B4 harmonic balancer separation

Hello I’m new to your group and realize that I ignored the cold start squeak for too long. My balancer rubber disintegrated and destroyed the lower belt shroud in the process. Does anyone have another they could part with? I’m also trying to find the upgraded balancer for the best price if anybody knows a good source. Everyday auto parts had one (now out of stock) for $35 but not sure if they’re any good. I’d appreciate anyone’s input.

www.metalmanparts.com

www.cascadegerman.com

www.IDparts.com

www.dieselgeek.com

and probably some others should have what you need.

I would not only put the updated balancer on, I would do a new alternator clutch pulley, new crank sprocket and bolt, and verify the crank snout is not damaged. This will involve timing belt R&R, but it will be cheaper than a new crankshaft.

Some of the vendors used to have a "1Z/AHU crank saver kit" put together for these. They may not have it listed that way anymore, but I bet if you contact them they'll all know exactly what all you need.

Thanks oilhammer metalman was very helpful. Still no one with the lower timing belt shroud tho. I’ll keep looking...

Part number for the belt cover you're looking for is:

028109127J

Although that might be superseded by another but that I can't be sure. Sometimes if you google with the part number you can find a source for what you're looking for.

Steve

edit: I think a reasonable price for a new HB is around $100. That's what I see the Febi ones for at least, and those are made in Turkey I think.

What is the likelihood of the crank pulley needing replacement at 250,000 miles on a 1997 AHU? I am looking into DIYing this repair alongside my upcoming timing belt change and I would really rather avoid the extra cost and PITA factor of changing the crank pulley and seal.

I think the balancers are around $130 now- I got one of the last ones before price increase about 6 years ago(when I had my B4). I may have one of these lower covers kicking around, let me check my leftover stash of B4 parts tomorrow....

garciapiano said:

What is the likelihood of the crank pulley needing replacement at 250,000 miles on a 1997 AHU? I am looking into DIYing this repair alongside my upcoming timing belt change and I would really rather avoid the extra cost and PITA factor of changing the crank pulley and seal.

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I've seen them bad at lower miles and seen them go much more. If it's not broken and you're doing the work, I'd leave it. If you're paying someone to do the timing belt, it's not a lot more work to change it, just make sure they do it right. I can't tell you how many I've had to redo because a mechanic didn't do them properly the first time.

Abacus said:

I've seen them bad at lower miles and seen them go much more. If it's not broken and you're doing the work, I'd leave it. If you're paying someone to do the timing belt, it's not a lot more work to change it, just make sure they do it right. I can't tell you how many I've had to redo because a mechanic didn't do them properly the first time.

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Thank you for the info. Can you clarify what you’re referring to when you say “It’s not broken,” it being the harmonic balancer? I can’t fathom how one would check the crank pulley for damage without removing it.

I actually think the situation here should be clarified a little.

The big problem here is with a moving crank sprocket and not a pulley. The minor problem is the swapping of a bad harmonic balancer, which is rather easy to accomplish in a relatively short amount of time. The former is a little more complicated because of the amount of torque required to set it properly.

The crank sprocket, if let go, will hammer on the D shaped crankshaft snout until it moves freely at which point you get valve / piston collision and then a whole bunch of work. But before that happens you'll start to have odd injection timing issues show up.

While replacing the front crank seal isn't a priority with every timing belt if it's not leaking, too many times it never gets changed and the dripping just gets worse. The crank seal work should probably be done every other or every third timing belt change just as a matter of practice so it doesn't get overlooked permanently. The same would apply to the intermediate shaft and camshaft seals too.

As for the HB, I too have to get another one, while the wagon is running on a new one I need a good spare for the Mk3. I see that metalman has Corteco brand on ebay for ~$100 including bolts (crankshaft sprocket bolt included!)

Steve

tdidieselbobny said:

I think the balancers are around $130 now- I got one of the last ones before price increase about 6 years ago(when I had my B4). I may have one of these lower covers kicking around, let me check my leftover stash of B4 parts tomorrow....

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Thanks that would be great if you could find one! I’m running without one for now but dot want to do that for long.

I’ve never seen the crank sprocket wobble that’s been referred to, but for those who have seen it, is it obvious just by wiggling it by hand? Is the wear that you’ve seen primarily involving the inner hole in the sprocket or the snout of the crank? If it’s the latter, isn’t it too late to just slap on a new sprocket?

dieseltruck said:

I’ve never seen the crank sprocket wobble that’s been referred to, but for those who have seen it, is it obvious just by wiggling it by hand? Is the wear that you’ve seen primarily involving the inner hole in the sprocket or the snout of the crank? If it’s the latter, isn’t it too late to just slap on a new sprocket?

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You'll have no problem seeing it since the HB mounts directly to the crank sprocket the wobble is visible in the HB especially.

If you let it go too long the sprocket hammers away at the snout until the crank must be replaced. Not sure we've ever discussed the impact to the bolt hole.

If you search on here there's at least one thread out there about pinning the crank sprocket.

Steve

Often there is rust dust present around the crank bolt, when it gets really bad.

Steve Addy said:

You'll have no problem seeing it since the HB mounts directly to the crank sprocket the wobble is visible in the HB especially.

If you let it go too long the sprocket hammers away at the snout until the crank must be replaced. Not sure we've ever discussed the impact to the bolt hole.

If you search on here there's at least one thread out there about pinning the crank sprocket.

Steve

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I'm looking into the process of doing this repair and it doesn't seem too bad aside from the torque necessary for the extra 1/4 turn on the new bolt.

In terms of bracing the crankshaft with the counterhold, how is that done? I plan to use the generic counterhold tool available on idparts.com. Since you have to take the belt off to remove the pulley, what is the wiggle room in terms of rotating the crank with the camshaft locked so that the pulley can be replaced without the danger of valve to piston contact? I am trying to figure out how to brace the crank counterhold against the ground without having to rotate the pulley excessively.

Previous threads have mentioned that there is about 180º (90 CW or CCW) of crank rotation before you are in danger of hitting valves. Am I correct in assuming that you can rotate the crank about 45º so that it can be braced against the floor for removal/reinstallation of the pulley and bolt?

I snug the bolt, then install the belt, then give it the final 'guttentighten' torque once the belt is on, and there is no concern if the crank moves a bit.

Or, you can, after both the cam and crank are at the TDC point, and the belt is removed, rotate the crankshaft backwards 90 degrees (1/4 turn), make a mark so you can keep track of where it is, then do the sprocket stuff. That way, the pistons will all be at mid deck, and there will be no worry about valve contact so long as the crank is not moved more than a few degrees either way.

Then, once the sprocket is on and torqued, roll the crank back forwards up to TDC again, and install the belt as normal.

oilhammer said:

I snug the bolt, then install the belt, then give it the final 'guttentighten' torque once the belt is on, and there is no concern if the crank moves a bit.
Or, you can, after both the cam and crank are at the TDC point, and the belt is removed, rotate the crankshaft backwards 90 degrees (1/4 turn), make a mark so you can keep track of where it is, then do the sprocket stuff. That way, the pistons will all be at mid deck, and there will be no worry about valve contact so long as the crank is not moved more than a few degrees either way.
Then, once the sprocket is on and torqued, roll the crank back forwards up to TDC again, and install the belt as normal.

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Great. That’s what I figured. Interesting because everyone has their own way of doing it and the Bentley only says “counterhold the crank sprocket” but doesn’t exactly go into the details of exactly how.

Some others have expressed concern at the possibility of jumping timing while the pulley is being tightened, but I really can’t imagine how that would happen.

dieseltruck said:

Thanks that would be great if you could find one! I’m running without one for now but dot want to do that for long.

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The only cover I found was the upper,I coulda swore I had a lower that I got when I went to NH for an injection pump fix.....

Oh well thanks for checking!