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Mid-west USA Local discussions for those on the Mid-West US. ( Minnesota, Iowa, Wisconsin, Michigan, Illinois, Indiana, Ohio, Nebraska, North Dakota, South Dakota, Kansas, Missouri)

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Old June 29th, 2009, 10:34   #106
Jetta09Chicago
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Question Fuel Testing Update and a New Concern

Here is an update on the BP, Meijer and Mobil diesel samples I submitted for analytic testing. The fuel engineer received the samples, but unfortunately one of the bottles had leaked, so we will only receive results on two of the products.

To my disappointment, he stated that these samples had the visual appearance of biodiesel, even though the fuel was supposed to be non-bio. The lab testing is needed to determine this definitively and will be conducted after the holiday.

Based on his comment, I am feeling very concerned. My car now has roughly 9,300 miles, and I check the oil level at every fill-up. The oil level has always been constantly at the top of the "normal" range, never going beyond. However, as a layperson, I feel that the viscosity appears to have become thinner over time.

So here is my question. If I have been using mislabeled biodiesel, and the fuel has diluted the oil, would the oil level rise ABOVE the normal range on the dipstick? Or could it stay within the normal range and still be diluted, with excess oil in the crankcase not registering on the dipstick?
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Old June 29th, 2009, 11:54   #107
PalosParked
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetta09Chicago
To my disappointment, he stated that these samples had the visual appearance of biodiesel, even though the fuel was supposed to be non-bio. The lab testing is needed to determine this definitively and will be conducted after the holiday.

Based on his comment, I am feeling very concerned. My car now has roughly 9,300 miles, and I check the oil level at every fill-up. The oil level has always been constantly at the top of the "normal" range, never going beyond. However, as a layperson, I feel that the viscosity appears to have become thinner over time.

So here is my question. If I have been using mislabeled biodiesel, and the fuel has diluted the oil, would the oil level rise ABOVE the normal range on the dipstick? Or could it stay within the normal range and still be diluted, with excess oil in the crankcase not registering on the dipstick?
Jetta09, I had an oil analysis done Blackstone-labs when I was deciding on my oil change interval. One of the things that they measured was for fuel in the oil. If you are really concerned, the oil analysis is pretty quickly done by blackstone and the full test costs $22.50 (+ another $10.00 for the TBN if you want it). You can go online and get an oil collecting bottle from them. (I have a couple extra empty Blackstone oil collection bottles. If you are in a hurry, then IM me and I'll give you one)

You are pretty close to an oil change interval anyway. Why not have the test done for your peace of mind. Whomever changes your oil can obtain a sample of your oil for you.

FWIW, Dealer filled my TDI with bio at delivery. I didn't show fuel in my oil when it was tested at 5600 miles. I also have not had to top off and my oil levels remained fine.
I hope this helps you
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Last edited by PalosParked; June 29th, 2009 at 12:02.
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Old June 29th, 2009, 18:10   #108
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Fantastic thread. Any results closer to downtown proper? New TDI JSW owner in the Old Irving neighborhood.
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Old June 29th, 2009, 20:04   #109
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I would not base a ton on visual experience...just my opinion.

I know Meijer fuel has a lot of marketing attached to it, and I am sure they would advertise bio if it was bio. The rest, well, maybe a crap shoot.
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Old June 29th, 2009, 20:23   #110
PalosParked
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Default Help us expand our listing of Chicago area non bio highway diesel fuel locations

Quote:
Originally Posted by nibw
Fantastic thread. Any results closer to downtown proper? New TDI JSW owner in the Old Irving neighborhood.
nibw, Welcome and Thank you for joining the thread! Always good to have another set of eyes and ears out there gathering information.

My point....it's us that really need your help in expanding our group list of non bio diesel fuel locations. Please let us know what you find as you fill up.

Where are you getting your diesel now? Try finding a new diesel fuel location while driving around or by using one of the general diesel locators (see my post #105 ) in your driving area. Then verify first hand what grade diesel they provide. (You can't trust the locators information alone.) If the pumps are labeled bio 6-20%, then theyre definately out. If not labeled then you should still verify by asking an attendant..preferably a manager to confirm the grade. If you're bold enough, ask and confirm with their diesel distributor or check delivery paperwork.

Check out the BP's, Shells, Name brands first. Let us know what you find so we can add your listing to the thread posting and thank you!
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Old June 29th, 2009, 20:29   #111
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Like it's been stated here, Feece sells low bio, B1, at their retail locations. Not really a good location for me, but I might just try them if I feel like going for a ride one night.....I bet it's quality fuel!
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Old June 29th, 2009, 20:47   #112
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Also..I plan to combat any bio issues I may have by changing the oil every 5k. So, even If I unknowingly get a higher batch of bio from time to time, I am not risking any real damage by changing more frequently.
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Old June 29th, 2009, 23:56   #113
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Nibw, we're glad you're here! We need more people located in the city.

I found a Mobil station on Irving Park Road, just east of the Kennedy (I-90) that sells diesel. At the time I checked, there was no biodiesel sticker on the pump, which is promising. When I went inside to ask, the girl at the counter had no clue. You might want to check that place out, as I believe it is near you. Let us know if you find someone knowledgeable who can confirm the fuel is non-bio. Thanks!
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Old June 30th, 2009, 00:00   #114
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PalosParked and BTL, thanks a lot for your suggestions. I am concerned enough that I will probably conduct a used oil analysis, and I agree I may need to go with a more frequent oil change interval.
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Old June 30th, 2009, 07:55   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetta09Chicago
To my disappointment, he stated that these samples had the visual appearance of biodiesel, even though the fuel was supposed to be non-bio. The lab testing is needed to determine this definitively and will be conducted after the holiday.
There's no way you can look at a diesel fuel and tell it has biodiesel. I would bet all three were not B11.
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Last edited by b4black; June 30th, 2009 at 07:59.
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Old June 30th, 2009, 14:07   #116
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I live downtown Chicago and was in search of the lowest priced ULSD in the downtown area. The BP station at Lasalle and Ontario was .30 cheaper than the Mobil at Halsted and Division (which I later found sells 5-20 bio ULSD). The pumps at Lasalle and Ontario were labeled LSD and although it’s pretty much a given that all BP diesel is ULSD I thought perhaps being downtown Chicago this station was late to the switch. To get an answer I asked the attendant on duty.

The exchange went something like this…


Me: Your diesel pump says it contains LSD and not ULSD is that correct?
Him: Yes, ULSD.
Me: So the pump is mislabeled as LSD, but is in fact ULSD?
Him: No, the label says LSD.
Me: Right, the label says LSD, is that what’s in the tank?
Him: Yes, ULSD.
Me: What type of fuel does that pump dispense?
Him: gas….

I called BP and left a message asking for info on their Illinois fuels. I got a call back a week later. During that week before the call I spoke to a sales rep at the VW dealership downtown. They’re located about 3 blocks from the this BP station. He said they use that station to fill the one or two TDI’s they have all the time. This made me extremely anxious to hear back from BP as to what was actually in the tank. The lady with BP corporate assured me that location sells ULSD and ULSD only. Her statement was that all Illinois BP product supplied stations carry ULSD #2 with no Bio blended at all. Jobber supplied BP stations could have anything, but their pumps should still be labled accordingly. She asked for the address of the station and said she would be in contact with them regarding their labels. Stopped by a couple weeks later and they had new yellow ULSD stickers.

I can also confirm the Shell at Armitage and I-90/94 has pumps labeled 5-20 bio ULSD as does the Citgo at Ashland and Addison.

Straight ULSD is kind of tough to find in the city.........
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Old June 30th, 2009, 14:46   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goodlylike
The exchange went something like this…

Me: Your diesel pump says it contains LSD and not ULSD is that correct?
Him: Yes, ULSD.
Me: So the pump is mislabeled as LSD, but is in fact ULSD?
Him: No, the label says LSD.
Me: Right, the label says LSD, is that what’s in the tank?
Him: Yes, ULSD.
Me: What type of fuel does that pump dispense?
Him: gas….

......
Goodly...It's sad that you had to have the conversation...but your portrayal of the conversation with the service station attendant had me rolling on the floor laughing. ....I think I heard that one..Bob Newhart..the service station attendant, right? or was it Abbott and Costello?

Thank you very much for the post, the diesel fuel (non-bio) location and the laugh.
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Last edited by PalosParked; June 30th, 2009 at 14:48.
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Old June 30th, 2009, 15:37   #118
Jetta09Chicago
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[quote=goodlylike]The lady with BP corporate assured me that location sells ULSD and ULSD only. Her statement was that all Illinois BP product supplied stations carry ULSD #2 with no Bio blended at all./quote]

This could be a valuable lead! I wonder if that BP representative happens to have a list of BP product-supplied stations she could share. If so, this would be great information and would help expand our list.
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Old July 1st, 2009, 11:24   #119
nibw
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Hah. Had a similar conversation yesterday at the Lake Forest oasis on 94. The Mobil there sells Diesel with no label whatsoever. I asked the attendant if it is even LSD or ULSD. Just asking such a technically elaborate question seemed to cause a major malfunction. Finally the manager there said he's 'pretty sure' that it's LSD. I did remind him that law requires a label regardless.

Mostly been making a lot of road trips with the car. So far have not filled in downtown Chicago area. On the way to Milwaukee I stopped at Belivedere and Green Bay Road. Both stations (Speedway and Citgo) sell Bio only. Finally found a Citgo further up 41 at the Gurnee Truck Stop (2301 N Highway 41) which actually has 2 pumps one Bio and one regular Diesel.

So far looking around Chicago I'm only seeing Bio blends. I'll check that Mobil and let you know.
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Old July 1st, 2009, 19:05   #120
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I love my car, don't think otherwise. It just bothers me that VW would build a vehicle that is not at all geared toward the normal bio blends we see. Especially in Illinois, and other midwest states, it is hard to find dino. It's making me worry that some day I won't be able to find dino. Then what???

Thank god for Meijer in my area....
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