Is the MKIV VW's best A platform?

This being TDIClub, many people have written about the ALH TDI engine in MKIV Golf/Jetta/New Beetles. It's fair to say that most TDI enthusiasts see it as VW's best diesel. However, I think that a large part of what makes the ALH appealing is the car it's in, the A4 platform built from '98 (in Europe) through '06 (for Golf/Jetta Wagon/New Beetle). I think it's the best A platform VW designed and built. And I've owned at least one of every A platform VW has built.

What makes me feel this way?

• Size: As Goldilocks would say, just right. I'm comfortable in the driver's seat, the footwells are larger than my A5 was, but I can reach across the car and open the passenger door easily. Admittedly I'm a pretty small person, but a lot of big guys are comfortable driving these cars, too. Only negative on size is the rear seat legroom. Cargo space is exceptional in the wagon, and the MKIV Golf has significantly more cargo room than the MKVI.
• Outward vision: My wagon has the best sightlines of just about any car I've owned. Low window sills, great view forward, easiest car ever to parallel park. My A5 and MKVI were much more difficult. And I have watched my daughter literally stand up in her set to back up her MKVI Jetta Sedan.
• Ride and handling: The OE suspension wasn't the best, but with stock 15" wheels and Koni Reds (or Yellows) it's a stable, smooth riding car that requires very little effort to drive long distances. With coilovers, camber plates, and slicks it's a competitive track day car. I have a MKIV with and one without a rear sway bar, both handle extremely well. I felt my MKVI Golf gave up more in ride quality to achieve similar handling, especially with its 17" wheels.
• NVH: When I got my MKV Jetta I was immediately disappointed with it's higher level of wind and road noise compared to the MKIV, especially around the driver's door. I had the same feeling about my MKVI Golf. Engine noise is higher than the later cars, but wind and road/tire noise is much lower. And a small point: you can drive a MKIV 2-door Golf with the driver's window down and not experience any buffeting or harmonics. I was disappointed to find I couldn't do the same in my MKVI 2-door.

There are other areas where I feel the MKIV does well including rust proofing, ease of maintenance, and paint quality.

These cars are aging. But when I got my '99.5 Golf running last month and drove it for the first time I was amazed at how well it rode and handled, and how rattle free it was, despite a relatively hard 245K miles. They're relatively inexpensive to buy and maintain, but they feel like much more expensive cars.

I admit that I like A4s in part because they suit me, my use for them, and where I live. They're a great size for use in the city. They're a great road trip car for two people, or one person and a small dog. And they're easy to work on: I can do brakes and suspension swaps in my sleep at this point.

I'm curious to hear if others agree.

I agree!

That's why I am bringing one back to life after 300,000 Wisconsin miles.

I have had many cars in all sizes and performance criteria. Everything from early 24/36 HP Beetles (6 or so) to tire burning Corvettes and everything in between. I have had diesels going back to 1980 (GM) and four ALH's (one Golf, three Jetta's), one MKV, two Passat B5.5's and my current 2014 Passat.

What I really like about the MKIV platform is the durability and fit of the body components and the overall size. The car fits me fine at 5"11" and I could drive very long distances without really tiring. This week, I drove the 2003 Jetta to Corpus Christi, TX and back (600 miles) in a period of about 18 hours. The ride was very quiet and at 70 - 75 MPH (A/C on) the car got better than 45 MPG.
While not a sports car, the MKIV is pretty nimble and easy to maneuver in traffic, which I see a lot of living north of Houston.

Plus, the girls think it's cute!

IndigoBlueWagon said:

when I got my '99.5 Golf running last month and drove it for the first time I was amazed at how well it rode and handled, and how rattle free it was, despite a relatively hard 245K miles

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See that you're finally coming around to my way of thinking!

MY Golf just rocks. The suspension upgrade has been completed, and while I went with Koni Oranges (STRTs), in the face of a lot of folks talking ill of them, instead of the Reds (couldn't justify the added costs of doing both cars), I have ZERO regrets. My car is now not only like new, it's BETTER than new! And I'd have to say that it still SMELLS like new! (iPO of 12 years did a nice job of caring for it, sans rusted fenders and rockers; the garage she used sucked). Handling with better than stock suspension and tires, better brakes, better transmission functioning (short shifter and GM Synchromesh), DLC520 nozzles (professionally mounted) and Malone stage 2 tune, DC Stage 1 clutch, and, a nice three=spoke leather steering wheel and this car keeps me grinning. Closest I'll get to a new car. And now that I've got four MKIV TDIs under my watch I'm going to be hooked to these cars for a long time.

Here's my car after I got motivated to wash it for the first time this year (following my work on the front-end):



It was late in the day and the camera wanted to use flash

Oh! And when I first got my Golf, my first TDI and MKIV, I'd have to say that I didn't really like it all that much. I have the many great folks on this forum (Peter being one of them) for helping me make the car into what it is now. It became the car that I WANT.

P.S. And my dog likes it! She used to throw up in my old Corolla; not so in the Golf: with the rear seats down she's got lots of room to move around (fairly big dog) and look out. And then, though they don't really understand the value of it, my other critters benefit from it being able to haul a bunch of feed! (found it easier to make more frequent runs with the Golf than hitching the trailer up to the truck)

My wagon is quiet, too. The glove box rattles a bit, and sometimes I hear the tailgate working on bad roads. But after all, it does have 329K on it. I don't think track days are especially easy on a car, either.

That's IBW at Calabogie in Ontario. Koni coilovers, 700 lb. front springs, 550 rear. Passed an M3 Coupe on the inside of a turn during one session.

And here it is in winter mode, coming home from the Detroit Auto Show.


Pretty versatile, I'd say.

IndigoBlueWagon said:

...Passed an M3 Coupe on the inside of a turn during one session.

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Where's the "like" button?

UhOh said:

P.S. And my dog likes it! She used to throw up in my old Corolla; not so in the Golf: with the rear seats down she's got lots of room to move around (fairly big dog) and look out.

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I travel with two dogs very often...40lb beagle and a mini dachshund. I wish the rear door windows rolled all the way down because the beagle likes to put his face out the window (60Km/h or less) and if you hit a bad bump, he nails his chin on the glass edge. No injuries yet but I've been watching for it to happen.

Other than that, the back of a Jetta is pretty good for dog transport size-wise. The beagle gets on the floor on the highway and has room to do that. I bought a brush from amazon that makes quick work of removing fur from the carpet and seats.... best 10 bucks I've ever spent at amazon.

IndigoBlueWagon said:

[*]NVH: When I got my MKV Jetta I was immediately disappointed with it's higher level of wind and road noise compared to the MKIV, especially around the driver's door. I had the same feeling about my MKVI Golf. Engine noise is higher than the later cars, but wind and road/tire noise is much lower. And a small point: you can drive a MKIV 2-door Golf with the driver's window down and not experience any buffeting or harmonics. I was disappointed to find I couldn't do the same in my MKVI 2-door.

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hah, mine was so quiet I had another good reason to strip the back's interior out. I'd be doing 85-90 on the freeway if I didn't pay attention to the gauges. Couldn't hear how fast I was going.

I just went through a long long period of time deciding whether or not to keep and invest the $$$ to get her on the road again, or sell and buy something new or newer.

I looked at: Lexus es350, Lexus is350 (2007-2008), Ford Fusions, more modern VWs including the new Passat TDI and Passat 1.8T (the latter you can get for $18.5k), Accord Sports, Nissans, Infinity MX35, and etc. etc. etc. For me, a quiet car is a big deal. That and I really didn't want to do a car payment (i.e. more debt).

I put the money into my mkIV.... It's the right size, looks good, handles amazingly well for what it is, and so on. I know what it is, and how to work on it, and I know what usually goes wrong. So much has been replaced it might as well be a young car. At 188k, it's just broken in. And I've built it into the car I wanted - leather interior, replaced the cheapo cluster, really good looking wheels, upgraded bushings, sound proofing, stereo and sub, converted to manual, rc4 with injectors, and so on. With the new tires and suspension, the car is fairly quiet again too; certainly livable.

But really, besides what IBW described regarding the strengths of this platform, the deal breaker is that diesels just make the most sense for a passenger car. 99% of the people on the road today, including myself, never rev the engine above 4k rpms. We use torque. With almost 300 ft. lbs., there's just not much out there that can compete. Passing is a breeze, and it makes for a relaxed, comfortable ride. And, I go up and down the Rockies like they aren't there!

Downsides? Needs a 6-speed. The G60/VR6 clutch is a disaster - noisy as hell - but that's my fault. Maintenance is constant after 15 years - have to stay on top of it. But then, it is 15 years old.

IndigoBlueWagon said:

These cars are aging. But when I got my '99.5 Golf running last month and drove it for the first time I was amazed at how well it rode and handled, and how rattle free it was, despite a relatively hard 245K miles. They're relatively inexpensive to buy and maintain, but they feel like much more expensive cars.

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These cars are aging. They're being hauled off by the truck-load to the crusher here on the salty east coast. I've talked to one of the local VW shops and they're condemning Mk4 cars on an almost daily basis.

I've had about 10 VW's over the years, mostly all gassers. I've never considered myself a "VW Guy", but I have had a bunch of them. I started in 1988 with a 1981 Rabbit, and had several other Rabbits after that. In 1996, I was rocking a rusted out 1985 2-door Jetta (Gas, 5spd), and my wife had a 1995 2-door Golf (Gas, auto).

For me, the Mk4 TDI cars make a lot of sense for my current situation. I've invested thousands into both cars (and I have a few thousand to go...lol). I use my Golf for work travel, and I quite like the car on the highway, and in the city too. They're paid for (and not really depreciating anymore...lol), they're easy to fix, insurance is cheap, and I like driving them. I pay cash for my parts, so that allows me to drive payment free, and debt free.

However, at this point and time I think the Mk4 cars have to be almost as much a hobby as they are transportation. If I was paying a shop to do the work I've done on these cars, they really wouldn't make any sense, not in my situation at least. I think most people on here...the regulars at least, are at least partial Mk4 enthusiasts, if not "full" enthusiasts.

I quite like the look of the Mk5 Jettas, but I have no real interest in owning one. I took a 2010 TDI Golf for a test drive recently, and with an obo asking price of only $8400 bucks, I even thought about it for a little while, but like always decided to keep rockin' my clunky old Mk4's for a while.

Yeah I'm hooked on the MK IV's..... Picked up my 5th MK IV . I now have 4 of them diesel and one gas version.
Going out now to start working on the new one, has 299,xxx miles on body and is in great shape for its age ( it's an 02 5 speed ) but only 166,xxx on engine with a new IP from Germany . Picked it up cheap.��
Just ordered a timing belt kit and new strut mounts. Gonna put in a 2" lift kit I've made myself as I did with all of them and swap out my daughters gas one for the diesel, as she is still in college and has a great paying internship but is now driving a lot more ( trying to,save her a few sheckles ), diesel is still cheaper than gas by about .05 cents here.

As Rembrandt said..... It's turned into a hobby.....keeps me out of trouble, more or less��

I would tend to agree, but I wouldn't kick VAG's other A cars to the curb so quickly. It is not that those are bad, but that the A4 is just that good. It is the sweet spot in context of other cars offered at the same time period by other manufacturers.

The biggest advantage over the A3 is that they essentially started over with a clean slate... and oddly enough, this was driven by the Concept 1, which eventually became the New Beetle. VAG execs would only green light this car if it was to be built on a common platform as something higher volume, and of course the Golf was easily their volume leader. This necessitated a very complete overhaul of the existing car. The A3 really was never that far removed from the A2, which was a car that dated back to the mid '80s.

So they stuck with the most basic formula that works, and the one that pretty much EVERYONE in one form or another copied from the A1: transverse OHC engine with an integral transmission/final drive sitting off to one side, McPherson front suspension and rack & pinion steering, simple twist beam track correcting rear axle (technically that part was an A2 innovation, the A1s did not get that, nor did any of the B1, B2, or B5 cars). The only major change was in order to get more cargo space in the rear they ditched the rear spring/strut assembly and went with separate shocks and springs.

But the control systems were totally revamped, and this to me is the A4's biggest gain. No more of the rat's nest of wires and needless added on stuff above the fuse box like the A3s had. And for most models, some more in depth bidirectional and OBD bits makes the electronics, even though they do more, easier to diagnose problems on.

Totally new 4 cyl engine family, too. Which brought a fresh design to something that was previously dating back to the early '70s. But again, no major sweeping changes there either. Just a nice improvement over the older engine family... they kept what worked, and got rid of what didn't, and made lots of improvements, many of which continued to happen for years to come. I am speaking of the gasoline fueled 4 cyl engines, as well as the diesels.

The other feature I've appreciated in the MKIV platform is safety. My son and I have both managed to wreck our 2-door Golfs. I was first, driving home from a track event in Canada. Blinding sun in my face, turned left into a speeding car headed in my direction.


I suffered only a concussion. Airbags did not deploy. And since I didn't have collision insurance, I had the car repaired at a local technical school and a friend is still driving it.

My son wasn't so lucky: skidded on ice and hit a power pole.


Airbags deployed, he wasn't injured. For me those two incidents make MKIVs priceless.

i think i like the A4 quite a bit... when it is all in good working order. However, im much happier when (inevitably) wrenching if im wrenching on the B4's. (no longer have the A3 but it had the same pros i list for my B4)

It may be a series of minor add-ons and slight improvements over A1 and A2 cars but when i look at how things work, they make sense to me... unlike the motor mounts placed in the timing belt path on an A4.

The engine bay and the back seat on a B4 could nearly be called cavernous in comparison to the A4... and thats what seals the deal for me, id rather drive my rusted out B4 (or another A3 for that matter) than work on an A4, even if it has a good body.

I like the Mk4 for its versatility. And the 99.5 is still my favorite overall Mk4...though I do like the exterior cosmetics of the 2004\5. The 4's are attractive, and come in all the right sizes for the car that it is. They have two of the best engine choices overall...and are incredibly tuneable...either for mileage...or power. And despite the wacked out suspension design...they handle very well...especially raised. Naturally, if they arent big enough, there are the B cars.....but for the A...the 4 is my favorite. I still have my green 99.5 Jetta Tdi....and likely always will.

MKIVs are the worst platform VW has produced

It's was just that it was blessed with the TDI engine

Even after 14 years no rattle, runs smooth and will be my Daily Driver until it falls apart or I go on my long flight!

I have been looking for a replacement for my Golf for a while now and keep coming back to he A4 platform for all the reasons that Peter has stated. I really do love this car and will most likely just pick up another and save it for when this one is done.

Humble Opinion...

I have two 04' Jetta sedans...an auto and recently purchased 5 speed. After getting a tune, Koni FSDs and fixing some of the performance robbing gremlins (brake booster hose, cracked EGR pipe, changed "lifetime tranny fluid") the car has done well. Its not quick but pulls well and can hold it's own in LA Traffic. The steering and braking are pretty good, even with the standard brakes (prefer a nice initial hard biting semi-metallic pad).

The 5spd has 227k miles and lived through some harsh east coast winters. It has rocker panel and fender rust. As an earlier post mentioned, owning these cars means putting time into learning how to and being willing to work on them. This site and others are an invaluable resource.

I think for a dated economy car, the Mark IV's offer a pretty good combination of style, performance, economy and handling.

A4's are great cars but really can't compare to the B5.5 for ride, handling, noise, room. Unfortunately one has to make the B5.5 great with a std swap though. That DSG is not a very smooth tranny and can't always make up its mind what to do.

50harleyrider said:

A4's are great cars but really can't compare to the B5.5 for ride, handling, noise, room. Unfortunately one has to make the B5.5 great with a std swap though. That DSG is not a very smooth tranny and can't always make up its mind what to do.

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The B5.5 did not come with a DSG transmission but was supplied with the ZF automatic in the 2004/2005 diesel model years.

I've had two 2005 Passat B5.5's, one wagon and one sedan. Both purchased at well less than 100K miles on them and driven well beyond that. As you say, a nice platform but clearly 1/2 Audi. Compared to the A4's, they have to be "made great" at a huge cost which is not a factor with the A4.

On an MPG basis in stock form (ZF transmission), they do not perform nearly as well as an A4, but that is to be expected. They are certainly nice highway cars and it's too bad VW couldn't have continued the diesel in that platform in North America beyond the 2004/2005 model years.

I am often astounded how solid my 2000 Golf feels, even at currently a whopping 503,000 miles. It has a tiny glove box creak, worse when cold. I sort of put it off because I know given the random bits of foam spit out my dash vents that sooner or later I'll be taking the dash out of it. But having done that to my own A2 as well as many, many other A2s, A3s, and A4s, I know what to expect...and so far, the heat still seems to work to my satisfaction. This may indeed be the last year I can say that, though.

Have to say, and usually this is not the case, but my New Beetle also feels pretty solid inside, too. But it is a baby... a 2005 with only 125k on the clock.

The Golf will without a doubt be the car I take to my grave. I never thought I'd find something to dethrone my '91 Jetta as my favorite car ever, but I did. Still like my Jetta though!

Oilhammer's comments on the glovebox reminded me to comment on a preventative measure to ward off failed glovebox hinges. Pop the end cover off the [passenger] side dash and spray some WD40 into that plastic shock; work the hinge a bit and it'll limber back up.

My Golf has only ONE noise that I have yet to squelch. Stupid seat creaking: I'd thought it was the track rollers and replaced them- no joy. It's some other issue with the frame: I've been putting it off because I'm trying to find heated seats (going to swap this car with my wife's when this and the body work are done- the car will be about a 9.5 at that point).

The cheap plastic stuff really sucks. I think that this is the only real thing that takes away from these cars. Well, I think that the wiper system could be better: why not an actual variable speed on the wiper? (the intermittent mode's stepped speed function never seems to offer what I need)

Fuel prices have jumped back up a bit. Every time that happens it helps justify having an TDI. Wife's kids now both have A4 ALHs, in which case traveling to visit will be much cheaper than other vehicles they've used. Will be re-fueling the wife's Golf later today- it's got 747 miles on the odometer and the fuel light hasn't come on yet: should be an easy/strong 50+mpg tank; mine just registered 52,7mpg, w/o really trying (my car is just getting better and better).

Lastly, and with the TDI in mind, I can drive down the road and KNOW that my car is capable of doing what almost no other cars I see on the road can do: I look at my UG and see it clipping around 60mpg.

Just did a 310k mile service on a 2000 Jetta that, once again, drove home the point of just how good these cars are.

I think they look the best, although I'm biased since I drive one. I feel like the engine is the VW peak - before all the PD crap and the CR insanity. Reliable, powerful, efficient.

That said, I have to give Toyota the ribbon on long-term fit. My sunroof leaks. The doors creak. The suspension rattles. One of my fenders is rusted. The window switches lost their detent, my drivers side door open switch failed, the lights in the console failed, I've replaced the clutch switch twice, the fuse that powers the radiator fans is known to melt and get weird (no AC), the radio reception sucks and is getting worse, the horn died, the glovebox broke.

That being said, if a 2003 5spd wagon came my way, I'd pick it up in a heartbeat.

I think I'm going to have to be a debbie-downer with this MKIV enthusiasm.

Points I agree with:
1. outward vision and driving position (telescoping and tilting steering wheel a rarity in 2001 in Japanese and American competitors to the Jetta), although nothing like a newest gen Forester
2. rust-proofing
3. versatility/simplicity of suspension; real steering feel and good brake feel/modulation
4. for the era and the price-point/class, good handling and (when new) NVH
5. nice interior appointments/material quality, although soft-touch hasn't worked out in the long run very well with the peeling and all. Also, these last two summers the adhesives have started to fail from all fabric on doors and headliner. Oh, and not to mention the blend door foam that's on the fritz. I'm willing to overlook these because they didn't show up until over a decade of ownership.

Points I can't agree:
1. Size is less than ideal for larger people. I can't fit anyone taller than 5'5'' behind me and my headroom measures about 1-2''. I'd happily trade smaller trunk for 2-3'' more of rear seat leg room. Most cars of similar length to the MKIV now accommodate a greater range of drivers in my experience. Also, all MKIV seats, including the Recaros, do not have enough thigh support for long legs. A friend's 2002 5-series with the adjustable thigh support are lovely in comparison. But I guess you can't expect this at the price point.
2. Handling, shock absorption, and NVH in most modern cars at the inflation adjusted price point of the MKIV ($26,500) far surpass the MKIV IMO. Base Ford focus I rented last weekend included.
3. The safety of the MKIV can't be used as a selling point against newer VW platforms as the MKIV is simply not as safe. A quick look at IHS crash test photos showing passenger compartment intrusion in the MKIV that is gone in MKV. Not to mention, despite how good of driver I'd like to think I am, electronic stability control makes a safer car. MKIV is very safe for the era though.
4. NVH with aging: I don't know how you guys do it. I have plenty of squeaks (driver's door), rattles, and vibs. I've also had a lot of parts fail...although that's not really the platform per se...glove box, trunk latch, hood latch, door switches. Chassis flex causes doors to rub the paint off the sill. And the car came from the factory with a misaligned door that caused excessive wind noise for 13 years. Full disclosure: car was in accident...but to me, this unibody feels WORN

Gothmolly said:

I think they look the best, although I'm biased since I drive one. I feel like the engine is the VW peak - before all the PD crap and the CR insanity. Reliable, powerful, efficient.

That said, I have to give Toyota the ribbon on long-term fit. My sunroof leaks. The doors creak. The suspension rattles. One of my fenders is rusted. The window switches lost their detent, my drivers side door open switch failed, the lights in the console failed, I've replaced the clutch switch twice, the fuse that powers the radiator fans is known to melt and get weird (no AC), the radio reception sucks and is getting worse, the horn died, the glovebox broke.

That being said, if a 2003 5spd wagon came my way, I'd pick it up in a heartbeat.

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That's fine if you like fixin' up a 13 year old car and then what else will go wrong with it? Never buy a new car again cause you like restoring old ones that's your cup of tea not mine. I'm sure in time that will grow old as you grow old. Then what will you buy? A 30 year old ALH? and restore it to it's former glory that has long past and drive it into the future?. I own a 64 Ford Galaxie it has become a classic old car not one that I would like to depend on for every day use but every repair is cheap and really easy. I

MichaelB said:

That's fine if you like fixin' up a 13 year old car and then what else will go wrong with it? Never buy a new car again cause you like restoring old ones that's your cup of tea not mine. I'm sure in time that will grow old as you grow old. Then what will you buy? A 30 year old ALH? and restore it to it's former glory that has long past and drive it into the future?. I own a 64 Ford Galaxie it has become a classic old car not one that I would like to depend on for every day use but every repair is cheap and really easy.

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I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

Gothmolly said:

I'm not sure what you're trying to say.

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I'm not quite sure ether except that I would not buy a 13 year old car in a heart beat to be my daily driver. The only constant is change and you can't change that.