mobil 1 diesel truck oil for jetta ??

tditom said:

Does anyone actually have any UOA data that would indicate a VW507 oil would not protect a tdi CR engine as well as a 5W40?

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I don't..... but I'll continue searching out the data and looking at the UOA's we have out there. I know it's apples to oranges but with the way the 507's worked out for the PD's and VW vehemittly saying that's what we were supposed to be using despite the issues, I don't want to use it... call it a bad taste in my mouth if you will. If UOA's show that it's better, as good as the ESP 1 in the heavier weight, if cheaper, then maybe that's a great choice but for now, I'll run with what is in there (I'm sure it's 507) and change at 10k and then do the ESP 1 5/40 and change at 10k and see how they compare. Blackstone will provide the data points that I need to see for "My" car and I'll go from there.

What are your thoughts on this Tom or anyone else for that matter. We're all here to learn or teach in some capacity so I'm all ears on the matter being new to the CR motor and emissions systems.

Thanks!

EDIT: Thanks TooSlick, I didn't see your response but open for more feedback. Always appreciate your feedback.

You don't want to use the 5w-40, Delvac 1/ESP in a TDI engine with a particle filter. The ash level is much too high and you'll prematurely clog up the hard to service (welded in place), particle filter. The 5w-30, Mobil 1/ESP (yes, the names are confusing), is what you want.

Unlike the PD's, this engine is actually an excellent design.

TooSlick said:

You don't want to use the 5w-40, Delvac 1/ESP in a TDI engine with a particle filter. The ash level is much too high and you'll prematurely clog up the hard to service (welded in place), particle filter. The 5w-30, Mobil 1/ESP (yes, the names are confusing), is what you want.

Unlike the PD's, this engine is actually an excellent design.

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Oh, no, no way, I'm not putting the Delvac in. You may have missed my original post but I started off with.

"I just moved into a 2009 Jetta TDI from a 2006 and the Devlac 1 ESP 5w40 was the oil of choice in my 2006 and I had EXCELLENT results with it and extended OCI's. Looks like I'll change it up to the Mobil 1 ESP FM 5w40 and see how that oil holds up."

I like what you said about the motor, that right there, is sad and funny at the same time. Now if we can only address the emissions system.

By the way, these are all dual use, VW 504/507 oils, the first number is the gas engine designation. I believe from my research that the turbocharged, DI gas engine requirements in may ways drive the specification in terms of base oil & additive chemistry. For example, ash deposits in the combustion chamber contribute to low rpm pre-ignition in VW/Audi, DI gas engines.

Mrrogers1 said:

I don't..... but I'll continue searching out the data and looking at the UOA's we have out there. I know it's apples to oranges but with the way the 507's worked out for the PD's and VW vehemittly saying that's what we were supposed to be using despite the issues, I don't want to use it... call it a bad taste in my mouth if you will. If UOA's show that it's better, as good as the ESP 1 in the heavier weight, if cheaper, then maybe that's a great choice but for now, I'll run with what is in there (I'm sure it's 507) and change at 10k and then do the ESP 1 5/40 and change at 10k and see how they compare. Blackstone will provide the data points that I need to see for "My" car and I'll go from there.

What are your thoughts on this Tom or anyone else for that matter. We're all here to learn or teach in some capacity so I'm all ears on the matter being new to the CR motor and emissions systems.

Thanks!

EDIT: Thanks TooSlick, I didn't see your response but open for more feedback. Always appreciate your feedback.

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I agree that the thinner oil was a bad move on the PD. Realize though that the need for a robust oil in the PD design was driven by the use of a smaller cam lobe surface area engaging a flat tappet. Basically when they designed the PD they used the same real estate for the head as the ALH so they had to make the cam lobes smaller to allow the unit injector actuators space on the cam shaft. So 505.01 was developed to withstand the extra shear force on the oil at the lobe/follower interface. After initially starting with 5W40 weight 505.01, subsequently they went to a 5W30. There's been much speculation as to why- emissions and fuel consumption are the two most widely subscribed to. The thinner oil seemed to be disastrous in many PD engines.

They made 507 oil "backward compatible" with the 505.01 spec. I do not know if a 5W30 507 oil protects a PD cam as well as a 5W40 API spec oil. Since it is a longlife oil I'm assuming its better than 505.01 in a PD.

My understanding is that the CR uses roller to engage the followers. This is a much less stressful environment than the PD or ALH design. A 5W30 seems to do very well in this application- perhaps no discernible difference from 5W40 wear rates- and also offers better theoretical fuel consumption. Until the 507 oil is proven to be inferior (as in x thousand mile lifespan shorter, or multiple UOA showing much higher wear rates), I think this talk of 5W40 ESP being "better" is not helping anyone. Especially if they are still under warranty.

TooSlick said:

By the way, these are all dual use, VW 504/507 oils, the first number is the gas engine designation. I believe from my research that the turbocharged, DI gas engine requirements in may ways drive the specification in terms of base oil & additive chemistry. For example, ash deposits in the combustion chamber contribute to low rpm pre-ignition in VW/Audi, DI gas engines.

Click to expand...

An interesting thing about gasser vs diesel oil: Here in the states BMW forbids the gassers from using the LL04 oil that diesels are required to use- instead the gassers use the older LL01 spec. Something about sulfur in the gasoline, IIRC. In Europe they can use LL04 for all the cars.

Both the relatively high sulfur (~30 ppm) and the 10% ethanol both contribute to oil degradation. There is a proposal to reduce gasoline sulfur levels in the US to 10 ppm. Which will allow the European DI gas engines to function as designed.

TS