2006 Audi A4Q Avant 2.0TFSI -> 2.0TDI (Holset edition)

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nitec

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actually going back to the nozzle question...

so how do people get 300 out of their PDs then? ... what about these Firad 160% nozzles that are quoted at 300hp+? what injectors are they running on?
Click to expand...
They don't....The Race 783 flows 60% more than the largest Firad, we know because we have their flow data...
Click to expand...
this is starting to smell a lot like false advertisement...so who's right and who's wrong? if this was an argument over a product worth 10$ I couldn't care less...but when two major vendors are stating completely conflicting data for products worth thousands of dollars I start to get a little worried...
 
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nitec

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so here's the info I could get:

R783 is NOT the biggest nozzle that can be fitted to a PD injector

R783 does NOT flow 60% more than the largest Firad out there

R783 will safely get you to 250hp - Firads are required for anything bigger than that

see the discussion here:

http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?p=5008577#post5008577

this means that I wasted my money on the R783 as they will never flow the potential of the turbo...that's rather disappointing considering they're the single most expensive part I've purchased so far...looks like my next injectors will be flying across the pond for Firad upgrades and I will time this with the head service and cam upgrade...
 
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nitec

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interesting observation over the last few cold days - the car doesn't start if the temp drops below -15 it seems...started first time at -8 but anytime I try to fire up past -15 she cranks, seems to catch and just loses the ignition and starts cranking without firing...

I'm wondering if this is related to the tune and/or the glow plugs...the plugs are new and should be correct.

EDIT: this is fuel related...looks like I'm losing prime if it's cold outside...the car sat for almost a week in the garage and fired up first time. Took it to work, sat at 0C outside for about 8hrs and couldn't start...I had to do some magic tricks to get it to fire up but it was all fuel related...either the system is still not setup right or my tandem pump is screwing around...
 
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nitec

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working on the ultimate "cold package" for my A4 consisting of:

1. noco genius charger (permanently installed)
2. zerostart
3. oil pan heater
4. battery heater

I'm in love with these noco chargers...they have marine applications which are ruggedized and made for permanent installations so I`ll get everything wired up under the hood and just plug it up when the temperatures drop

https://no.co/gen1
 
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A

alphawerks

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Just to stick in my 0.02$.
This winter my truck (tdi tacoma ) was good to -25, but didn't start at -30c with no block heater. So I picked up a thermostart and will be installing for next winter. I think it cost about $25.
It's a intake manifold heater - and before the flaming starts, yes it is for tractors.

It mounts in the intake maifold / piping and is a more refined version of sticking a lit propane torch into the intake manifold to supply heat as air is drawn into the intake.
It needs 12v (about 10w ) to fire the igniter and a low pressure supply of fuel (diesel) to burn, usually Tee'd into the return line.

No Affiliation, just letting you know what I'm doing so I don't need to worry about having 110v for a block heater.

Ryan
 
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vtpsd

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My tractor has one of those fuel powered intake heaters, and it actually works amazingly well. Confused me the first time I investigated it.

However, I use a coolant heater on my car with a timer that powers it up a couple hours before I leave in the morning. I just plug it in every night, car starts so happily and has heat very soon. No noticeable effect on my energy bill. The car doesn't need it to start, but having a fully warm engine is very nice.
 
REDNECKDZL

REDNECKDZL

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i've often wondered about trying to put on a heating intake similar to what is found in cummins intake (maybe others) needs a bit more amperage then the glow plugs, but the trucks seem to start a bit better, or atleast that's been my experience, maybe more when they are new versus when they get older
 
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nitec

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I like this intake heater business...that's not something you'd be running overnight though - certainly not the one burning diesel I don't think...

maybe an electrical one could be a nice addition to the ultimate cold start package :)
 
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nitec

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hmmm cold start issue is very intriguing...you can pretty much pin point when it will or won't start...the moment the temperature drops below -5C the car fires and dies right away as seen here:

https://youtu.be/ROyKhBMsYDA

starts and runs like a charm as long as temperature is higher...I redid the fuel system and installed a new tandem pump...the only thing I can think of is some sort of cold enrichment map that's messed up because it clearly fires up and shuts off immediately...any thoughts?
 
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LukeWilson

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The TDI Allroad has no problems starting at -30C, glow it once and it fires on the first crank. I'm thinking its more map related...
 
KERMA

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nitec said:
haven't logged the mileage yet - car's in the garage for the winter while I do some little tweaks and Malone finishes the tune...when I drove it in the Fall I was getting about half my 2.0T mileage with the same car and same transmission...

speaking of the tune I still can't get any straight info on what's actually possible with the R783 nozzles...they way I understand it these are the biggest I can run on the PD motor...I've got the stock PD100 injectors so that should be the best combination...Pete suggests 250hp is the max from these injectors yet people claim 300+hp...my turbo has plenty of air to support the HP...I hit 30psi without hesitation and hold it there until I run out of RPMs...I haven't dynoed the car yet but it doesn't feel like 250hp and the adjustments Mark does don't seem to add much in terms of performance...

here's the latest pull I did last night...that's 2nd, 3rd and 4th gear pulls at WOT



I might be reading this wrong but I think 38mg/str is quite low is it not? any suggestions? Don't get me wrong - the car feels great but I want to make sure I'm getting the most out of those injectors - they're quite pricey as is...this will help guide my next build as well...
Click to expand...

You are definitely NOT getting the best out of those injectors. Not even close.

This I know.

There are one or two simple changes to convert a BEW ECU to use a WG turbo but it doesn't look like those were done in this tune.
 
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nitec

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had to switch tuners to get the most out of the Holset...Demon Diesel has done miracles with the file...I've got my cruise and AC back, the car starts when cold again, 7V glow plugs are in, all codes are gone, throttle response is adjusted, N75 is completely removed...

did a few pulls today - there's some more room for fuel but the car feels great...smoking is minimal under WOT

https://youtu.be/w4c046eVVVQ
 
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nitec

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it's looking even better now that I adjusted the boost controller to give me 35psi sustained and started doing actual WOT pulls...we're still about 2 months away from dyno numbers but I can tell you right now I've got more power than I would need for daily driving...it took a proper tune to finally bring the best out of the Holset and R783 nozzles...

I`ll do more logging and a few videos over the weekend...
 
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nitec

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all right - haven't updated in a while...took the car to the dyno over the weekend with lots of help from Demon Diesel and we put down a respectable 215hp/300ftlbs at the wheels on a Dynapack dyno...

here are the plots:





the video will be up tonight...we made some smoke :)
 
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JFettig

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Seems more like it doesn't have any steam until 3500rpm. Between 3500 and redline it seems pretty normal. I have never had any trouble making ~120hp by 2000RPM with any turbo setup I've run so far.

How is your wastegate plumbed?
 
JFettig

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Are you using a boost tap to the top side of it? Any n75 or MBC? Have you tried running no boost to the top of the gate and reset it to a lower cracking pressure?

On my compound setup I ended up not using the boost tap on the waste gate, it ran best and spooled best that way.
 
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nitec

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Hmm i wasn't even thinking about this until you brought it up. ..i wonder if the wg has gone loose again. ..i had to tighten it once before but haven't checked since. ..

On the higher side i was expecting a flatter tq curve to the right - that's what I meant. ..

I'll pull the turbo off and port the housing a bit and make sure the wg actuator is tight
 
JFettig

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Its a typical diesel torque curve, obviously not under 3500rpm but over, it should have spooled 1000rpm earlier with that turbo IMO and it would have had much higher torque peak but would maintain the same downward slope.
 
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vtpsd

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I have my wastegate actuator pre-load set a bit tighter than the holset factory setting, and I noticed a better response. I think my base level is around 25 psi or so, and i use a hallman manual boost controller in the signal line to bleed it off and set it to 34psi or so. It never overshoots and does not crack early. The way my exhaust is, you can CLEARLY hear when the WG cracks, and it never does until the upper 20's.
 
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nitec

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yeah I`ll dig into it this week...last time I tightened it up with the turbo in the car so I have no visual confirmation that it's where it needs to be...since the car drives so well I never even thought it had an issue...plus I have been meaning to port the turbo inlet for a while now - it's crazy how unmatched the T3 side is to the gasket and the manifold...
 
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Demon Diesel

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JFettig said:
Seems more like it doesn't have any steam until 3500rpm. Between 3500 and redline it seems pretty normal. I have never had any trouble making ~120hp by 2000RPM with any turbo setup I've run so far.

How is your wastegate plumbed?
Click to expand...
I think if we could have slowed down the dyno pulls we would have seen better response for the turbo. These pulls were quite fast. Somehow the slower pulls were causing oscillations in the dyno.

I may be missing something but I'm not sure why above 3600RPM we held boost and power dropped right off. O2 sensor was showing lean mixtures above 3600RPM which leads me to believe lack of fueling but durations were held quite high the entire time.
 
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nitec

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few planned changes in the coming weeks:

- new cam
- BEW injectors for daily driving
- swap turbo over to He211
- new exhaust manifold to allow for new intake manifold
- new intake manifold (SDI)

my new BRM is ready for the caged car so the R783 injectors will head over to it and I`ll use the stock injectors instead...been driving with them for a few weeks now and the car feels great plus the smoke is gone...

the next step after that is the He211 / He351 compound setup...the new exhaust manifold will go a long way to help fit the 351 in the engine bay so I`m fairly happy with that direction
 
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vtpsd

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I'm excited to see the results of the compound setup. My car works so well as it is, I am fighting the urge to try it myself.
 
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