16mpg 5.5 AVF TDI PASSAT

Dear TDI club experts,
I recently bought a second hand VW PASSAT 1.9TDI 130BHP (AVF engine) with 01V TIPTRONIC Transmission. And I was shoked when begun estimating my fuel consumption which seemed to be very very high.

It was almost 16mpg and 23mpg in the best cases.

Could you please help me findout what is going wrong with her.
Cheers

Where to start? Snow screen, air filter, MAF sensor, clogged intake/EGR valve, timing, dragging brakes, under inflated tires. driving habits...

Do you have access to VCDS?

Thank you 1858sailor for the reply.

And yes I do have the old version (VAG-COM v3.11).
But I think It can do the job


regards,
Med

1854sailor said:

Where to start? Snow screen, air filter, MAF sensor, clogged intake/EGR valve, timing, dragging brakes, under inflated tires. driving habits...

Do you have access to VCDS?

Click to expand...

Regarding to all the below I think is all OK except for the timing.
How could I check it ?

mohamed.bouchair said:

Regarding to all the below I think is all OK except for the timing.
How could I check it ?

Click to expand...

Does ur car had timming belt replaced lately?

Go at the engine module than click on measuring blocks and go at group 4 and see the field 4 and post the result

I can see 0.0CF in the 4th field.

And the TB haven't been changed yet, The is going to be serviced soon.

I had some screenshots of VAGCOM while reading several mesuring blocks. But i can't find a way to insert them in a post.

First off all I will replace my temp sensor and thermostat valve they could be both faulty as engine temperature is not rising.

I forgot to mention that my torque converter is slipping a lot and the TCM is throwing an error.

It could also related to that ?

You are probabably going to need to get a torque converter replaced at the very least at at the most an entire transmission from the sounds of things.

leicaman said:

You are probabably going to need to get a torque converter replaced at the very least at at the most an entire transmission from the sounds of things.

Click to expand...

I recently replaced the engine with second hand one (its an AWX not stock AVF but both are 130BHP)
had a full trans rebuild Unfortunately the TC ahadn't been replaced (what a mess )

But what about the idle injected quantity ?

12.4mg/R seems to be out of specs ! With my friend's passat I'm getting 6.0mg/R

Check it after you have fixed the low operating temp problem. It could just be the ECU over fueling since it thinks the engine is cold.

1854sailor said:

Check it after you have fixed the low operating temp problem. It could just be the ECU over fueling since it thinks the engine is cold.

Click to expand...

I'll do so by tomorrow morning.

Just to be sure,

Is the temp sensor the green one near the tendem pump ?

thx.

Yes, and be sure to replace the o-ring. The retainer clip is plastic so you might want to get one of those also in case the old one breaks. Good luck!

Thanks, I will let know.

For now, I need to take some rest for tomorrow.
it is time to go bed.

I take the opportunity to post a full autoscan dump

VAG-COM Version: Release 311.2-N


Chassis Type: 3B - VW Passat B5
Scan: 01,02,03,08,15,16,17,19,35,36,37,46,55,56,58

Address 01 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 038 906 019 DS
Component: 1,9l R4 EDC G000AG 1348
Coding: 00001
Shop #: WSC 00028
1 Fault Found:
18044 - Powertrain Data Bus: Missing Message from Airbag Controller
P1636 - 35-10 - - - Intermittent
Readiness: N/A

Address 02 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 3B0 927 156 S
Component: AG5 01V 1.9l-PD RdW 1416
Coding: 00103
Shop #: WSC 12345
No fault code found.

Address 03 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 8D0 907 389 D
Component: ABS/ESP front D56
Coding: 04257
Shop #: WSC 00011
No fault code found.

Address 08 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 3B1 907 044 H
Component: CLIMATRONIC B5GP 0003
Coding: 17000
Shop #: WSC 00028
2 Faults Found:
00792 - A/C Pressure Switch (F129)
35-10 - - - Intermittent
01198 - Comfort Data Bus: Incorrect Software Version
35-00 - -

Address 16 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 1J0 907 487 B
Component: Lenkradelektronik 0002
Coding: 00008
Shop #: WSC 00028
No fault code found.

Address 17 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 3B0 920 849 A
Component: KOMBI+WEGFAHRSP VDO V03
Coding: 21115
Shop #: WSC 00000
WVWZZZ3BZ4P092831
4 Faults Found:
00562 - Sensor for Oil Level/Temperature (G266)
30-00 - Open or Short to B+
01176 - Key
65-10 - Unauthorized - Intermittent
01177 - Engine Control Unit
64-10 - Not Currently Testable - Intermittent
01321 - Control Module for Airbags (J234)
49-00 - No Communications

Address 19 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 6N0 909 901
Component: Gateway K<->CAN 0001
Coding: 00006
Shop #: WSC 00028
2 Faults Found:
01321 - Control Module for Airbags (J234)
49-00 - No Communications
01332 - Door Control Module: Passenger Side (J387)
49-00 - No Communications

Address 36 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 3B1 959 760 D
Component: Sitzverstellung 0101
Coding: 0000000
Shop #: WSC 00000
3 Faults Found:
01008 - Note: Emergency OFF Switch is Active!
000 - -
01010 - Sensor for Driver's Seat Recline (G219)
011 - Open Circuit
01332 - Door Control Module: Passenger Side (J387)
004 - No Signal/Communication

Address 46 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 1C0 959 799 B
Component: 03 Komfortgerát HLO 0001
Coding: 00259
Shop #: WSC 00028
1 Fault Found:
01332 - Door Control Module: Passenger Side (J387)
49-00 - No Communications

Address 56 -------------------------------------------------------
Controller: 1J0 035 186 E
Component: Radio BNO 0005
Coding: 04403
Shop #: WSC 00028
2 Faults Found:
00852 - Loudspeaker(s): Front
36-00 - Open Circuit
00853 - Loudspeaker(s): Rear
36-00 - Open Circuit

End -------------------------------------------------------

Update?

Parts replaced - no change

1854sailor said:

Update?

Click to expand...

Today I my self replaced the following :
- Coolant temp sensor.
- Thermostat (It was faulty).
- The fuel filter.

The temperature can now rise to 90°C/190°F without problem.

But the fuel consumption is still abnormal (twice of what it should be).



1854sailor in think we have the same engine 130HP AVF. Could you please tell me what is your instant fuel consumption at engine working temperature.

Thanks.

At operating temperature - post a screen shot of group 0, preferably if your version of VCDS can switch to basic settings.

How easy/difficult is it to start?

North American '04-'05 Passats have the BHW engine. However, "instant fuel consumption" on the MFD is meaningless. Next time that I am out, I will will log some fuel consumption data on VCDS.

Windex said:

At operating temperature - post a screen shot of group 0, preferably if your version of VCDS can switch to basic settings.

How easy/difficult is it to start?

Click to expand...

Dear Windex,

The car is not difficult to start when cold but the engine tends to shake (rough idle) for approx. 1-2 secs then then idle perfectly smooths.

Please find below the screenshots you requested :

Measuring blocks group 0 (Normal mode)


Measuring blocks group 0 (Basic settings)


What do you think of ?

1854sailor said:

North American '04-'05 Passats have the BHW engine. However, "instant fuel consumption" on the MFD is meaningless. Next time that I am out, I will will log some fuel consumption data on VCDS.

Click to expand...

Great thx.

mohamed.bouchair said:

Dear Windex,

The car is not difficult to start when cold but the engine tends to shake (rough idle) for approx. 1-2 secs then then idle perfectly smooths.

Please find below the screenshots you requested :

Measuring blocks group 0 (Normal mode)

Measuring blocks group 0 (Basic settings)

What do you think of ?

Click to expand...

See the "TDI-Timing" button - click on that (with only group 0 showing, otherwise it will be greyed out) and there will be a drop down on the right with engine selection - use the drop down to select AVF and then post another screen shot of the timing graph that you see.

OK Windex,
I will send the results tomorrow.
Thank you once more

Windex said:

See the "TDI-Timing" button - click on that (with only group 0 showing, otherwise it will be greyed out) and there will be a drop down on the right with engine selection - use the drop down to select AVF and then post another screen shot of the timing graph that you see.

Click to expand...

AVF engine is not listed in the dropdown. There are only pre PD tdi engines 1Z, ALH, ...

What do you think ?

QuickTD said:

There is no timing graph available for the PD. Timing is set mechanically by adjusting the camshaft phasing at the pulley. The timing appears correct based on the VCDS screenshots (torsion value 0.0). Fuel consumption at idle seems highly abnormal. I have a BHW and it typically shows 0.4-0.5l/h at idle and 4.8-5.2l/100km at a 90km/h cruise.
For the car to be overfueling this severely and not revving out of control (a diesel will simply rev harder if more fuel is injected it can't really run "rich") there must be some other restriction holding the engine back. I'm thinking plugged catalytic converter or some restriction in the intake (flat cam). I can't belive it can produce those consumption numbers and not set a code for something.
How many miles on the engine? Has the camshaft been inspected? Are you actually calculating fuel economy or just using the MFA?

Click to expand...

I had recently replaced my stock engine (AVF 130PS, 210K miles) with a second hand one (AWX 130PS, 65K miles). So :
1. Intake + EGR valve + intercooler inspected and cleaned.
2. New MAF
3. cam shaft inspected and looks healthy
That's it !
But yes I suspect a clogged catalytic converter and may be faulty injector seals (yesterday after a 130miles/6Gallons highway trip I heard air bubbles moving in the fuel lines under the selector lever at idle).
I also think the AWX engine could have smaller injector nozzles (not sure) this may increase the injection duration so the ECU could think there is more fuel beeing injected.
The first thing i gonna do is to remove the catalytic converter and make a run test.
Waiting for your comments

QuickTD said:

According to etka AVF and AWX have the same injectors. What went wrong with the original engine?

Click to expand...

I bought the car with stock engine dead : flatened cam shaft, bad injectors and dead turbo. The engines misfires in 2 and sometimes in 3 cylinders.

Today I have comleptely loosened the exhaust pipe that was bolted to the turbo and went for a test drive. nothing changed

I noticed that there was a smell of unburnt fuel. the smoke looks whitish. Is this normal ? Could it be related to the abnormal consumption ?

Sincerely, I have no more ideas.

Have you checked the compression on the replacement engine?

Windex said:

Have you checked the compression on the replacement engine?

Click to expand...

Yes, and values were pretty good for a PD engine.

QuickTD said:

I have heard that the torsion value can read 0.0 if the cam is too far out of time. Were the proper locking tools used on the cam/crank when the belt was installed? The engine shouldn't really idle very well if the cam is a long way out of time.

Does the torsion value bounce around a bit at high rpm? This would indicate that it is at least being read properly.

Click to expand...

When cold, the engine starts fast (without cranking) then rough idle for 1~2secs (greyish smoke from exhaust), then perfect idle speed.

Regarding to the torsion value, i noticed that it bounces between -0.6 and 0.0 at idle. But I have no idea about higher rpms.

Torsion value shouldn't be bouncing around (I've never seen it move on my BEW)