Air to water intercoolers

Runninwild · Feb 8, 2020

Anyone running a awic setup? Mainly have questions about the heat exchanger. What's everyone do for a home built setup? I was thinking of running a huge heat exchanger from a vehicle air conditioner setup. I know rv pumps are cheap and work fairly well. Is there any issues with heat soak from contact with a radiator or is it best to leave an airgap between the 2?

flee · Feb 8, 2020

I got most of my AWIC bits from Frozenboost.
I used the smallish heat exchanger that fit in front of the passenger side front wheel.
A larger one like you are thinking of would be better, obviously.
The space gets tight in front of the radiator so you may have to modify the grill.
Avoiding contact with the radiator is probably a good idea.

Runninwild · Feb 8, 2020

flee said:
I got most of my AWIC bits from Frozenboost.
I used the smallish heat exchanger that fit in front of the passenger side front wheel.
A larger one like you are thinking of would be better, obviously.
The space gets tight in front of the radiator so you may have to modify the grill.
Avoiding contact with the radiator is probably a good idea.

It's going in a Tacoma I have tons of room, just not a lot of room to squish 2" pipe between the rad and headlights for a front mount oc

CNGVW · Feb 8, 2020

I run one setup I build use the bigger air to water cooler and use a a stand alone front radiator and use a water pump out of a RV, most pump sold with the kits do not move the needed coolant to do the job

[486] · Feb 9, 2020

I'm running the inverter pump and radiator from a first gen prius
just because I found them in the junkyard and they wanted like 20 bucks

keeps the IC cool to the touch, even being welded all together into an intake manifold that is bolted directly to the cylinder head

oh, and I'm running two ICs in the loop, all plumbed in series, the intake manifold integrated one that is obviously the HP one, then another for the LP turbo.

maybe if it were in a heavier car I'd run into heatsoak, but as it is I'm doing 120 before the MAT sensor can even react at all

Runninwild · Feb 9, 2020

CNGVW said:
I run one setup I build use the bigger air to water cooler and use a a stand alone front radiator and use a water pump out of a RV, most pump sold with the kits do not move the needed coolant to do the job

I think that's the same one I'm planning on going with. How do you like it's performance? Ever notice any heatsoak or negatives with it?

Mongler98 · Feb 9, 2020

The one really nice thing about w2a is winter driving. Having a nice warm air vs ambient. Other than this. It's all about space and some performance pros and cons just like a2a. Imo both are equal. Just depends on application. I wont be using w2a on my 400hp+ build as the nos will do the cooling for me

Runninwild · Feb 9, 2020

Mongler98 said:
The one really nice thing about w2a is winter driving. Having a nice warm air vs ambient. Other than this. It's all about space and some performance pros and cons just like a2a. Imo both are equal. Just depends on application. I wont be using w2a on my 400hp+ build as the nos will do the cooling for me

Yeah it's going in a Tacoma on a bhw with a stage 2 tune nothing too crazy. Will mostly be highway and offroad use. Mainly going this route for ease of install.

[486] · Feb 9, 2020

Mongler98 said:
The one really nice thing about w2a is winter driving. Having a nice warm air vs ambient.

you do not use engine coolant in an ic
unless you're cummins or navistar or any other number of tractor engine manufacturers totally unconcerned with performance

besides, you'd probably never be able to get the engine coolant above about 90F

flee · Feb 9, 2020

[486] said:
you do not use engine coolant in an ic
unless you're cummins or navistar or any other number of tractor engine manufacturers totally unconcerned with performance
besides, you'd probably never be able to get the engine coolant above about 90F

Yeah, it makes no sense to preheat the AWIC by running coolant through it.
The whole point is to chill the intake as close to ambient as possible.

turbobrick240 · Feb 9, 2020

Or even below ambient if you have an ice box. But that's more of a drag car thing.

Mongler98 · Feb 9, 2020

Not when its minus 20 outside. And besides. You can easily put a water to water heater between the coolant and the IC water tank. It's been done plenty of times. Leave the pump off and it does not heat the tank. Turn it on and it gets heated. Goes inline at the heater core lines. And if your using a frost heater it helps big time on cold starts. Think how cummins uses a air heater coil vs glow plugs.

Runninwild · Feb 9, 2020

What pumps is everyone using?

Markus L · Feb 9, 2020

I'm gonna use Pierburg CWA200, but I'm sure smaller pump (for example CWA50) is sufficient for your project.

flee · Feb 10, 2020

Frozenboost supplied a Rule 3/4" inline pump. Rugged and lightweight and seems OK.
I also have scrounged a VW electric water pump and a Ford one from a hybrid Escape.

CNGVW · Feb 10, 2020

I run a 3-5 GPM 12 RV water pump with a radiator up front closed loop setup. We run 7 hr races when the car comes of the track you can grab the out let pipe with your hand.
Look in the grill you can see the small radiator you must burp the system in my car of all the air. We run windshield fluid in our system it a better heat exchange fluid

turbobrick240 · Feb 11, 2020

Windshield fluid actually has slightly worse heat exchanging properties than plain water. But it won't freeze nearly as easily.

Runninwild · Feb 11, 2020

turbobrick240 said:
Windshield fluid actually has slightly worse heat exchanging properties than plain water. But it won't freeze nearly as easily.

Yeah I was thinking of using that over regular coolant. Know of any issues using it long term?

I ended up going with this pump. Hope it holds up. Kind of a budget setup http://www.frozenboost.com/liquid-a....html?osCsid=8974ef52ee6fd75160f5ad5cab427bd0

I also ordered this ac condenser. It has a 25.75" x 16" core with 5\8 and 3\8" inlet\outlets. Hoping it does a decent job.
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/aw/d/B000C7QC26?ref=ppx_pt2_mob_b_prod_image

turbobrick240 · Feb 11, 2020

Straight methanol is pretty aggressive against aluminum, but when it's mostly diluted with water in windshield fluid, I don't think it would be much of an issue. I'd rather use a dilute anti-freeze blend myself. 10/90 in the summer and up to 50/50 in the winter depending on climate.

flee · Feb 11, 2020

Runninwild said:
Yeah I was thinking of using that over regular coolant. Know of any issues using it long term?
I ended up going with this pump. Hope it holds up. Kind of a budget setup http://www.frozenboost.com/liquid-a....html?osCsid=8974ef52ee6fd75160f5ad5cab427bd0
I also ordered this ac condenser. It has a 25.75" x 16" core with 5\8 and 3\8" inlet\outlets. Hoping it does a decent job.
https://www.amazon.ca/gp/aw/d/B000C7QC26?ref=ppx_pt2_mob_b_prod_image

That is the pump I use.
The A/C condenser may be a bottleneck, though, because of the relatively small tubing
diameter.
I would opt for something with the same 3/4" inlet/outlet diameter as rest of the system.

Runninwild · Feb 11, 2020

flee said:
That is the pump I use.
The A/C condenser may be a bottleneck, though, because of the relatively small tubing
diameter.
I would opt for something with the same 3/4" inlet/outlet diameter as rest of the system.

The intercooler has 1\2" npt fittings so I don't think it's the end of the world. I'll rig the pump up and run a bucket of water through the condenser and measure how long it takes vs a straight hose and get an idea of how much it restricts it

[486] · Feb 11, 2020

just run normal glycol coolant

that ac condenser will def be a bottleneck, keep in mind 1/2" NPT is 5/8" ID

CNGVW · Feb 12, 2020

turbobrick240 said:
Windshield fluid actually has slightly worse heat exchanging properties than plain water. But it won't freeze nearly as easily.

We can not run anti freeze on the track I was told use washer fluid of its ex rate ever bit helps If it leaks in to the engine may get a added HP!!
Remember the pump must push the fluid through both ratt and some cases up hill
on the beetle you will see the blue pump on the dash and the ratt on the roof

Runninwild · Feb 15, 2020

I'm kind of questioning that ac condenser now. anyone have any cheap options that work well? also what kind of gph or gpm should I be looking for? I ordered that 500gph pump and plan to pump like 10 gallons through the condenser to test how much it bottlenecks flow, just curious what kind of actual flow rate id be looking for?

flee · Feb 16, 2020

Runninwild said:
I'm kind of questioning that ac condenser now. anyone have any cheap options that work well? also what kind of gph or gpm should I be looking for? I ordered that 500gph pump and plan to pump like 10 gallons through the condenser to test how much it bottlenecks flow, just curious what kind of actual flow rate id be looking for?

If you have enough room, a small car radiator from the J/Y would work great!

[486] · Feb 16, 2020

see if the junkyard has any priuseseses

dieseleux · Feb 22, 2020

My setup

My intake Water air intercooler i use many year...

In winter, i don't run water pump most time, air intake at +20c to +30c over ambient temperature on highway.

When water pump run, intake are +6 to +8c only over the ambient.

I use big front mount intercooler to cold down water (water is engine coolant) and make in same time the water reservoir.

Water pump in first are big bosch pump (1/2" pipe) use on ford cobra, after some corrosion on electrical contact, i put very small china pump (1/4" pipe) for temporary swap, i discover the china pump make great job and i lost only +1c to +2c on steady state and little slower recovery time on peak temp.

This setup is on my old Jetta 2002, my i run jetta 2009 stock.

Dieseleux

Runninwild · Feb 22, 2020

that intake is badass! unfortunately I can barely weld mild steel let alone aluminum lol. Think im just gonna order one of those cheapish 24x8 heat exchangers from ebay for $120. will fit nicely behind the grill In my truck

mrchill · Feb 23, 2020

I remember when Luc put that in...I saw in it Montreal...it was the same thing I wanted to do on my car....but hadnt gotten around to it. His was nice...and tune was good too. He does everything himself too...right down to welding.

dieseleux · Feb 23, 2020

The most trouble with this intercooler is how air goes in intercooler fin.
In high boost and high velocity, most air rush to the end and the cylinder under intercooler input run too rich, the cylinder a other end run lean.
I make bend plates at input to put air more equaly on all intercooler surface.
Because the volume of air between head port and intercooler are not very big, velocity of air over intercooler need to be equale on all surface.
The top volume of intercooler need to be redesign.

Another trouble with this setup is intake halen bolt, is nightmare to screw and torq because tubulare manifold are big behind intake.

The good point is near zero turbo to intake tube, 1/2 or 3/4 water tube is very easy to route, winter control IAT and heat mass on highway ramp.

Dieseleux

Air to water intercoolers

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