VW Begins U.S. Deliveries of Jetta TDI Sedan and SportWagen

Rob_from_Elkmont · Aug 27, 2008

From WardsAuto.com:

http://wardsauto.com/home/vw_jetta_diesel_080821/

VW Begins U.S. Deliveries of Jetta TDI Sedan and SportWagen
By Ward’s Staff
WardsAuto.com, Aug 21, 2008 3:58 PM

Volkswagen of America Inc. begins customer deliveries of the Volkswagen Jetta TDI sedan and SportWagen, making it the first auto maker to market clean-diesel technology across all 50 states.
Unlike other diesels available in the U.S. with 50-state compliance, the Jetta TDI does not rely on urea injection to reduce harmful emissions. A typically costly after-treatment, urea is dispensed from tanks that also require periodic refilling.
VW says its Jetta TDI will deliver better fuel efficiency and and more low-end torque than gasoline-powered cars. The Jetta TDI achieves an estimated 29 mpg city (8 L/100 km) and 40 mpg hwy. (6 L/100 km), according to the Environmental Protection Agency. However, VW says third-party research suggests performance closer to 38/44 city/hwy. (6/5 L 100/km).
“We believe our Jetta TDIs truly offer a no compromise alternative-fuel driving experience that provides the customer the best of both worlds – excellent fuel efficiency combined with a dynamic driving experience,” says Stefan Jacoby, president and CEO, VW of America, in a statement.
The Jetta TDI sedan and SportWagen start at $21,990 and $23,590, respectively. The vehicles also qualify for a recently announced $1,300 federal tax credit.
Last year, diesel fuel was competitive with gasoline prices, but since the recent spike in oil prices it has shot ahead by as much as $0.50. A gallon of diesel in the U.S. cost an average of $4.39 this week, or $1.45 more expensive than year-ago.

CentralFloridaTDIguy · Aug 27, 2008

Almost Like A Press Release

It almost sounds like VWOA wrote the article and just had it published at Wards.

It seems almost positive.... but no negatives

frugality · Aug 27, 2008

And still no Sportwagen prices or 'build your own' on VW's site. And the 'Complete Specifications' section still has errors (i.e. lists no heated seats and no 115V outlet.)

jjski78 · Aug 27, 2008

Yeah, no kidding. By not having the build feature on the website, they are giving license to price gouging dealers. They have the friggin Routan on there to build. Where is the TDI?

PlaneCrazy · Aug 27, 2008

You can "build your own" on the VW.ca website. A bit disappointed at the lease/finance rate. For 60 mo. financing or 48 mo. lease, rate is 1.9% for the 2.5 and 6.9% for the TDI. Makes for a difference of over $100/mo for the purchase and, tax included, just about $100/mo for the lease.

If you're planning to buy/lease a TDI, you'd better do your math carefully. Around here RUG is about $1.30/liter and diesel, $1.50. At around 30k km per year (18k miles), the total monthly cost of the 2.5 and TDI would be approximately equal, so if you drive any less than that the TDI won't be worth it.

This doesn't of course factor in resale (not an issue if you lease and return the car at end of lease), which may help a bit in favour of the TDI.

If I were shopping today, I'd be reluctant to beta-test the TDI; the 2.5, while a boat anchor and not the most efficient powerplant on earth, does have the advantage of running RUG and being a fairly basic, robust and reliable engine. Even Consumer Reports says that 2.5-equipped Jettas and Rabbits are reliable.

angrytom · Aug 27, 2008

We have had one jetta sedan come in that was already sold a couple of months prior.It came in on 8/15/08 and the production date was 6/13/08.There is something about this engine that is making VW act stupid.We can't even get a hold of the self-study programs for this engine.I went on the website yesterday to download it and it wouldn't download,today i checked and the link was gone.Something just doesn't feel right.

bluengreen · Aug 27, 2008

Hi Folks: I recently spent 2 weeks touring France. I toured on a bus and spent hours watching the countryside roll by on their larger highways. It is a place where Diesel @1.42 E per liter is the cheapest fuel and it is used by what appears by observation to be pushing 80% of the vehicles with 4 or more wheels. It is a place where Priusi (saw 3 in 2 weeks) are barely less scarce than Dodo's. Trucks are banned from the roads on Sunday and have seperate (lower) speed limits while cars can zip by in the left lane (quietly - with no soot plume) at 20 mph faster (about 85MPH).
My point here is just this - the roads are lousy with Diesels mainly in the 1.2L-2L range, even outside a place like the Grand Casino in Monaco. Many of these cars are badged with a CTI, TDI, CDTI, and DI's of every stripe - oh and many come with a VW logo on them as well (Passats, Jettas, Polos etc). SO what end is served by all the false VWoA mystery, secrecy and the rest. As it relates to the TDI- this just IS NOT foray #1 into this end of the marketing pond. They have been there and done that (and are doing that) elsewhere on a grand scale AND longer than nearly anyone else - I have seen it with my own eyes.
In 2 weeks on all manner of French roads -even the larger Diesel trucks- no soot plumes. We may be led to believe that his is some bold new venture, but I for one don't buy this as a beta test, it looks far more like poor marketing and bad planning.

StevieDTDI · Aug 27, 2008

New TDI in NVA

I stopped by a local VW dealer in NVA today. I asked a salesman if I could see his TDI test car. He told me they sold it early in the week and the customer paid 3000.00 over invoice. However he had received three cars designated for the VW headquarters. I asked to see one of them and he came back with the keys of another recent delivery which was equipped with a six speed. The new model is quick and will wrap up to over 5K before you even notice it. I am not in the market for a new car, but this car could make me be in the market for something new. I presently have 60 k trouble free miles on my 2006 with/DSG, life time 42.7 MPG.

JasonMc · Aug 27, 2008

I have been to two different dealers here in SoCal and it is still very weird to see TDI's just sitting on lots... With my choice of colors!

I am casually looking to get another TDI. I had a 2001 but was forced to trade it in for a small SUV. Now I don't really need the room so I would like to get back into a diesel dub.

I am not sure is I want to try the DSG or just stick with a good ol' manual 6 speed. I am not familar with how the DSG works and what kind of MTBF before I will have to sink money into it.

Any thoughts?

frugality · Aug 27, 2008

bluengreen said:
Hi Folks: I recently spent 2 weeks touring France. I toured on a bus and spent hours watching the countryside roll by on their larger highways. It is a place where Diesel @1.42 E per liter is the cheapest fuel and it is used by what appears by observation to be pushing 80% of the vehicles with 4 or more wheels. It is a place where Priusi (saw 3 in 2 weeks) are barely less scarce than Dodo's. Trucks are banned from the roads on Sunday and have seperate (lower) speed limits while cars can zip by in the left lane (quietly - with no soot plume) at 20 mph faster (about 85MPH).
My point here is just this - the roads are lousy with Diesels mainly in the 1.2L-2L range, even outside a place like the Grand Casino in Monaco. Many of these cars are badged with a CTI, TDI, CDTI, and DI's of every stripe - oh and many come with a VW logo on them as well (Passats, Jettas, Polos etc). SO what end is served by all the false VWoA mystery, secrecy and the rest. As it relates to the TDI- this just IS NOT foray #1 into this end of the marketing pond. They have been there and done that (and are doing that) elsewhere on a grand scale AND longer than nearly anyone else - I have seen it with my own eyes.
In 2 weeks on all manner of French roads -even the larger Diesel trucks- no soot plumes. We may be led to believe that his is some bold new venture, but I for one don't buy this as a beta test, it looks far more like poor marketing and bad planning.

Realize that:

1) You don't see any smoke plumes from my TDI, either, ever since North America finally mandated ULSD (ultra-low sulfur diesel) about a year ago. Europe has had ULSD for a while now, so that's not a surprise that you're not seeing smoke from their non-CR diesels.

2) Europeans are accepting of diesels. Most Americans won't touch them. Plain and simple. VW can't sell here what Americans don't want. They do their marketing research, and that's why we get the 2.5L inline-5 gasser. That's what Americans prefer. For now.

3) Also realize that Americans don't want 1.2L engines, even if they do get great mileage. The public won't buy them, and reviewers hate and berate them.

frugality · Aug 27, 2008

JasonMc said:
I am not sure is I want to try the DSG or just stick with a good ol' manual 6 speed. I am not familar with how the DSG works and what kind of MTBF before I will have to sink money into it.

Any thoughts?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yfe56gqqIms

tdibigd · Aug 27, 2008

frugality said:
Realize that:

1) You don't see any smoke plumes from my TDI, either, ever since North America finally mandated ULSD (ultra-low sulfur diesel) about a year ago. Europe has had ULSD for a while now, so that's not a surprise that you're not seeing smoke from their non-CR diesels.

2) Europeans are accepting of diesels. Most Americans won't touch them. Plain and simple. VW can't sell here what Americans don't want. They do their marketing research, and that's why we get the 2.5L inline-5 gasser. That's what Americans prefer. For now.

3) Also realize that Americans don't want 1.2L engines, even if they do get great mileage. The public won't buy them, and reviewers hate and berate them.

I agree with your assessment. We probably won't see it, but there's a part of me that hopes a diesel Polo (or something like it from another mfg) will make it over w/crank windows, no sunroof, no gizmos.

frugality · Aug 27, 2008

tdibigd said:
I agree with your assessment. We probably won't see it, but there's a part of me that hopes a diesel Polo (or something like it from another mfg) will make it over w/crank windows, no sunroof, no gizmos.

I think there's hardly a car made that doesn't have standard power windows for the U.S. market. Your best bet will be one of those Chinese or Indian cars like Chery or Tata or Mahindra.

tdibigd · Aug 27, 2008

frugality said:
I think there's hardly a car made that doesn't have standard power windows for the U.S. market. Your best bet will be one of those Chinese or Indian cars like Chery or Tata or Mahindra.

Yeah, wishful thinking on my part.

Dr. Piech · Aug 27, 2008

frugality said:
Your best bet will be one of those Chinese or Indian cars like Chery or Tata or Mahindra.

Or not.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Swzbt76wBM&feature=related

JasonMc · Aug 27, 2008

frugality said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yfe56gqqIms

Thats a cool video! Thank you.

I guess I am wondering about the life expectancy and maintance.

dennisjs · Aug 28, 2008

JasonMc said:
I have been to two different dealers here in SoCal and it is still very weird to see TDI's just sitting on lots... With my choice of colors!

I am casually looking to get another TDI. I had a 2001 but was forced to trade it in for a small SUV. Now I don't really need the room so I would like to get back into a diesel dub.

I am not sure is I want to try the DSG or just stick with a good ol' manual 6 speed. I am not familar with how the DSG works and what kind of MTBF before I will have to sink money into it.

Any thoughts?

Sounds like they sent the cars to the wrong coast.

Buy the six speed manual. Leave the DSGs for those who don't know how to drive the manuals.

borderguy · Aug 28, 2008

frugality said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yfe56gqqIms

That's a very cool video. Even a mechanical idiot (c'est moi) can get it. I was impressed, but still a bit leery, after driving the dsg-equipped demo. Now I feel ready to accept either transmission when my number comes up. Thanks!

dieselyeti · Aug 28, 2008

frugality said:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yfe56gqqIms

Interesting clip, but it doesn't speak to the reliability of the DSG box that JasonMc asked about. I'm still undecided about this too, and will wait a few years for the DSG to prove itself out. I'm not about to pay a premium to be the first on my block to have one.

I'm sure my Yeti will hang in there for another 2-3 years.

PlaneCrazy · Aug 28, 2008

DSG vs manual. If you can drive the manual, go for it. No. 1, it's cheaper to buy. No. 2, manuals rarely fail, though clutches do. I suspect a clutch replacement is far cheaper than a DSG rebuild. And no. 3, you can call a DSG a clutchless manual all you want, it's still basically an automatic transmission. A real manual is simply more fun to drive. The FE will be a wash.

bum944 · Aug 28, 2008

Although I'm an American, I've been reading european auto magazines for over 30 years and have a pretty good feel for what's been going on over there. It is not unusual for magazines to conclude that the best BMW's for daily driving are the diesels becuase torque is more accessible in everyday driving and oh by the way, they get XXMPG as well.

So I've been lusting for one since the first generation of the common rail technology which I thought reduced the main diesel drawbacks to a tolerable level.

But then our diesel fuel was not of low enough sulphur content to work with CR fuel systems. Then the government actually did something good, they mandated that all diesel sold here had to low-sulphur by Sept '06. Woohoo! I thought this would finally bring modern diesels here, and americans would embrace them.

Then with California leading the way, they came up with the tightest emmissions requirements in the world and diesels were further delayed until new technology could be developed.

Finally, I thought 2008 would be the "year of the diesel" and although my hopes for that are fading with late intros and expensive fuel, it looks like we'll at least get some on the market and let the people decide for themselves.

I for one believe clean diesels along with hybrids are the way to go as a near-term response to global warming and reducing our dependence on foreign oil, a non-renewable resource. But it will take time for the public to jump on board.

I think it is significant that a company with the reputation of Honda has concluded that most of their small cars will have hybrid drivetrains and larger cars will be diesels. (smaller cars are used around town more where hybrids are superior, while larger vehicles are used more on the road where diesels are better). Of course, we'll see diesel hybrids eventually as well.

coolbreeze · Aug 28, 2008

stick

i was dead set on a dsg, and did not want the hassle of the stick. it had been 20 or more years since i had one, plus test driving the demo with dsg convinced me it would be the way to go.THEN a jsw came into my local dealer with a stick and i decided to take it just cause. in the back of my mind was all the posative threads from the vets on this forum saying get the stick. so i went for it. best decision i've made. love it. won't trade it for a dsg if i could. you feel so much more a part of the driving experience, and the 6 speeed is so well done and easy to use that it is no hassle at all. i also got to keep 1100 dollars for my window tint and stereo upgrades. just my 2 cents

PlaneCrazy · Aug 28, 2008

I have a six-speed manual on my '07 Passat wagon. I regularly drive it in rush hour traffic, and the stick is no issue at all. I have developed a technique of leaving a lot of space as a buffer between me and the car in front and it minimizes shifting; I leave it in second. I look as far ahead as I can see, and when I see brake lights coming on several cars ahead, I let off the gas immediately. The buffer closes but then opens up again as the traffic starts again, most often without the need for braking, which wastes fuel.

Sometimes cars hop into my buffer, I simply back off and create a new buffer.

Caveat: your brake lights will hardly ever come on even though sometimes you slow significantly. Most people tailgate in bumper-to-bumper. You need to keep and eye in back too to avoid getting bumped. I have a rear fog light I can use manually as a pseudo- brake light.

Even without all that though, the clutch action is light and smooth and the shifter slick as well, so no hassles.

jbarbee · Aug 28, 2008

The TDI Sportswagens are at the dealerships. The biggest problem I have is they sell as fast as we get the in and PDIed. Jeff Barbee 770-335-0244. If you have questions about pricing just call.

dr61 · Aug 28, 2008

PlaneCrazy said:
I have a six-speed manual on my '07 Passat wagon. I regularly drive it in rush hour traffic, and the stick is no issue at all. I have developed a technique of leaving a lot of space as a buffer between me and the car in front and it minimizes shifting; I leave it in second. I look as far ahead as I can see, and when I see brake lights coming on several cars ahead, I let off the gas immediately. The buffer closes but then opens up again as the traffic starts again, most often without the need for braking, which wastes fuel.

Sometimes cars hop into my buffer, I simply back off and create a new buffer.

Excellent technique; I try to drive this way also in heavy traffic. It saves fuel also and I think it also helps general traffic flow.

jjski78 · Aug 28, 2008

PlaneCrazy said:
I have a six-speed manual on my '07 Passat wagon. I regularly drive it in rush hour traffic, and the stick is no issue at all. I have developed a technique of leaving a lot of space as a buffer between me and the car in front and it minimizes shifting; I leave it in second. I look as far ahead as I can see, and when I see brake lights coming on several cars ahead, I let off the gas immediately. The buffer closes but then opens up again as the traffic starts again, most often without the need for braking, which wastes fuel.

Sometimes cars hop into my buffer, I simply back off and create a new buffer.

Caveat: your brake lights will hardly ever come on even though sometimes you slow significantly. Most people tailgate in bumper-to-bumper. You need to keep and eye in back too to avoid getting bumped. I have a rear fog light I can use manually as a pseudo- brake light.

Even without all that though, the clutch action is light and smooth and the shifter slick as well, so no hassles.

Where I live, doing that would be a quick way to get yourself killed. Your buffer would always get eaten up by other people thinking you're letting them in, and some idiot behind you talking on their cell while drinking a coffee and shaving/checking makeup (depending on gender), WILL plow into you, pushing you into the car that just slid into your buffer zone.

Jibeho · Aug 28, 2008

Have you ever driven the Cross Bronx Expressway? If you are not tailgating the car in front of you the guy behind you will be giving you a constant horn.

PlaneCrazy said:
I have a six-speed manual on my '07 Passat wagon. I regularly drive it in rush hour traffic, and the stick is no issue at all. I have developed a technique of leaving a lot of space as a buffer between me and the car in front and it minimizes shifting; I leave it in second. I look as far ahead as I can see, and when I see brake lights coming on several cars ahead, I let off the gas immediately. The buffer closes but then opens up again as the traffic starts again, most often without the need for braking, which wastes fuel.

Sometimes cars hop into my buffer, I simply back off and create a new buffer.

Caveat: your brake lights will hardly ever come on even though sometimes you slow significantly. Most people tailgate in bumper-to-bumper. You need to keep and eye in back too to avoid getting bumped. I have a rear fog light I can use manually as a pseudo- brake light.

Even without all that though, the clutch action is light and smooth and the shifter slick as well, so no hassles.

dr61 · Aug 28, 2008

Jibeho said:
Have you ever driven the Cross Bronx Expressway? If you are not tailgating the car in front of you the guy behind you will be giving you a constant horn.

I have never had an accident or close call using this technique in HEAVY SF Bay Area traffic. No horns either.

jjski78 · Aug 28, 2008

dr61 said:
I have never had an accident or close call using this technique in HEAVY SF Bay Area traffic. No horns either.

West coast is MUCH different from the east coast. I lived on both coasts, and now in Arkansas where I think the worst drivers come to retire.

MrSprdSheet · Aug 28, 2008

jjski78 said:
Your buffer would always get eaten up by other people thinking you're letting them in, and some idiot behind you talking on their cell while drinking a coffee and shaving/checking makeup (depending on gender)

I'm a bufferer, too. But when its stop and inch and I have my Venti, soy, half-caff', one-pump mochachoccalatte with me, all while chatting about nuclear fussion, I'd rather not shift .

And as to shaving being gender dependent (for the cyclists)? Coolbreeze, you think you could pip her in a sprint?

In all honesty, the upfront ($1,100) and long term ($3,000+?) cost of the DSG is why I'd probably avoid it for my own car, depite favoring an automatic in my area.

VW Begins U.S. Deliveries of Jetta TDI Sedan and SportWagen

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