2.0 TDI very rough idle when cold

Scrub

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 11, 2009
Location
UK
TDI
Skoda PD TDI 140
Hi, I have done a bit of a search on this one but wondered if you can shed some light on my issue:
2.0 PD TDI with 88k (miles) and cam belt done by dealer at 80k.
I've only just purchased this one and on another issue in another post I have just had a brand new DMF, clutch and slave cylinder installed to solve a nasty ticking sound when the car is really hot. (garage thought it was this)
I was hoping this would solve the nasty idle when cold but it hasn't. It is really rough when first started to the point where the engine does seem to jump about a bit and you can hear quite a clunking too, I gather this is the new DMF making this noise.
There is also some blue smoke at start up in cold. No smoke when fully warmed up.
When hot I have managed to get the car pretty smooth at idling by upping the revs to 884.
I have VAGCOM and there are no faults at all, and from watching measuring blocks can see the temp sensors are all reading normal and the glow plugs are being fired (1.61 secs) and can see they stay on post glow for a bit before being switched off.
The revs seem to be higher when they are on?
I think when the glow plugs stop this nasty idle kicks in until the car is warmed up.
On block 13 things seem within spec, nothing out of the ordinary here. Pretty balanced.
My previous 2.0 PD with 165K on the clock did not do this - perhaps I should have kept it :eek:
I noticed oil was a little high so have taken some out.
New air filter but unsure of the fuel filter. I was changed at 40k as far as I can prove.

Movie - noise is noticeable from about 20 seconds in...[timer counts back in this movie]
click for movie

Another:

Sound vid

Is there anything else I should check? Thanks all.
 
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jcrews

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 28, 2007
Location
Round Rock, TX - VCDS
TDI
All gone
Check the static timing by looking at measuring group 4, value 4 (torsion angle). It should be 0.
Make sure the idle speed is 903, and that the idle adaptation is set to default.
 

Scrub

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 11, 2009
Location
UK
TDI
Skoda PD TDI 140
Thanks dude,

Where is idle adaptation? I am unable to see any adaptation values bar the idle speed....this is using the password 12233.
Is that odd?

Idle speed is 884 - which is stable when engine warm.

I think torsion was -2.4...but then so was my other 2.0 Tdi.....
 

Lee_Taylor

Veteran Member
Joined
Sep 26, 2004
Location
Kent, England
TDI
Audi A3 1.4 COD
A new DMF shouldn't make a clunking noise. A duff one certainly will. Are you sure they actually replaced a failing DMF? Blue smoke at start up isn't unusual and not something to worry about. Have you checked the alternator belt whilst the car is idling? The clutch can play up on these and cause the belt to jump around. It is pretty easy to check. You just have to release the tension on the belt. You need (I think) a 16mm wrench and a pin to lock the tensioner. Then check the condition of the alternator clutch.

When the DMF started to play up on my PD it would make a random clunking noise at idle which went away when the clutch pedal was depressed or if the revs were increased. Is the cam on your PD ok? A ticking noise could be the result of a knackered camshaft.
 

Scrub

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 11, 2009
Location
UK
TDI
Skoda PD TDI 140
Ta Lee, yes I trust the garage and even took the old DMF, clutch and slave cylinder away with me to have a nose at it...

The ticking noise only happened when the engine was VERY hot.
Thanks for the info on the smoke though - good to know!

This clunking noise sounds like the engine is shaking something large and heavy within the engine. If I raise the engine revs to 1000+ it goes away, so it's probably the engine idling in a rough manner that is causing it.
As soon as the engine is up to temp it idles pretty smooth, for a VAG TDI anyway.

I have not checked out the clutch on the alternator belt but will have a look. It sounds more heavy clunking that a belt you see.

I almost seems as if the engine is not happy to tick over when it's cold, though the revs stay around the 850+ mark. It's almost as if one or more cylinders are perhaps not firing correctly...Should glow plugs stay on for longer than say a couple of mins? (outside temp being 4 degrees)
 

Scrub

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 11, 2009
Location
UK
TDI
Skoda PD TDI 140
Cheers Daedalus, but then why would it settle down when hot if it were the mounts.
It is something to do with the cold idling....
 
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Scrub

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 11, 2009
Location
UK
TDI
Skoda PD TDI 140
Added a vid:
Click for movie
You can hear the rumbling sound from about 20 seconds in [timer counts back in this movie]..... at idle.
I've also noticed another sound after a blip from the throttle, something to do with the turbo waste gate?

The noise again, its the a chugging noise - oddly sounds much worse from inside the car:
Another vid

Cheers
 

Dimitri16V

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jan 30, 2005
Location
DE
TDI
01 Golf, 04 Golf
the camshaft may be worn out , notice how there is an abnormal sound once you let the throttle. does this engine have a balance shaft ? are you also sure the DMF has been replaced ?
 

Scrub

Well-known member
Joined
Mar 11, 2009
Location
UK
TDI
Skoda PD TDI 140
Not sure if the 2.0 PD BKD engine has a balance shaft.
It's quiet when at working/normal temperature though.

Yup I took the old DMF and clutch away with me. Garage is trusted.
Could be a brand new faulty part of course. I saw it before it went in. Still boxed etc.
 

jcrews

Top Post Dawg
Joined
Jul 28, 2007
Location
Round Rock, TX - VCDS
TDI
All gone
BKD does not have a balance shaft module.

You should adjust the static timing to 0, but it won't fix your rough running.

You should also make sure both cams are in sync, and that they (and the followers) are not damaged.

To check cam sync, both rig pins must fit at the same time (engine locked to #1 TDC).

I can't watch the videos on my system, so I can't hear the noise you're talking about.
 
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