Mk 4 Golf LED retrofit.

Liseed

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Nov 26, 2007
Location
Monroe, NY
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2003 2 door GOLF TDI; 2009 Touareg 3.0 TDI
MK4 Golf quality LED bulb retrofit.

I converted the entire car over to all LED bulbs. Most were plug and play, no modifications needed, however the stock hazard light switch need modification for use with the LED directional lights to prevent hyper flashing.

My Celis headlights needed some mods to do this. I wired the ring lights as DRL's and parking lights. I plan on adding RGB (or blue) COB LED's behind the stock ring lights in the future for added brightness to the DRL's and parking lights (they are a bit dim in daylight).

For the headlights I had to fabricate and machine some parts to allow for the larger LED bulbs to fit. I used aluminum and incorporated heat sinks into my design to help keep things cool (most likely not really necessary since LED bulbs run cooler that stock halogen bulbs, but it cant hurt!). This set up is easily 2 or 3 times the output of regular halogen bulbs + all the benefits of LED lighting! This set up should be future proof as well, allowing to simply upgrade the bulbs as better ones come out, assuming the footprint of future bulbs stays roughly the same.




Headlight housing modified as required for LED bulbs:
I had to cut away some of the housing around the high-beam access cover.








High-beam side required a custom spacer made on my milling machine to allow for the larger bulb and eliminate interference with the existing wiring:







Low-beam side and fogs required custom caps made on my lathe and milling machine to fit the larger bulbs and allow some airflow behind the bulbs. The bulbs do fit without modifying the cover, BUT the bulbs are right up against the cover and would most likely overheat due to fan airflow being blocked. I also incorporated a heat-sink to help cool things off.








Foglight cap was challanging to machine because of the uneven surface of the headlight bulb cover behind the foglight bulb. It has 3 different surfaces, and one of them is curved!




COMMENTS: (some are condensed from replies to this thread). These comments apply to the Celis headlight reflectors only.


LOWBEAMS: I have tried 3000, 4000, and 5000 lumen bulbs behind the stock celis low beam projector. I settled on the 5000 lumen bulbs at 6000K color. 5000 lumen bulbs about match the stock halogen bulbs in terms of wattage (power use), but they are a little over 3 times as bright in terms of lumen output! At the 5000 lumen output, I find they seem to about match the brightness of modern LED headlight systems (just by eyeball comparisons) and yet have a nice crisp cutoff line just as they did with stock halogen bulbs without glaring oncoming traffic. I have even noticed a few LED headlights in new cars that were even brighter than this, but I did not want to exceed the wattage of the stock halogen bulbs, as there are possible wiring harness issues if you exceed the wattage the car was designed for. The 3000 and 4000 lumen bulbs were still fantastic improvements, however. There are even higher lumen bulbs out there, I have not tried them, but I would not recommend them for on road use.

HIGHBEAMS:
I tried 3000, 4000, and 5000 lumen bulbs in the stock celis reflector style high beams. I settled on 3000 lumens at 6000K color. 3000 lumens is about 2x the brightness of stock halogen bulbs, but it sure seems like more. Bright but not dangerously bright, IMO.

I can drive at 100 mph (on a track, of course) and not over-drive my headlights with these, easily. Really makes a difference on dark country roads! I can see deer I was not able to see before because the sides of the road are lit up further to the sides and MUCH better than before.

5000 lumens is definitely off road only! (I really mean it, lol). Turns night into a bright day! Way too bright for on road use, for many reasons.
4000 lumens was just a tad too bright also, (it only turns night into a normal day) as when I dipped to low beams after using these for a while, it was actually a bit blinding, kind of like when you take dark sunglasses off on a bright day, it took a minute or two to readjust, even with the brighter low beams, and I found that to be dangerous, especially when there was oncoming traffic headlights added into this effect.I will try a 3500 lumen bulb here if I can find a quality made bulb at that output.

FOGLIGHTS:
Mine are flip chips, which means they flip from yellow (3000K) to white light (6000K) just by turning them off and on again. I absolutely LOVE this!! Again, I LOVE this! Mine output 3800 lumens. They seem put out about as much light (maybe a tad dimmer) as the low beams on the road. The fogs don't have a projector like the low beams, just a glass lens with a metal cutoff. Like the low beams, these also have a crisp cut off line without glare above the line. The cutoff line just about matches the low beam cutoff line on mine. They are bright enough to use just by themselves, even at night. The yellow light really makes a difference in inclement weather, it really adds to contrast (just like wearing amber lenses in your ski goggles). I often run the foglights on white with the low beams as this lights up the sides of the road in rural areas even better than low beams alone.



If anyone is interested, I can fabricate these parts and/or modify your existing headlights for you. Or supply complete modified assemblies.


.
 
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Liseed

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Location
Monroe, NY
TDI
2003 2 door GOLF TDI; 2009 Touareg 3.0 TDI
Results:

Left side of the car stock halogens vs right side of the car LED.

Ill post more on dark road after I finish the left side housing.


High beams: incredible difference!




Low Beams: wow!


Fogs: definitely a lot brighter, AND has the option of toggling from yellow to white just by turning fog lights on/off again!
I often use fogs to light up the sides of the road in deer country. Use of fogs has saved me from deer a few times just because I was able to spot them sooner.


Yellow:


White: (all I did was turn fogs off then on again to get the LED side to change to white).
 

RexNICO

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Sep 17, 2013
Location
South West OH
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2011 Tiguan, 2011 Q7
So, the 1st question is, how much for the nice aluminum bits?

Nice work and very cool (pun intended). I've been considering a Jetta to Golf front end swap just for the better OEM head lights.

Still considering modifying Jetta headlights, but modified Gold head lights would be better + better, so it would only make sense, right?
 

Liseed

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Nov 26, 2007
Location
Monroe, NY
TDI
2003 2 door GOLF TDI; 2009 Touareg 3.0 TDI
Not sure yet. 6 pieces total. each one is a one off part.

I have to price materials out, but probably in the neighborhood of 4 or 5 hundred for all 6 bits.

I could do better if I get say 20 people interested in these and do a CNC run. (I don't have a cnc milling machine, so I'd have to sub it out).
 
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RexNICO

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Sep 17, 2013
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South West OH
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2011 Tiguan, 2011 Q7
Thanks for the reply.

Whew, didn't think the # was gonna be anywhere near that. Not questioning the effort or materials, just didn't think anyone would invest that kind of $$ into DIY headlights.
 

Rrusse11

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Jan 23, 2014
Location
PA Deutsch Country
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2002 Golf, 5spd; 05 Jeep CRD
Nice work! I've been eyeing off LEDs for my Golf. The technology is clearly improving by leaps and bounds. Obviously you've got the skills and capabilities to do serious metal fabrication.

I was thinking one of these curved light bars on the front bumper wired to the high beams. They make an 8 degree spot that would light up a loooong way down the road. We got a serious deer problem this neck of the woods too.

https://www.superbrightleds.com/mor...-curved-off-road-led-light-bar-72w/2073/4710/

Best site I've found so far while puttering around the internet.
Good comparative photos and details. Install a small bar with a flood pattern in the lower grills as fogs.

Figure out a price for modifying a pair of headlights if sent to you,
I'd be interested. You've done the hard part, building the prototype.

 

Liseed

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Location
Monroe, NY
TDI
2003 2 door GOLF TDI; 2009 Touareg 3.0 TDI
Thanks for the reply.

Whew, didn't think the # was gonna be anywhere near that. Not questioning the effort or materials, just didn't think anyone would invest that kind of $$ into DIY headlights.

People are spending around 1k to get the oem HIDs!

These are better! (IMO).

Custom automotive fabrication and machining and 3 decades of experience at it ain't cheap :) (I specialize in restoration of high end pre-war European and American classics that end up competing at Pebble Beach).

I have a week of R&D into this (and counting), and by the time I get things finalized, this will easily be about a full day project, with or without a CNC, although a CNC would save me half a day or so, but with increased overhead, so probably a wash in the end, unless I get, say 20 or more folks who want this, then CNC produced parts would cut the cost a decent amount.
 
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Liseed

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Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Location
Monroe, NY
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2003 2 door GOLF TDI; 2009 Touareg 3.0 TDI
Nice work! I've been eyeing off LEDs for my Golf. The technology is clearly improving by leaps and bounds. Obviously you've got the skills and capabilities to do serious metal fabrication.

I was thinking one of these curved light bars on the front bumper wired to the high beams. They make an 8 degree spot that would light up a loooong way down the road. We got a serious deer problem this neck of the woods too.

https://www.superbrightleds.com/mor...-curved-off-road-led-light-bar-72w/2073/4710/

Best site I've found so far while puttering around the internet.
Good comparative photos and details. Install a small bar with a flood pattern in the lower grills as fogs.

Figure out a price for modifying a pair of headlights if sent to you,
I'd be interested. You've done the hard part, building the prototype.

Will you be providing the LED bulbs? 4x H7, 2x H8 fogs? (H8s must be 1.5 cm or smaller measured across where it sticks into the housing.)
What kind of housings do you have? (Celis, E codes, etc).
Do they need custom wiring or modification? (angel eye lights as DRL's for example).
 

Rrusse11

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Jan 23, 2014
Location
PA Deutsch Country
TDI
2002 Golf, 5spd; 05 Jeep CRD
"Custom automotive fabrication and machining and 3 decades of experience at it ain't cheap :) (I specialize in restoration of high end pre-war European and American classics that end up competing at Pebble Beach)." Liseed

Ahhhh, it shows! I did antique furniture and boats in Sydney for a
number of years. The dealers get rich, but once you've got the rep,
you're never out of work. Wood was my game, only a half-assed mechanic.

I'll check my headlights and see what I've got. I do have the glass
foglight lenses, and I think the factory (Brazilian build) wiring is there, just no light bases for the fogs. I'll be in touch.

Cheers,
R*2
 

dirtride

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Joined
Apr 30, 2013
Location
GROK-west coast, USA
TDI
2003 Golf
Looks good!

Any updates with this?

Is there a best housing to use for this mod? Considering reflector. (stock, Celis or E-code - or does it even matter?)
 

Liseed

Veteran Member
Joined
Nov 26, 2007
Location
Monroe, NY
TDI
2003 2 door GOLF TDI; 2009 Touareg 3.0 TDI
Update: Yes, these are fantastic!

I can only comment on the Celis Headlight reflectors as these are what I am using. I got them in Gemany a few years ago, new in the box!.

I had to redesign the left side heat-sink caps to accommodate the plastic air intake cover between the battery and the headlight assembly. (I had to shorten the stick out 1/3 of an inch or so from my original design). The heat-sinks work great! They are noticeably warmer than the surrounding headlight assembly during operation. They also accommodate the many different bulbs I have been trying out. No condensation, as I was careful to seal everything and use the original seals on both bulb covers.


LOWBEAMS: I have tried 3000, 4000, and 5000 lumen bulbs behind the stock celis low beam projector. I settled on the 5000 lumen bulbs. 5000 lumen bulbs about match the stock halogen bulbs in terms of wattage, but they are a little over 3 times as bright in terms of lumen output! At the 5000 lumen output, I find they seem to about match the brightness of modern LED headlight systems (just by eyeball comparisons) and yet have a nice crisp cutoff line just as they did with stock halogen bulbs without glaring oncoming traffic. I have even noticed a few LED headlights in new cars that were even brighter than this, but I did not want to exceed the wattage of the stock halogen bulbs, as there are possible wiring harness issues if you exceed the wattage the car was designed for. The 3000 and 4000 lumen bulbs were still fantastic improvements, however.

HIGHBEAMS: I tried 3000, 4000, and 5000 lumen bulbs in the stock celis reflector style high beams. I settled on 3000 lumens. 3000 lumens is about 2x the brightness of stock halogen bulbs, but it sure seems like more. Bright but not dangerously bright, IMO. I can drive at 100 mph and not over-drive my headlights with these, easily. Really makes a difference on dark country roads! I can see deer I was not able to see before because the sides of the road are lit up MUCH better than before.

5000 lumens is definitely off road only! (I really mean it, lol). Turns night into a bright day! Way too bright for on road use, for many reasons.
4000 lumens was just a tad too bright also, (it only turns night into a normal day) as when I dipped to low beams after using these for a while, it was actually a bit blinding, kind of like when you take dark sunglasses off on a bright day, it took a minute or two to readjust, even with the brighter low beams, and I found that to be dangerous, especially when there was oncoming traffic headlights added into this effect.

FOGLIGHTS: Mine are flip chips, which means they flip from yellow to white light just by turning them off and on again. I absolutely LOVE this!! Again, I LOVE this! Mine output 3800 lumens. They seem put out about as much light (maybe a tad dimmer) as the low beams on the road. The fogs don't have a projector like the low beams, just a glass lens with a metal cutoff. Like the low beams, these also have a crisp cut off line without glare above the line. The cutoff line just about matches the low beam cutoff line on mine. They are bright enough to use just by themselves, even at night. The yellow light really makes a difference in inclement weather, it really adds to contrast (just like wearing amber lenses in your ski goggles). I often run the foglights on white with the low beams as this lights up the sides of the road in rural areas even better than low beams alone.

ALSO: edited the op to include a pic of the completed mod with the fog light heatsink cap.
 
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unpimpZauto

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Mar 24, 2009
Location
West Olive, MI
TDI
2003 Jetta Wagon, Black
I have tried 3000, 4000, and 5000 lumen bulbs behind
do you mean 3000, 4000, and 5000 lumen bulbs are likely not what you were tesing, but 3000K (K as in Kelvin), 4000K, 5000K color temperature.

standard headlights typically output less than 1000 lumens, and high quality HIDs are around 3000.

with the same amount of optical energy, the human eye sees 3000K-5000K white light as brighter.
 

Liseed

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Nov 26, 2007
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Monroe, NY
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2003 2 door GOLF TDI; 2009 Touareg 3.0 TDI
do you mean 3000, 4000, and 5000 lumen bulbs are likely not what you were tesing, but 3000K (K as in Kelvin), 4000K, 5000K color temperature.

standard headlights typically output less than 1000 lumens, and high quality HIDs are around 3000.

with the same amount of optical energy, the human eye sees 3000K-5000K white light as brighter.

I mean lumens, A unit of luminous flux, a measure of visible light emitted by a source, aka 'brightness'. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lumen_(unit)


What you mention is color temperature (K for kelvin, a unit of measure for absolute temperature) it is a means to measure color of a light source. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Color_temperature

All the bulbs I tested were 6000K in color. (slight bluish white to my eye). I would not call 3000K white light, 3000K is quite yellow, fog light yellow. The foglight flip chips I use are 3000/6000K in color.


The bulbs I tested were indeed the lumen values I listed. (According to the bulb manufactures or suppliers).
 
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Liseed

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2003 2 door GOLF TDI; 2009 Touareg 3.0 TDI
For reference:

The high output H7 bulbs a lot of people use in these cars put out around 1600 to some that can output 2100 lumens, according to various manufactures and retailers of H7 bulbs. "Normal" (OEM) H7 bulbs are around 1300 lumens.

The OEM HID lights available for the MK4 put out around 2100 lumens (each HID bulb). (AFAIK)
 
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Mike_04GolfTDI

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Richmond, BC, Canada
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Mine: 2019 Golf R DSG, Wife's: 2015 Golf Comfortline TDI
Do the heatsinks actually dissipate much heat? To me it looks like they are basically just covers over the holes in the bulb covers with no physical connection to the LED bulb inside.

So the fans on the LEDs are just blowing a lot of hot air around inside the headlight module, and a small fraction of that heat may be transferred to the external heatsinks.

Of course, all that matters is they don't overheat and stop working. If that goal has been achieved, then great! It all looks very nice.
 

Liseed

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2003 2 door GOLF TDI; 2009 Touareg 3.0 TDI
They do work, as they are noticeably warmer than the surrounding bucket when the lights are on. The fans are blowing directly onto the sinks. They have not shut down on me at all. Even with all 3 bulbs going at once! Every little bit helps.
 
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Fixmy59bug

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Las Vegas, NV
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2015 Passat TDI SE
Light output on the garage wall looks good from 5 feet away.

Could you humor a light junkie and post a few more pics?

Maybe from 25 feet away, then out on the road?

highs and lows please...
 

SilverGhost

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What bulbs are you using? I have tried LED "drop in" bulbs and most have poor beam pattern. Diode does not line up to focus correctly compared to filament location in halogen bulbs in most I have tried.

I'm looking to improve the Jetta (daily beater) for this winter. Wish I still had my Golf.

Jason
 

Liseed

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I would be somewhat interested in this but do not have Celis reflectors.

May not perform as well?
I cannot be 100% certain. But I did look at my old e-codes carefully, and they *look* the same except for the groove around the outside of the hi beam reflector and lo beam projector for the ring light.
 

Liseed

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2003 2 door GOLF TDI; 2009 Touareg 3.0 TDI
Light output on the garage wall looks good from 5 feet away.

Could you humor a light junkie and post a few more pics?

Maybe from 25 feet away, then out on the road?

highs and lows please...
I will try and get out there tonight to do this.
 

Liseed

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What bulbs are you using? I have tried LED "drop in" bulbs and most have poor beam pattern. Diode does not line up to focus correctly compared to filament location in halogen bulbs in most I have tried.

I'm looking to improve the Jetta (daily beater) for this winter. Wish I still had my Golf.

Jason

H7 hi and lo beams and H8 fogs. I am very happy with the beam patterns on them.
 

Liseed

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I still haven't gotten around to night time pics, but I hope to do so in the next few days.
 

SilverGhost

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H7 hi and lo beams and H8 fogs. I am very happy with the beam patterns on them.
I figured that, I was looking more at manufacturer specifics. I have tried H7 "drop in" in my Tiguan that claimed to position the LED to mimic halogen filament, but it fell short and had a fuzzy beam pattern. I was looking to find out what you had, since your cut off is so sharp, to try in my headlamp.

Jason
 

DudaEnergy

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Anyone know where to find the info on modifying the hazard light switch to stop hyper flashing?



Anything on the headlamp out error when running an LED lamp? When mine triggers, it prevents me from using cruise control. Not fun killing the headlights while driving just to get cruise control on. Works fine if I'm already in cruise control. I suppose for headlights I could get LEDs which consume as much power as a Halogen and that would solve the problem, and also blind everyone else lol
 
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