the remaining gas. I also remove the vent valve guts in the filler neck. I clamped the filter directly on the filler neck vent. I figure it lived under the fender liner on the left, it should survive on the right side as well...

I use the canister space inside the tire well to hide my contraband...
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Old July 26th, 2019, 20:20   #34
Koehn
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I use the canister space inside the tire well to hide my contraband...
I can't say I didn't think about that the second I cracked open that panel!


Now that I've got the lift pump out, I can see the one I received from Frans is quite different. It's on a rigid frame, that mounts straight up and down from the top flange, and has a narrower top plate.

The one in my tank seems to be very similar to the B7 ones I see on Google (makes sense), but with a white top plate. The base and top plate slide together on a rail with a spring, and the whole assembly sits angled in the fuel tank in relation to the access port.

The diesel pump was pretty easy to remove from it's carrier, but I don't think I can get the gas one out without breaking another part. I manage to poke the filter sock off the end, but it seems to be stuck to this larger white piece of plastic that won't fit through the opening...
EDIT: I just needed dinner. Second attempt, that little piece fell right off and the pump came off



The piece that has temporarily stopped progress



The B6 diesel lift pump assembly. It's apparently for a FWD car, but it seemed to have the connector relevant to the transfer siphon



My gasoline fuel pump, I definitely seem to have a mixed bag B6/B7 car!



The diesel pump assembly is both to tall and narrow to be used, so either I need to remove the gasoline pump from the carrier without breaking stuff (preferable), or I need to find a B7 diesel lift pump

Last edited by Koehn; July 26th, 2019 at 22:39.
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Old July 27th, 2019, 15:04   #35
Braddman
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For my A4 B7 BHW TDI swap I’m just using the gasoline fuel pump connected to a Holley carb fuel pressure regulator then about 9psi goes to the bhw fuel filter then tandem pump then the evap hardline under the car was used as a return line to the fuel tank. As the B7 2.0t didn’t have a return line. Also the fuel filter under the car was removed. I bought the car with the swap mostly finished and I am working on finishing it up. I have put 15,000km on the swap and the fuel setup seams to work great.
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Old July 29th, 2019, 23:12   #36
Koehn
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More progress, and more roadblocks!

As I mentioned in the edit, I managed to remove the gasoline pump without breaking anything. Slipped in the diesel pump and hooked all the lines up, and placed it back in the tank after draining all the diesel out. The I changed my focus to the filler neck. I stuffed a rag down the neck then followed QuickTD's advice and attacked it with a hacksaw. Once enough cuts were made I could collapse it with a screw driver and pull pieces out with a pair of sidecuts. The process wasn't pretty, but the results will work!




With my work on the tank finished, it was time to reinstall it. This was the first part I'd put back on the car so it felt nice to be working in the other direction for once! Took me a bit of wrestling, but overall it went pretty smoothly. I also removed the activated charcoal and EVAP test pump like QuickTD mentioned. Cleaning out so much stuff felt great, I just need to finish mounting the vent filter to the filler neck. My current plan is the cut the plastic hose leading out of the top of the filler neck vent and mate it to the rubber hose with the filter, shouldn't be too hard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Braddman View Post
For my A4 B7 BHW TDI swap Iím just using the gasoline fuel pump connected to a Holley carb fuel pressure regulator then about 9psi goes to the bhw fuel filter then tandem pump then the evap hardline under the car was used as a return line to the fuel tank. As the B7 2.0t didnít have a return line. Also the fuel filter under the car was removed. I bought the car with the swap mostly finished and I am working on finishing it up. I have put 15,000km on the swap and the fuel setup seams to work great.
My B6 is also returnless, and I was going to go the FPR route. The AWX/AVF engine is actually a looped fuel system so there is an outfeed from the tandem pump. I think then going the FPR route would have required a check valve or something else messy, so I just went with the diesel pump.

I was actually just under the car and figured I could use that same EVAP line to run my return! There's a connection right behind the right front wheel so I can either run the new line straight to there, or I can hook it up where the EVAP line enters the engine bay. I'm also considering running the mk4 1.8T tank mounted filter because then the factory supply lines would all have something to connect to and I only have to adapt the return between the rear EVAP line and the old short return (probably cut the male end off the old filter?).


After finishing mounting the tank I was feeling proud and figured I could go straight into the front suspension. Boy was I not ready... Judging by the yellow marks, both front knuckles are from the wrecker already, but whoever put them together has clearly never heard of anti-seize. On both sides, the upper pinch bolt holding the top ball joints in (colloquially known as the b**** bolt) was completely frozen. The nut spun off with relative ease, but the bolts will not come out.




I can't even describe how much time I spent on those two bolts. A few days of PB Blaster soaking, propane then MAPP gas, impact gun on the heads till they both twisted off, cutoff wheel down the pinch slots to segment the bolt, and countless hits with a hammer and punch... they didn't even move a millimeter. So now I'm looking at finding a used pair of knuckles



After taking a break from those I went and replaced all the front control arms, tie rods, end links and struts in. The Delphi Option 3 kit from FCP Euro is a solid kit. Many of the old bushings were done and the ball joints loose, so this will make the car feel so much better. The only weird thing about their kit is the hardware they supply. I haven't installed the knuckles yet, so there's still the two 4" pinch bolts to go in, but I ended up with a ton of extras... I'm not sure where I went wrong to be honest. Some of the old bolts didn't even seem to have replacements, like the lower sway bar end link bolts and the tie-rod pinch bolts. Also the larger M12 nuts were pretty different than what was on the car.




That last image is everything I had leftover after loosely bolting all eight control arms, both end links and both tie-rods in. A lot of the arms had their own hardware in their respective bags, so for example the two tiny bolts with washers are for the top of the tie-rod ball joints, but they weren't needed. The two bent-metal tabs fit nicely on the front lower control arm's stub where the sway bar end link bolts on, but they have tabs sticking out that interfere with the link itself. If the endlinks bolted to the other side of that stub then they'd be perfect. It's really weird.

Finally, when tightening the top nut on the shock shaft to the specified torque (I think it was 55nm/37ft-lb?) the allen bolt started to round out before I could even get to the spec. I really don't think I did anything wrong: deep offset wrench counter-holding the nut, and the torque wrench on the 6mm Allen. So I'll add that one to my frustration bank.



Progress... kinda.
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Old July 30th, 2019, 21:35   #37
Koehn
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Fuel system update:

The mk4 golf 1.8T fuel filter fits perfectly in the stock location, but in my case it doesn't have the correct size of quick connect fitting for the tank side stock supply line. But, that's actually fine because it was way easier to bypass than I'd thought!

While removing the rest of the evap system from under both front fender liners (and a shocking amount of dirt and pine needles), I ended up salvaging two plastic male quick disconnects. I then clamped each of those to a short length of 5/8" fuel hose and that was basically all that was required at the tank end.



The long straight evap line that parallels the fuel supply line on the right side of the car has quick disconnects at either end. So since I removed the rest of the lines in the front fender well, I just added my fuel hose to the existing body clamps and tucked them under the covers. I'm sure others have done this exact thing it's all pretty slick and should work really well!







So satisfying to remove all of that and not have to put it back in the car. I also thought all the lines were just plastic, but it turns out the section running under the body and around the fuel tank is actually plastic-coated steel lines
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Old August 9th, 2019, 23:31   #38
Koehn
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Made some progress, hit some roadblocks. What else is new





Ever since I dropped the rear subframe and disassembled everything, my rear tie arms have been firmly stuck in the knuckles. I tried hitting it with a hammer/chisel, lots of PB, but I couldn't get it to budge. I didn't realize the tie arm interfaced inside the knuckle like the rear shock did. Once I knew that I was able to rock it out by inserting a bolt and hitting it up and down.





Getting everything reassembled was a real workout (the springs especially), but I'm happy to report that the rear end is back in! With a slight issue... it seems to be riding wayyyyy too high



It was getting late and I'm exhausted so I haven't looked closely, plus the left rear caliper seems to be seized . I went to retract the piston and noticed the e-brake lever hadn't returned (the helper spring was compressed) so I had to lever the lever () back to it's resting position. After I did that I still couldn't depress the piston. It's my understanding that both rear calipers twist in clockwise.

The ride height is really concerning me. I used to have about the same height as my tire in gap to the fender and now it's basically double that... new shocks but same old springs. Any clue as to what happened? Besides the obvious need for an alignment! I made sure I had everything loosely bolted together and then I only tightened the subframe stretch bolts and all the control arm bolts with the hubs sitting on jack stands like this (wood stacks for safety)

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Old August 16th, 2019, 22:13   #39
QuickTD
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You'll need to roll the car a bit to get the suspension to settle. Letting my B6 or B7 down off the hoist will have it riding about 2" high until I roll out the door. The short control arms cause a reduction in wheel track when elevated, and need a bit of rolling to relax.

It would probably be best to loosen and re-tighten the suspension bushing bolts on an alignment lift, while the wheels are sitting on bearing plates. Maybe when you get it aligned you could request that this be done.
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Old August 18th, 2019, 21:06   #40
Koehn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Braddman View Post
For my A4 B7 BHW TDI swap I’m just using the gasoline fuel pump connected to a Holley carb fuel pressure regulator then about 9psi goes to the bhw fuel filter then tandem pump then the evap hardline under the car was used as a return line to the fuel tank. As the B7 2.0t didn’t have a return line. Also the fuel filter under the car was removed. I bought the car with the swap mostly finished and I am working on finishing it up. I have put 15,000km on the swap and the fuel setup seams to work great.
Quote:
Originally Posted by QuickTD View Post
You'll need to roll the car a bit to get the suspension to settle. Letting my B6 or B7 down off the hoist will have it riding about 2" high until I roll out the door. The short control arms cause a reduction in wheel track when elevated, and need a bit of rolling to relax.

It would probably be best to loosen and re-tighten the suspension bushing bolts on an alignment lift, while the wheels are sitting on bearing plates. Maybe when you get it aligned you could request that this be done.
I appreciate the feedback! I was hoping it just needed to roll once I got this car back together. If not I'll be sure to bring it up to the alignment people.

I've made a bit more progress since the last update. Replacement front knuckles were installed completing the front suspension. Getting it all back together without the weight of the engine made for a difficult time! Once the engine is back in I'll be able to tighten the lower bushing bolts properly.

Then I finished up what I could to the wiring on the engine. Lengthened the A/C compressor connector to reach the other side of the engine; removed the connector housing on the starter motor lead because the diesel starter just has a blade on it; and finally crimped in the reverse light switch connector from by AMB engine as the actual crimped sockets were too big to be swapped into the other housing (the connectors between the two housings were very different). I still haven't touched the wiring between engine and car... I'm starting to worry that's to far above my ability.

Aaaaannyways, today I tried pulling the old pilot bearing out to no avail. All the backyard methods seemed to fail me, so that means it's time to buy a new tool. At least its good to have a blind bearing puller around anyways. Since I was stalled out on that bearing, I chose to not do anything more there and instead moved to the last touch-ups on the transmission (or rather transaxle?). Applied some lithium grease to the throughout bearing face. I also I bought a shifter rebuild kit from FCP as I noticed a bit of slop in mine.



Turns out, it was the wrong kit. My car being a 2005 was included in the B7 list of compatible cars and it looks like they shrunk the size of the steel ball that fits in the plastic cup. Haha just my luck, guess I'll be going to my local Audi dealer soon.



EDIT: I also still have no idea what these two connectors are for. They're on the trunk as the A/C compressor connector but as far as I can tell they don't have anything to connect to!#2 is brown/green and red/white while #4 is red/white and brown/yellow



Last edited by Koehn; August 18th, 2019 at 21:26.
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Old September 5th, 2019, 00:08   #41
Koehn
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Feel like it's been a while since I updated, and I've actually got a lot to show for this time! Two weeks ago, with a lot of help from my dad, I got the engine/trans assembly mounted back in the bay. It felt sooooo good to have something sitting in that big empty space again.



Fresh dual mass flywheel, clutch disk and pressure plate all mounted up before marrying the transmission and engine. It got dark on us by the time things were buttoned up, but it was bolted in!



Before installing the assembly into the car, I tried to mount the diesel starter, but it interfered with the turbo support brace. Once I removed that, I still couldn't get it to sit properly so I gave up. Tried again the next day with it in the car, and my extra long 240mm-compatible diesel starter fit perfectly. Does the AVF version of this engine just not have a turbo support brace to begin with? I couldn't find another part number



Since then, I've been slowly buttoning up each part. Joined my fuel supply and newly-run return lines to the engine. Mounted coolant hoses, reinstalled the clutch slave cylinder and the replacement shifter linkage bushing, put the power steering pump in place and put the serpentine belt on, fixed the brake booster vacuum line I ran earlier, reinstalled the propshaft, and dumped all the plenum chamber connectors in the box. Then I went to install the diesel intercooler I bought, and ran into an unexpected problem... turns out the diesel B6 uses a different washer fluid reservoir than the gasoline version I didn't take pictures, but basically the required bracket pulls the bottom of the intercooler so far in, that it hits the tank and check-valve. I mentioned earlier that the gasoline intercooler was smaller, but the outlet is also smaller so the rubber diesel pipe that links to the plastic crossover pipe was too big. Plus I just really wanted to use the diesel intercooler. Luckily the S4 has the same part number, it's on it's way so I can't verify it'll work yet.

I think in the future I'll add a B7 A4 right side-mount to the setup. I know I'll need the bracket, intercooler, and duct. I believe the stock turbo-outlet hose can even swivel to meet the bottom inlet. The only thing I haven't figured out yet is how to go from the upper outlet down to the lower core support brace/boost tube. The B7 A4 tube turns up at the passenger end to meet the rubber hose, but I can't use that because the front snub mount is the other way around. Definitely open to hearing if anyone has a solution to this!

While I'm at it, does anybody know of a bolt-on intermediate pipe that will link the diesel cat-pipe to the rest of the gasoline exhaust system? The gasoline pipe has the right flange, but at a completely different angle (plus it's super rusty and the flex joint is blown out). I'll probably just get a local shop to build that piece for me, but I'm interested. Darkside makes a full de-cat pipe and intermediate pipe combo, but they don't guarantee fitment with AWD models.



I've been distracting myself a little with a fun upgrade as I'm going. I bought a set of 17z 6-piston Brembo front calipers from a Touareg that was parting out for $200! I'm still in the process of cleaning them up for painting and I'm not sure which colour to go for with the Dolphin Grey paint of my car. Considering yellow, but I'm also thinking of a navy blue. I just picked up a set of B6 S4 rear calipers too, so it should be a great pair. More info about this swap can be found here clicky-click



Finally, what I've been working on the most these past few days is the wiring. I tried without success to find someone in the area willing to help, so that just meant I had to buckle down and suck it up Turns out it hasn't been all that bad after all. With the lower dash and steering wheel I have good-enough access to what I need. Most of the mis-matched circuits don't have to be changed (at least 7/20 require no changes with another 6 circuits being fixed by replacing the accelerator pedal with the diesel model). I probed out the more questionable circuits today and I think I have it pretty dialed in. I had to swap two pins on the engine side, I'll only have to run 4 new wires into the plenum chamber connectors, and I'll have to bypass the gasoline J17 fuel pump relay as the diesel one is found in the engine harness. Once I can make sure this is what I actually have to do, I'll link up my documentation!



That leads me to my final questions for tonight. Where is the switched power terminal 75x? Everywhere I've searched online has images that show a neat row of screw-terminal connections under the relays, but I only see the 3 terminals shown in the above picture up against the firewall (top one is labeled D-1 and all are constant power btw). The only thing under the relays was the J519 electrical system control module and some bigger fuses (I think for window regulators and stuff?).

I need to run a wire from wire connection (A2) (which comes out of the ignition pin 6/15) to T17d/16. If anyone knows where to splice into this connection it would be greatly appreciated.
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Old September 10th, 2019, 09:09   #42
Koehn
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The re-wiring went easy enough once I managed to source the pins I needed from the junkyard! Again I'll try to clarify what I had to do later. Right now I'm getting stuck on pairing the cluster and the ECU.

Frans supplied me with the ECU but didn't provide an SKC, and I didn't know to ask. Using VAG EEPROM Programmer I was able to get the SKC for my new diesel cluster, but the program keeps giving me the error message "rx: timeout" whenever I attempt to read the ECU EEPROM.

I'm using a genuine Ross-Tech HEX+CAN cable with the Ross-Tech VCP drivers. I've attempted various versions of VAG K+CAN Commander as well, but haven't been able to get them to even acknowledge the system.

If anyone has advice on how to secure the ECU SKC or how to delete the IMMO 3 from the cluster, I'd really appreciate it. I'm sooooooo close to having a car again!

Here's the dump of the TDI cluster I made for reference: clicky
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Old September 10th, 2019, 17:51   #43
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Still working through the cluster adaptation process. Moved forward but I seem to have hit another wall.

Cluster SKC is 1240
ECU SKC is 8602

In VCDS I can see that the IMMO ID is different between the two controllers. When I login to each controller using the appropriate SKC, nothing seems to change (is that normal?) Following the Ross-Tech instructions, I go to Insturments-17, then Login-11 and enter 01240. Then I go into Adaptation-10, Channel 050 -> Read. The stored value is 32000. In the New Value field I enter in the ECU SKC (08602), click Test and then the fields up above show "System" "Not OK". I've tried this numerous times, it always ends the same way. Advice?
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Old September 10th, 2019, 23:00   #44
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Great to see your progress, fun to watch it come together. Looks like it will turn out great.

Wish I had some ideas for you on the cluster questions but someone with the knowledge no doubt will chime in.

What clutch and flywheel package did you choose? Stock AVF parts or other?
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Old September 11th, 2019, 10:41   #45
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Great to see your progress, fun to watch it come together. Looks like it will turn out great.

Wish I had some ideas for you on the cluster questions but someone with the knowledge no doubt will chime in.

What clutch and flywheel package did you choose? Stock AVF parts or other?
I'm glad you enjoyed it! My goal with this thread was always to compile as much information for others to follow as possible while working through the difficulties of my first engine swap. But it's kinda turned into my own echo-chamber

Because I'm keeping everything stock for the time being (with hopefully a tune close down the road) I went with stock AVF parts. From what I've read, it should even be able to hold my eventual modest power target of around 200hp / 440ft/lbs. And because it's the 240mm flywheel it should be easier to find alternatives too if it slips



As for the cluster, I've got a few threads open elsewhere hoping for knowledgable people to chime in. I also had a few epiphanies late last night that might give me a couple new avenues to try after work today:
1) I should try following the Ross-Tech instructions for swapping the ECU instead of the cluster and see if that works

2) If this works and I get the diesel ecu and cluster adapted, they'll still have an IMMO ID that is different than my existing keys for this car. I'm uncertain to the extent of the ability to reprogram keys, can they be paired to match this new setup? If not, then I'll either need to get new keys cut to program myself (really not ideal) or I'll still have to IMMO delete the ecu (also not ideal but more likely to happen).

3) I still have my both the gas ecu & gas cluster from before completing the engine swap. So what's the best way to get that IMMO ID onto both my new diesel ecu and cluster? Do I unplug the diesel engine harness and hookup the gas one so I can adapt the diesel cluster to the gas ecu (which may likely result in System Not OK again), then swap engine harnesses again and adapt the diesel ecu to the diesel cluster (which would now have the gas IMMO ID?).

4) Or instead, can the diesel cluster eeprom be edited to have the same IMMO ID as the gas one (once I dump that) while still having the coding that makes it function as a diesel cluster? Then I'd go back to epiphany 1) and pair the diesel ecu to the diesel cluster and they'd both share my gasoline IMMO ID and everything would work hunky-dory. If this is the smartest route, then I'll very likely need someone who actually knows what they're doing to edit my files for me
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