TDI in a Toyota pickup

e*clipse

Veteran Member
Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
Thank you too, G60ing! :)
Yes it can be rotated. loosen the small bolts on the turbine and compressor sections and you can rotate them any which way.
Cool! they looked suspicious. ;) My eclipse has a pin & big circlip that forces one location.

I know there is a thermostat housing that points the outlet toward the front of the vw or twoards the wheelwell on a toyota. I think its the 2L aba outlet (1993-1999)
- Great! that solves the "running into motor mount" problem. :D

I think I've talked myself out of turning the exhaust manifold upside down. Besides the clearance issue between the turbo & the intake manifold, the turbo's exhaust & compressor inlet would face the wrong way. Since it's a 3 bolt mount, It wouldn't be reversable. Unless there's another compatible manifold, I think I'll have to go Spulen's route. If there's something close, I can make it work. I've gasket matched & ported my eclipse's manifold, turbo, & O2 sensor elbow.
It's just got to flow better than stock.
 

Spulen81

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2004
Location
Warners, NY
There are three different 22R-RE ones also so maybe even more if you add in V6s. I have a 22RE starter from my 87 that doesn't fit, its a higher output version. I have info on the smallest one.. but I can't locate it at the moment. Mine is the medium sized one so the smallest would give you a little more room.

The manifold is being built using 1.25" schedule 40 weld els, you can use schedule 10 stainless also but I don't have a back purge setup yet so I opted for just steel. Its a simple log design using a TT tuning 8V head flange, the rest of the parts are just generic flanges. The log design isn't the most effecient design out there for sure but they do work well. I ran mid 11s in my Rabbit using this same type of manifold.
 

e*clipse

Veteran Member
Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
There are three different 22R-RE ones...
Oh man! I'd better look closer. :( Do you think the small one would crank over the diesel ok? I'm assuming the big one came w/ Toyota's 22RTE or maybe their diesels.

Regarding the intake manifold, have you seen this? :cool:
Cool sight. Check out their tech articles - lots of turbo & electronic mod stuff.
http://autospeed.drive.com.au/cms/A_2605/article.html
 

Spulen81

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2004
Location
Warners, NY
I bet it would be OK. Its like a 1.2kw versus 1.4kw or something like that. My medium one works really well.

I did see that link. I don't have the appropriate tools to cut the flange out so I just bought one ($50). It would take me a year to do it myself. I'll post pics of mine once it all done.
 

e*clipse

Veteran Member
Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
Toyota use between 1.4kW and 2.2kW starters on their 2.0 diesels, 22RE
Is there a way to visually tell the difference? Are the larger ones physically larger in some way (length or diameter)?

I purchased an intercooler from an Audi 5000. It's a little smaller than my optimum, but it has the intake & outlet on the same side. It also has plastic side tanks :( I prefer all metal intercoolers, but at least I will have very short hose routing with this setup. :)

I spent some serious time cutting the front end so that the intercooler hoses could get by the radiator & allow a cold air inlet. The battery will be moved to the driver's side to allow cleaner plumbing.

Other than that, I just finished welding the motor mounts. I ran a lot of practice beads so the welds wouldn't be too lousy... It's a pretty critical part - hate to have the engine fall out. :p
 

DPM

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Mar 16, 2001
Location
Newtownards, N. Ireland
TDI
2019 Rav4 AWD Hybrid, Citroen C4 BlueHDI
Yes, the bigger ones are bigger.
Actually, if memory serves, the bigger motors have a one-piece motor "can" and the brushes at the reduction-gear end, whereas the small ones have the brushes under an endcap...
 

Spulen81

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2004
Location
Warners, NY
Yup the bigger one I have does have a larger one peice "can". The smaller ones have long bolts holding the end cap on. I found pics of the small starter also if you want I can email them to you.

Another thing I just found out.. If you have a GT15 turbo the medium sized starter will not fit. The Ko3 has more clearance. Long story, but I put a GT15 on this weekend assuming it would be the same. Its not.
 

e*clipse

Veteran Member
Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
hmmmm....

Another thing I just found out.. If you have a GT15 turbo the medium sized starter will not fit. The Ko3 has more clearance.
That's exactly why I'm asking these dumb questions. I've already

purchased a starter, but it's awfully close - just like Spulen's truck.

I also have the starter from the 3VZE V-6. It does not fit, because the mounting tabs are slightly different. I've also seen some pics of starters for diesels that appear to have a different mount.

From the searching I've done on Toyota starters, the ones that appear to fit the R-151F bellhousing (which I think is similar to the W56 bellhousing) are generally gear reduction starters. If there is a non gear reduction starter that would fit, it may buy me some space.

Generally, a given electric motor can be either longer or larger diameter to produce more torque. Some motorcycle starters (I know they won't fit :rolleyes: ) use more powerful magnets and are puny for the torque they put out. Larger diameter won't work longer may.

Here are some pics of some general types:
http://catalog.drivewire.com/drivew...=TO&model=PUP-5-008&category=All&part=Starter

These would fit my bellhousing and all have mounting bolts diametrically opposite of each other. The 1KW is not appreciably smaller in diameter than the 1.4KW.

http://www.drivewire.com/toyotaparts/catalog/toyotalandcruiserstarter.html
Note how the 2.0kw starter and the newer 1.4kw starter have offset mounting bolt holes. This is just like my V6 starter.
Note how the 1975-1980 Bosch 1.0kw starter is not a gear reduction starter, and would take a lot less space. The bolt holes just may fit too.

How big (in KW) is the starter for the 1.9L TDI?
 

Spulen81

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2004
Location
Warners, NY
I know factory toyota diesels have the starter on the other side of the bellhousing. Not sure on all of them though.
I have the R151F in now also and the starter clearance is about the same. (no better than the W anyway)

That bosch 1.0 non gear reduction unit should clear no problem. But is that the right picture? The bosch 1.0 gear reduction is supposed to fit per ACME but I have yet to see it in person.
 

e*clipse

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Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
That bosch 1.0 non gear reduction unit should clear no problem. But is that the right picture? The bosch 1.0 gear reduction is supposed to fit per ACME but I have yet to see it in person.
I would hope so. I guess the only way to find out is call them & grill them on it. :D I would also want some sort of ability to return it if it doesn't fit. There can be some strange subtleties that are hard to see in pictures.

Congrats on the tranny! By the way, is the transfer case a top shift or forward shift? Did you have to mod the output flanges?
 

Spulen81

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Joined
Mar 30, 2004
Location
Warners, NY
Its forward shift, I have to do something with the shift boots, they are quite a bit farther forward now than my W56 and top shift case. I did have to swap on the rear output flange from my old trans. The front flange was the same.
 

e*clipse

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Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
Ok, I have a little progress...

This bit sure seems to be taking way too much time. I tried to be cheap by using an Audi 5000 intercooler, and that turned into a lot of work. My recommendation would be to go Spulen's route on the intercooler, at least with the intlet/outlet facing the passenger side.

I started by cutting a section out of the front sheetmetal. The hole allows both intercooler pipes and a front cold air intake. I also had to remove a lot of material from the bottom cross support. The front end is very floppy at this point.



How the intercooler fits: (Routing is goint to be very short. The turbo outlet will be rotated ~ 115 degrees and connect to the bottom. The top will go more or less directly to the intake manifold.)



I built an airbox that will fit a cone filter (Amsoil). The outlet diameter is 3" The intake tube will consist of a 3" diameter pipe bend, reducer to the MAF, then a 45 degree bend into the turbo. Short & simple.

The battery will be moved to the drivers side.



Intercooler from the front, showing some of the braces/mounting tabs. There is additional bracing behind the intercooler as well. The stock latch support was replaced with the strap shown, and there is an additional bar that supports the bottom. (not welded on in this picture.)



Welding thin sheetmetal is tough! You have to be very careful to control the heat and not blow through. I found that if you run a series of "spot welds" , then quickly connect them with a bead, you can get a decent looking weld.
 

97WVOTDI

Well-known member
Joined
Jul 12, 2007
Location
Stanwood
TDI
Jetta
This is Completely Awsome!! This is my First Post but This is so close to a project I am working on I had to comment.

I have been acquiring parts to do a VW Turbo Diesel into a 2wd Toyota Truck.

I bought a 93 5spd, 2wd, std cab, short bed with a bad 22RE. I bought the same Adapter plate and flywheel kit from ACME. I also bought an 81 Non-Turbo VW Diesel for mocking up the mounts until I could find me a Real Turbo Engine.

But I have since found me a 97 Jetta TDI and have been working on getting it converted to run on WVO and I dropped a used 22RE back in the Truck to use it until I find a Good Turbo Diesel Engine.

I still fully plan on doing the convertion as the Kit from Acme cost $575.00 which is a lot to just ignore. Also, I think others would like to have something like it too. The reliability of a Toyota 2wd truck with the fuel economy and longevity of the VW Turbo Diesel Engine.

I will be finished with my TDI here real soon so I can get back to searching for a Good VW Turbo Diesel. Now after reading this I am going to include TDI's in my searches.

I look forward to reading further posts about this swap. VW TDI's ROCK!!
 
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G60ING

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 5, 2001
Location
MD
TDI
No TDIs Currently, I have an R36 Corrado. I've had an ALH Corrado swap, AHU Corrado swap and 2003 TDI Jetta
I'm envious of your short IC plumbing the throttle response should be amazing.

on my G60 I went from this:



To this:


The results were neck snapping. Just make certain you get a chip burned specifically for your setup where data logs are taken because you will get boost faster then any transverse motor arrangement and the fuel needs to be there or you might have problems.
 

e*clipse

Veteran Member
Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
I'm envious of your short IC plumbing the throttle response should be amazing.
Envious? Your's is MUCH shorter. :D How is the air-water intercooler working for you? What did you do for a radiator set-up?
 

G60ING

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 5, 2001
Location
MD
TDI
No TDIs Currently, I have an R36 Corrado. I've had an ALH Corrado swap, AHU Corrado swap and 2003 TDI Jetta
The air to water was great when I had it in use. but I should have had standalone so I could tune for the rapid throttle response. I cracked a pistion because of the factory ecu being slow to react. I had a 24"x12" cooler plus an intercooler in the stock IC position that was converted to a radiator.

The car that had that setup is going to get a 20VG60 and will get a rallye Golf FMIC.
 

e*clipse

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Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
Boost spike? Were you running a wastegate?

Do you think a manual boost control valve might have saved it? Will a boost control valve (like a Dawes Device) help with a VNT?

I find it interesting that, according to this thread a boost guage won't respond fast enough, as it's basically averaging values.

Working with electronic equipment, I've seen some devistating effects due to spikes. However, electronic systems are very "stiff" compared to compressed air systems. I'm curious what is actually seen by the motor at the intake manifold.

I have access to a datalogging system, and was thinking about logging pressures at various points in the system (at the turbo and at the intake manifold). It would definetely respond fast enough to see the spikes. I'd also like to log exhaust manifold pressure, EGT, and the intake temperatures at the turbo and at the intake manifold.

By the way, I got my paws on a VNT15 :p. Yes, its possible modify the 1Z ECU's programming to control it. :)
 

IndigoBlueWagon

TDIClub Enthusiast, Principal IDParts, Vendor , w/
Joined
Aug 16, 2004
Location
South of Boston
TDI
'97 Passat, '99.5 Golf, '02 Jetta Wagon, '15 GSW
Yes, it is. I forget the changes, but I think it includes the N75 and a re-programming. Talk to Rocketchip. He's done it on an A3 Jetta.
 

G60ING

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Aug 5, 2001
Location
MD
TDI
No TDIs Currently, I have an R36 Corrado. I've had an ALH Corrado swap, AHU Corrado swap and 2003 TDI Jetta
I didn't have a boost spike The G60 is a VW supercharger so boost spikes never happen.
 

e*clipse

Veteran Member
Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
Thanks IBW!

Looks like I'm on the right track, then... :)

I forgot to ask Jeff how that effects the MAF sensor when I was planning on the stock turbo.

He said,

"If you want part throttle refinement, keep the maf oem, otherwise if its a race application (floorboarded) its a non issue."

However, now the turbo's changed - - should the MAF change too? :confused:
 

e*clipse

Veteran Member
Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
Made a battery tray & welded it into the drivers side fenderwell:



Welding it was interesting. I caught the undercoat in the fenderwell on fire. That's gotta be good for my brain cells. :rolleyes:

Also got my "new" intake manifold:



It faces the right way; has nice long, smoothly curved intake runners (12" vs 2") and has a nice unrestricted input.

Input area is ~ twice that of stock. If the stock one is clogged you may as well have a 1/2 shut throttle butterfly ALL THE TIME. hmm, can't make any power, what's wrong? :p



I've got a little "d-porting" to do. I'll open up the runners so they match the d-port area and polish the inside a bit while I'm at it.

 

e*clipse

Veteran Member
Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
I've started to get serious about the tranny. It seems to have some general oil leak at one of its seams, so I'm going to take it apart, clean & inspect it, (HOPEFULLY there's nothing serious wrong) and re-seal it with Toyota's RTV.

Regarding the output flanges, I was hoping I would get lucky like Spulen did and just swap them for the ones that matched my driveline.

No beer for me: :(



If you are doing a swap from an auto tranny, they won't work. Note how the splines are different. The R-151F output flange is on the right. The bolt patterns are close, but not the same. I'll have to rotate them 45 degrees and drill matching hole patterns.
 

Spulen81

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2004
Location
Warners, NY
Crap, atleast its easy to redrill. Have you fit the vnt-15 on there yet? I'm wondering what the clearance is versus a Ko3/gt15.
 

jimbote

Certified Volkswagen Nut
Joined
Jul 10, 2006
Location
spiral arm, milky way (aka central NC)
TDI
Tacoma 4x4 converted to TDI
output flanges....

don't know if this will help, but the flange on the rear diff of a toyota 4x4 is the same spline and bolt pattern as the output flange on the transfer case (at least for a w56 setup)....just drive off the tin dust shield....;)
 

e*clipse

Veteran Member
Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
I'm going to be on vacation for a bit. (sailing - yes, the boat has a diesel :p ) Not much will happen around here for a while I'm gone. I've had bad luck convincing my wife to wrench on this thing...:rolleyes: I'll resume as soon as I get back.

Spulen - I'll get some turbo measurements for you when I get the turbo.

Jimbote - believe it or not, the front and rear are different on mine.
Luckily, it seems the pilot matches. One problem I've found at our junkyard is that the Yotas are very popular and picked clean.

Everyone - Thanks for the advice and tips so far. They've all been very helpful and gotten me to think outside my "box". :cool:
 

e*clipse

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Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
Well, had an interesting vacation (regarding diesels :rolleyes: )

We were motoring the sailboat out of a harbor and white smoke starts pouring from the engine room. :eek: I opened the engine room to find the freshwater coolent system spewing antifreeze all over the motor at the freshwater/saltwater heat exchanger. Luckily, the coolent system on these Yanmar marine diesels aren't as high pressure/temperature as automotive systems, so I was able to plug the hole with a rag and hold it until we could motor back to our slip.

It turns out my brother thought the overflow tank was optional...:p In addition, the fan belt that powered the freshwater pump was loose. The two problems combined and the motor started to overheat.

We were lucky it happened early so we could turn around & get parts.

Other than that, it was very beautiful up in the San Juan Islands & we got some great sailing days. :)
 

e*clipse

Veteran Member
Joined
May 9, 2007
Location
Chico, CA
TDI
Toyota TDI swap
back 2 it...

Here are some shots of the tranny rebuild. I have more pics if people are interested.

The outside cleaned up, ready for disassembly:


After removing the transfer case, bellhousing, and front & rear housings, this is the core of an R151-F transmission. This view is looking at the bottom; note all the sludge.


At this point I was really torn about whether to do a full rebuild or just clean it up & put it back together. I decided to clean it & check the condition of parts before proceeding.


After cleaning, I found things to be in pretty good shape, as if it had been rebuilt previously. (which would explain the non-stock sealent color) Of course without a full disassembly, which would require a press & various special tools, I was unable to evaluate tolerances. The syncros looked quite new.

When everything was clean, the shifting worked nicely. The bearings felt good, so I decided to reassemble it. :cool:

Here it is, waiting for the sealent to cure:


I'm currently working on the transfer case.
 
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