EA288 TDI engine review, real life MPG

CourierGuy

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Don't know where you getting numbers but I have 2005 Passat and my average fuel is 33MPG. Most of it is highway 65-70MPH. I fill my tank and at the same station and count my MPG. Did some oil/gas filter maintenance, did I missed something, why it is so low?
6 speed? Crappy fuel?

Crap fuel can make a diff...

Always been a fan of fuel conditioner. And cetane boost.
 

GoFaster

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Don't know where you getting numbers but I have 2005 Passat and my average fuel is 33MPG. Most of it is highway 65-70MPH. I fill my tank and at the same station and count my MPG. Did some oil/gas filter maintenance, did I missed something, why it is so low?
Slushbox automatic transmission in a rather heavy car.
 

nkgagne

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Do you fill up at the same station, with the same nozzle, every time? You might be pretty accurate.. But not as accurate as a vented fill, diesel right up to the brim, with no foam.

This. Exactly this. Does the same station use the same fuel blend from the same distribution centre and have the exact same fuel additives each time, and do you pump at exactly the same rate? No. Therefore the tendency of the fuel to foam will differ.

Trickle the fuel up until you see clear diesel with no foam. As an added benefit, that extra bit of fuel means you might get an extra few miles out of the tank, which is nice in the winter. The drawback is it takes a long ass time to get it right full.
 

ZeroCool

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I have a 2010 VW Jetta TDI.... Generally I average about 34-37 mpg where 90% of my commute is highway doing about 75 MPH.

I did notice on a trip to PA where the speed limit is 65 instead of 55... where my average dropped to 60ish I was over 40... probably 42 or so if I remember right.
 

kjclow

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2010 JSW TDI silver and black. 2017 Ram Ecodiesel dark red with brown and beige interior.
I am now over 70K miles on my JSW and have noticed a slight up tick in economy. I'm now getting just over 40 with a mixture of city and suburban driving. I fill until it clicks off and then usually pump up to the next even dollar. The only time that I fuel until diesel is ready to drip out, or already has, is if I have a trip planned. If you want to look at short trips with unrealistic expectations, my mfd said that I was over 47 mpg for my seven mile commute last night.

For those with the 2015 cars, track it but don't worry about mileage until you have at least 10 fill ups.
 

jhinsc

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When I look at the title of this thread, and then on skimming the posts see that a lot of threads are about the eternal issue of topping off the tank......which has nothing to do with getting good mpg readings in any case. I fill until cutoff, then click 3X, and hang the nozzle up. I know I've posted this elsewhere before, but when the tanks form an average, all the variations in "fullness" average out. The arithmetic is completely accurate when I take the pump receipt and write down the odometer reading, then enter that info into Fuelly at some future time. My Fuelly average is just as valid as for anyone who stands there trickling fuel in until it's ready to overflow the filler neck.
You are so right! One fuel up in itself does not mean it's absolutely accurate, but over several tanks it averages out and the accuracy is spot on over about 10 tanks or so, assuming it's filled up each time. Putting in $10 or $20 worth of fuel every time you need to fuel up, you'll never know, and likely don't care what kind of mileage you're getting. I know people who use credit cards all the time, except when it comes to gas. They look at me like I have two heads when I ask why not use your credit card? I use several for all my shopping, and pay off each month. The CC rewards pile up faster!
 

jhinsc

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I would like to see a comparison test between a 2014 Passat TDI and a similar equipped 2015 Passat TDI to see the differences in mileage and performance. I bet the differences are negligible.
 

kjclow

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I know this doesn't really answer the question asked but: EPA rates the Passat TDI DSG 2015 2 mpg higher on highway but same for combined. The Golf gets a 1 mpg boost for both city and highway and a 2 mpg boost for combined.
 

jhinsc

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I know this doesn't really answer the question asked but: EPA rates the Passat TDI DSG 2015 2 mpg higher on highway but same for combined. The Golf gets a 1 mpg boost for both city and highway and a 2 mpg boost for combined.
It would be interesting to see side-by-side if the extra 10hp and 2 mpg highway mileage makes any difference in the real world. So far I'm happy with my '14 with over 42 mpg average since new!
 

BadWolf

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Real world ...12 tanks over 52 averaging 54 15'golf
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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BadWolf, you're doing extremely well. And you've noted your commute isn't really typical. Fuelly average for 2015 Golf TDIs is 41.8.
 

tikal

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To average anything above 45 MPG in a CR TDI you need to slow down around 60 MPH or so in my opinion.

It will be interesting to see if the 2015 JSW fleet can manage to average above 40 MPG in the next years to come. We will see in Fuelly and other sites I guess.
 
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BadWolf

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BUT it it's real world
 

psd1

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OR
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Don't know where you getting numbers but I have 2005 Passat and my average fuel is 33MPG. Most of it is highway 65-70MPH. I fill my tank and at the same station and count my MPG. Did some oil/gas filter maintenance, did I missed something, why it is so low?
And your numbers seem about right. 70 MPH doesn't help a car that has never returned stellar MPG, like most vehicles, especially diesels, 55 MPH is the sweet spot.
 

rotarykid

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DieselRocks said:
Don't know where you getting numbers but I have 2005 Passat and my average fuel is 33MPG. Most of it is highway 65-70MPH. I fill my tank and at the same station and count my MPG. Did some oil/gas filter maintenance, did I missed something, why it is so low
And your numbers seem about right. 70 MPH doesn't help a car that has never returned stellar MPG, like most vehicles, especially diesels, 55 MPH is the sweet spot.
While it is true lower speeds usually if not always give the best mpgs, it does also matter and have to figured in what the terrain you are driving over along with how you achieve that speed.

Hammering the throttle to achieve desired speed or while going up a grade will lower that number significantly even if you keep your speed down, IE just letting CC hammer the throttle while climbing a grade @ 70- ~75 mph.

I have personal experience with a 04 Passat TDI that is twice a week driven from Denver to Ft Collins on I-25 @ speeds that are the same if not a little faster but never sees below 38-41 mpgs. But the car is driven very easy around town at lower speeds, allowing it shift into the highest gear possible all the time. And it is never hammered to reach or to hold highway speeds when terrain varies, which it does significantly on that twice weekly drive.

The point is that if you drive around in your Passat always hammering it on take off, keeping your foot down not allowing it to shift through the gears to get into high gear with a locked torque converter @ 32-38 mph and similarly always asking for more power on the highway to scream up grades it will always use more fuel...........

I have seen these things achieve well above over 40 tank after tank when in the hands of a driver who puts effort into saving fuel while still driving at what are reality speeds today.

But in the hands of a driver always driving like a peddle pusher, hammering the throttle just to have to slam on the breaks these things can struggle to get out of the high 20s.........

My guess is you are somewhere in-between on that scale:D, not a peddle pusher but not really a mizer either. Put some effort into watching the things that waist fuel and I almost guarantee you will see a increase....
 

CourierGuy

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Just like the above post. If you're being mindful of good mpgs, you'll get decent numbers with sudle driving habits.

If you're not, and mash the right pedal all day long, don't be surprised at crappy mpgs.

As for hwy cruising speeds, you're gonna get what you're gonna get at the given speed you choose.

Just makes logical sense.
 

REDNECKDZL

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I've had a 2015 Jetta TDI for a month so far, and done mostly highway, so far it does seem to be better then my 2011 GSW both are DSG, and I don't drive slow

So far the MFA is showing 5.7L per 100k (41 mpg), but I haven't run a full tank thru it to know for sure

So far I'm impressed but will keep an eye on anything that might need to be fixed
 

darkscout

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Michigan
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I would like to see a comparison test between a 2014 Passat TDI and a similar equipped 2015 Passat TDI to see the differences in mileage and performance. I bet the differences are negligible.
I like that you can replace that with any (year) and (year+1) across engine changes. Dig deep enough and there are people that are questioning the ALH.

Wait for the last model year + 1 to see if there are hardware changes and then wait until the next release cycle.

It's no different than Apple laptops or any other product ever sold.
 

VodkanDiesel

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Washington DC
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2000 Jetta TDI, 2015 Jetta SEL TDI
I've had a 2015 Jetta TDI for a month so far, and done mostly highway, so far it does seem to be better then my 2011 GSW both are DSG, and I don't drive slow

So far the MFA is showing 5.7L per 100k (41 mpg), but I haven't run a full tank thru it to know for sure

So far I'm impressed but will keep an eye on anything that might need to be fixed

I just did a long road trip to Miami on my 2015 Jetta TDI DSG. I've gotten consistent 600 mile tanks at a consistent 70mph on cruise control. I filled it up with 14.2 gallons. So 600 / 14.2 = 42.3 MPG

It's not amazing. I was expecting the EA288 to do better than that. They advertise it as 46 MPG highway...
 

kjclow

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Charlotte, NC
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2010 JSW TDI silver and black. 2017 Ram Ecodiesel dark red with brown and beige interior.
It will get better with time and miles. My JSW has gone up from a life time average of about 39 at the end of 2013 to about 41 at the end of 2014. I have around 73K miles on it.
 

DieselRocks

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NY, US
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Passat 2005
Well documented VW trait. Speedo reads high (to save tickets and improve economy) but odo is accurate.
So much talk but no direct answer to the question... By quotes above, think 2005 Passat with 33-34MPG on average is a normal and will not get it better...
 

BadWolf

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Quote:
Originally Posted by jhinsc View Post
I would like to see a comparison test between a 2014 Passat TDI and a similar equipped 2015 Passat TDI to see the differences in mileage and performance. I bet the differences are negligible.

Not a perfect match but I have a 13 Passat and a 15 golf. The difference is the Passat is an Automatic.
Both the cars are on Fuelly. I drove 15 months my 50 mile rt commute in the Passat and averaged 44 MPGs. So far in the golf 8k miles since August identical commute 54 mpgs.

The stick makes a big difference (rolling) the weight makes some difference. But the engine must make SOME.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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EPA numbers in the '14 to '15 Passat changed, what, a couple of MPG? I think that's as good an answer as any.

The difference in FE between your Golf and Passat isn't surprising. They really aren't that similar. I've learned that I get significantly different FE my 2-door Golf compared to JSWs or even 4 door Golfs with 17" wheels.
 

jhinsc

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2014 Passat TDI SEL Premium
It would be interesting to see side-by-side if the extra 10hp and 2 mpg highway mileage makes any difference in the real world. So far I'm happy with my '14 with over 42 mpg average since new!
You would think by now one of the auto mag's or online auto reviewers would have done a side-be-side compare to see how they compare to each other and if there's really any difference.
 

andyrooski17

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2015 Golf TDI SE DSG
As has been noted by several in this thread, if you look at the Fuelly histograms, you can see two distinct peaks in the distribution. Taking the center of the higher mpg peak should give a decent estimate of the TDI mean. I'll use the mode (most common bin in the histogram) just so there's no ambiguity. The last few years of Golfs are as follows:

2011: 39
2012: 40
2013: 39 (could also be some European Mk7s in here?)
2014: 41 (could also be some European Mk7s in here? Not a great looking distribution)
2015: 41 (should be all Mk7 cars, also not a great looking distribution yet)

So, IMO, it's hard to see any big difference yet with the EA288, on aggregate. There do seem to be anecdotes to suggest the EA288 is more efficient. I also suspect that it's too early to say anything definitive, as we aren't even close to a full calendar year (seasons and all) with the North America Mk7s, and most of the engines are still brand new.

As far as a subjective opinion of the engine, I can compare to driving my mother's 2012 Passat and a friend's 2012 Golf. I would say that the torque band on those cars is about the same, where they seem to roll off above 2500 RPM, whereas the Mk7 Golf with EA288 seems to keep pulling to about 3000 RPM. I haven't looked at the published torque and power curves for either car, so someone can chime in if they know.

Having shopped a 2014 Golf and a 2015 Golf at the same time (before buying the 2015), I liked the EA288 engine a good deal better.
 

IndigoBlueWagon

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If you put a CKRA Passat and a CJAA Golf on a dyno you'll see different results. The Passat makes torque a bit sooner, but is pretty much done making power by 3800 RPM. The CJAA makes its torque later, but will peak at about 4200.

Haven't seen a EA288 on a dyno yet. Interested.
 

jhinsc

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2014 Passat TDI SEL Premium
As has been noted by several in this thread, if you look at the Fuelly histograms, you can see two distinct peaks in the distribution. Taking the center of the higher mpg peak should give a decent estimate of the TDI mean. I'll use the mode (most common bin in the histogram) just so there's no ambiguity. The last few years of Golfs are as follows:

2011: 39
2012: 40
2013: 39 (could also be some European Mk7s in here?)
2014: 41 (could also be some European Mk7s in here? Not a great looking distribution)
2015: 41 (should be all Mk7 cars, also not a great looking distribution yet)

So, IMO, it's hard to see any big difference yet with the EA288, on aggregate. There do seem to be anecdotes to suggest the EA288 is more efficient. I also suspect that it's too early to say anything definitive, as we aren't even close to a full calendar year (seasons and all) with the North America Mk7s, and most of the engines are still brand new.

As far as a subjective opinion of the engine, I can compare to driving my mother's 2012 Passat and a friend's 2012 Golf. I would say that the torque band on those cars is about the same, where they seem to roll off above 2500 RPM, whereas the Mk7 Golf with EA288 seems to keep pulling to about 3000 RPM. I haven't looked at the published torque and power curves for either car, so someone can chime in if they know.

Having shopped a 2014 Golf and a 2015 Golf at the same time (before buying the 2015), I liked the EA288 engine a good deal better.
I would think on the 2015 Jetta's and Golf's, there would be more of a distinct difference from previous years, maybe not so much in performance, but in mpg's since the new EA288 has Adblue injection for emissions and previously the old TDI did not - one reason why the NMS Passat was rated as high as it was even thought it was a much larger vehicle since with Adblue it could tuned more efficiently.
 

JASONP

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I don't have data to back up my findings but...
Compared to last year with the '13 Jetta I'm paying a about $7-10 less per week at the pumps, same commute, same average temperature, same driving style so there's definitely a difference.

Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
 

jhinsc

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I don't have data to back up my findings but...
Compared to last year with the '13 Jetta I'm paying a about $7-10 less per week at the pumps, same commute, same average temperature, same driving style so there's definitely a difference.

Sent from my SM-G900W8 using Tapatalk
But wouldn't the lower price of fuel be part of the difference? Hopefully the price is lower where you are!
 

andyrooski17

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I would think on the 2015 Jetta's and Golf's, there would be more of a distinct difference from previous years, maybe not so much in performance, but in mpg's since the new EA288 has Adblue injection for emissions and previously the old TDI did not - one reason why the NMS Passat was rated as high as it was even thought it was a much larger vehicle since with Adblue it could tuned more efficiently.
Right, I think many of us share that expectation. The data for the 2015 Golf just isn't very good yet, but I would expect to see a noticeable difference by this summer or so.
 
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