BRM engine swap for BHW?

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TomB

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You know with all the issues with the BHW and the cost of the repairs, I need to ask those mechanical experts in the crowd this question, if it would be cheaper to just buy the BRM engine and swap it out.

What is the practicality of replacing the BHW engine with a BRM? Or would a Europe versioin of the 2005 engine match better?

All the support systems and controls might be a BIG issue. ECM, turbo, and definitely the emissions controls with the new engine.

Just had a wild thought and wanted to see what others thought.
 
oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
Not sure what all problems you are talking about, the only one I see BHW specific is the balance shaft drive, which is easily upgraded for FAR less headache than swapping in another engine. Besides, the BRM is quite a bit different, and it would not simply bolt in where a BEW or BHW once was.
 
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TomB

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oilhammer said:
Not sure what all problems you are talking about, the only one I see BHW specific is the balance shaft drive, which is easily upgraded for FAR less headache than swapping in another engine. Besides, the BRM is quite a bit different, and it would not simply bolt in where a BEW or BHW once was.
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Dang! I like the new technology of the new engine (multivalve technology, higher output, cleaner combustion and no BS issue).

I figured you would chime in. :)

Just a wild fantasy to the days of when I would have tried something like this, just because I could.

So what is the final cost of the BS work coming out to now?

Besides, I may have the cost of the cam/lifter issues on the one Passat.
 
oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
I think you are confusing the BRM with the CBEA (2009 and 2010 A cars).

And the CBEA engine has a balance shaft module too. Only difference is, it already has the gear drive. :p Born chainless!

And FWIW, the BHW is still the king of torque, it bests even the 16 valve CBEA by 11 foot pounds and does so at a lower RPM. It only has 4 less hp, too.

And while we have a balance shaft drive to upgrade, who knows what issues the CBEA's complex exhaust system will bring on in years to come. The exhaust temp sensors are already on national backorder, there have been a few reports of the high pressure pump self-destructing and blowing metal chunks all over the fuel system, and the silly autobox it is bolted to has already been recalled and may be recalled again. :cool: Not to mention the DMFs. So yeah, our B5s are not so bad. :)
 
T_D_I_POWER

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oilhammer said:
....And FWIW, the BHW is still the king of torque, it bests even the 16 valve CBEA by 11 foot pounds and does so at a lower RPM. It only has 4 less hp, too.....
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Torque is Pound Foot(Newton Meter) not Foot Pound(Meter Newton) ;)

The 2V/cyl. has always have a greater torque at low-mid engine rpm since the large intake valve can inhale more air vs 4V/cyl. However, the 4V/cyl. head smaller intake valves make up its deficiency, as the smaller valves move faster at mid-high engine rpm, thus producing more engine bhp. At this stage, the 2V/cyl. head starts to suffocate due to inertia weight of the large intake valves.
 
oilhammer

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You have a LOT of literature to correct then, my friend. :)

I am looking at the 1991 VW sales brochure for my Jetta, and it has clearly listed by EVERY engine in EVERY car sold here by Volkswagen in 1991 "ft -lbs." by the engine torque spec.

You'll actually find that both ways are widely used, but since I am so used to looking at repair info which is pretty much always listed "ft-lbs" that is what sticks in my head.

No go check your odometer so another 80k miles doesn't suddenly appear overnight. ;)
 
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oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
T_D_I_POWER said:
Torque = Force X Distance

Brochures are written by sales & marketing people. They don't study Engineering.
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Who writes the shop repair manuals then? Quit being a chode. :rolleyes:
 
oilhammer

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There are just too many to list....
2 x 5 = 10

5 x 2 = 10

Force x Distance = Torque

Distance x Force = Torque


Do you really not have anything better to do? One of my customers knows you and HE even said you were a goon.... :p
 
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yes, torque.metric is measured Force X Distance, but torque.standard is measured Distance X Force. (for all intents and purposes)

case in point: metric torque wrench is in Nm where its standard counterpart is inLbs, or ftLbs


please adhere to the idiosyncrasies inherent in the specified form of measure before responding :)
 
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I'm glad torque has been brought up. I know what the formula is, and how it applies to a bolt head, but what does it mean in describing what a car can do? It is much less clear to me than horsepower, for example.
 
abctdi

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Torque is the actual twisting force on the crankshaft derived from the downward/normal forces on the pistons due to the combustion events. Horsepower is calculated from torque as a function of rpm. So it is actually torque that performs the work.
 
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abctdi said:
Torque is the actual twisting force on the crankshaft derived from the downward/normal forces on the pistons due to the combustion events. Horsepower is calculated from torque as a function of rpm. So it is actually torque that performs the work.
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X2

sudseh said:
yes, torque.metric is measured Force X Distance, but torque.standard is measured Distance X Force. (for all intents and purposes)

case in point: metric torque wrench is in Nm where its standard counterpart is inLbs, or ftLbs

please adhere to the idiosyncrasies inherent in the specified form of measure before responding
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Nm to Lb.ft. conversion. You have to keep the unit on the same side.
.: Force (N) for force (Lb) and distance (m) for distance (ft)

:. 1 Nm = 4.448 Lb, .: 1 Lb = 0.2248 N

& :. 1 m = 3.281 ft, .: 1ft = 0.3048 m

.: T = Fd = 1 N x 1 m = 1 Nm = 0.2248 Lb X 3.281 ft = 0.7376 Lb.ft = 8.8512 Lb.in

or 1 LB.ft = 1.356 Nm
 
aja8888

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auntulna said:
I'm glad torque has been brought up. I know what the formula is, and how it applies to a bolt head, but what does it mean in describing what a car can do? It is much less clear to me than horsepower, for example.
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In simple terms:

This is all from memory (old engineer - still practicing) - Horsepower is the amount of "work" a horse can do pulling a weight (no specifics as I can't remember them).

Torque is rotational force measured in ft - pounds (or other units). Torque gives a car acceleration potential.

Friction is the enemy of both. Oil is their friend...

Tony
 
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chimaera

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For clarity, torque is transferred through the gear train of the car and translates into tractive effort at the wheels. By Newton's 2nd law (F=ma) this determines the acceleration of the vehicle at any given instant. The power of the engine determines how this instantaneous acceleration changes through the rpm range.
 
aja8888

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chimaera said:
For clarity, torque is transferred through the gear train of the car and translates into tractive effort at the wheels. By Newton's 2nd law (F=ma) this determines the acceleration of the vehicle at any given instant. The power of the engine determines how this instantaneous acceleration changes through the rpm range.
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Yeah, that's what I said...
 
T_D_I_POWER

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sudseh said:
do you read? or do you just like to look at yourself type?
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Force and distance are two different animals. There's no direct conversion F to d and d to F, you can't convert them.

Force, F (N, Lb) is mass, m (kg,slug) times acceleration due to gravity, a (m/s², ft/s²)

This's still taught in many Engineering colleges in US.

http://www.vw.com/jetta/completespecs/en/us/#engineering
 
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