Anyone gel up in this brutal cold?

~TDIguy~ · Feb 2, 2019

I dont know much about the PS company, that is all i used to use before i decided to try amsoil but i feel amsoil has a better product now that ive used it a little while and actually experienced the difference.. The PS doesnt affect combustion for easier starts as much as the amsoil does, at least the way i use it.. But it does work for keeping your fuel moving when things get chilly. I just keep my additives at home in the garage and fill up on my way home from work when i get there roll inside and add the treatment! so much nicer than dealing with the inevitable spills and dealing with caps and measuring when its -10 and the wind is whipping around you at the fuel pumps.... Long Live VW and AMSOIL!

turbocharged798 · Feb 3, 2019

I have a gasser beater Jetta that I during the extreme cold. Instant heat, no worry of jelling and freezing to death on the side of the road. Given the $ 1 diesel fuel spread cost and lack of good heat it becomes not worth running a TDI in the cold.

Fix_Until_Broke · Feb 3, 2019

I have always filled up with Kwik Star fuel which they claim is winterized and comes from Flint Hill Resources in Minnesota. I had one issue ~10 years ago when it was ~-15F and it started to gel on me as I was leaving work. I was able to pull it inside at work for ~30 min and was fine the rest of the trip.

This last week, we had -27F a couple nights in a row. On Thursday before this, I filled up and on Friday I dumped in a cocktail of things to help prevent gelling. 1/2 gallon of gasoline, 1 pint of Heat and 1 pint of Power Service White. This had about 100 miles to mix before it got really cold. I plugged in the car so it started right up and left it idle for ~30 min before driving to work. All was well for the first ~7 miles, but once I got out on a 45MPH road, it started losing power and chugging. I was about 1 mile from a gas station so I kept the engine RPM down and made it.

There I put ~1 gallon of gasoline in on top of ~5/8 of a tank of the above mixture. I made it to work, but not without more fuel starvation on the highway. I let the car idle all day at work ~9 hours and it was fine on the way home.

Next morning - same temps, plugged in, etc and once I hit the higher speed roads, had the same thing happen. I was able to limp to work where I let it idle all day again and it was fine on the way home.

I wonder if the CAT 2 micron fuel filter has anything to do with it along with my thermostatic tee being bypassed?

Still not excited with Kwik Trip and their fuel obviously gelling up even with the equivalent of 2 gallons of gasoline mixed in with 15 gallons of diesel plus power service and heat.

turbobrick240 · Feb 3, 2019

My direct injected Kubota runs like garbage with as little as 10% gas blend. But if the car was running decent on that cocktail in warmer weather, the diesel must have been at fault. I'd rather add 50% K1 than add gasoline, but if the tank is nearly full already.....

iluvmydiesels · Feb 3, 2019

the old add about 1gallon of gasoline to about 10gallons of diesel. pretty much an old pre-90s trick. i though for newer diesels (post 1999->) it could cause problems? you d want plenty of additive along with it. you say you added 1pint of additive, thats 16oz at least, thats a lot. 2oz to ~10gals is good treatment for a lot of cold weather. a whole 16+ozs(??) along with heet, and 1/2gal of gas, already treated fuel should never gel with that treatment, unless your on the north or south pole.
the heet stuff work, i use in my sno-blower, some keeps carb from freezing. its a small tank in these, if your going to use a snow-blower its not going to be Very cold, when its snowing. (usually in the 20s when snowing, 25-30dg).
like normal additive aprox 2oz to 10gals, if its going to be much colder you can add 1 oz more or 2. this is *usually enough. then again you had problems, contaminants in fuel, esp too much water(??), the only thing, or improper fuel, not properly treated fuel.

~TDIguy~ said:
I just keep my additives at home in the garage and fill up on my way home from work when i get there roll inside and add the treatment!

i add additives right before fueling, this allows treatment(s) to mix with fuel, tank. otherwise your putting them on top, they can mix, over time. use a funnel for easier adding treatments to fuel tank.

JDSwan87 · Feb 3, 2019

Mine started fine... wife drove it to work, 13 hours outside -20F, cycled glow plugs twice and she popped off within 1/2 crank. Wife idled it for about 30 seconds until all 4 cylinders were hitting, then she drove away... Costco diesel with Howes.

leafs · Feb 3, 2019

yeah never had a problem here as well. think it got down to like -40C with the windchill factored in. Only thing I noticed is when I set the fanspeed to 3 it never got up to usual operating temp. Other than that pleasantly surprised it started after only 1 glow plug cycle the first day of the crazy temps and on the second day it took a couple cycles, with no coolant heater. real rough idle initially and lots of white smoke though. Used mobil diesel, no additives.

scooperhsd · Feb 3, 2019

JDSwan87 said:
Mine started fine... wife drove it to work, 13 hours outside -20F, cycled glow plugs twice and she popped off within 1/2 crank. Wife idled it for about 30 seconds until all 4 cylinders were hitting, then she drove away... Costco diesel with Howes.

That's perfect - exactly what SHOULD happen !

scooperhsd · Feb 3, 2019

leafs said:
yeah never had a problem here as well. think it got down to like -40C with the windchill factored in. Only thing I noticed is when I set the fanspeed to 3 it never got up to usual operating temp. Other than that pleasantly surprised it started after only 1 glow plug cycle the first day of the crazy temps and on the second day it took a couple cycles, with no coolant heater. real rough idle initially and lots of white smoke though. Used mobil diesel, no additives.

WIndchill makes NO difference when starting (just actual air temp).

Turning the fan speed too high does exactly what you saw - you can actually COOL OFF the car's coolant. What is more effective is to put the vents to recirc mode - this way, you aren't mixing real cold outside air with warmer inside air.

Otherwise, starting sounds perfect.

scooperhsd · Feb 3, 2019

iluvmydiesels said:
the old add about 1gallon of gasoline to about 10gallons of diesel. pretty much an old pre-90s trick. i though for newer diesels (post 1999->) it could cause problems? you d want plenty of additive along with it. you say you added 1pint of additive, thats 16oz at least, thats a lot. 2oz to ~10gals is good treatment for a lot of cold weather. a whole 16+ozs(??) along with heet, and 1/2gal of gas, already treated fuel should never gel with that treatment, unless your on the north or south pole.
the heet stuff work, i use in my sno-blower, some keeps carb from freezing. its a small tank in these, if your going to use a snow-blower its not going to be Very cold, when its snowing. (usually in the 20s when snowing, 25-30dg).
like normal additive aprox 2oz to 10gals, if its going to be much colder you can add 1 oz more or 2. this is *usually enough. then again you had problems, contaminants in fuel, esp too much water(??), the only thing, or improper fuel, not properly treated fuel.

i add additives right before fueling, this allows treatment(s) to mix with fuel, tank. otherwise your putting them on top, they can mix, over time. use a funnel for easier adding treatments to fuel tank.

With an ALH or newer diesel - avoid the gasoline and it's additives. The diesel ones are fine, and you really can't do too much (mostly they are just really refined diesel with concentrations of the additives). Also agree with putting the additives in right at the pump, before starting the fillup from the station's pump.

iluvmydiesels · Feb 3, 2019

yea, cause i was saying, the guy with the gelling problem has an '03, thats an alh. i dont even think gas is very good in my ahu. in the older 1.6 idi a gallon to a full tank was allowed, for very cold, thats old diesel tho.

i dont know is the kwik star indian owned? they buy cheap and dont really have certain rules, as long as they make $$ for their own pockets. and american companies who deliver to indians also deliver them sh*t. would make more sense.

Prairieview · Feb 3, 2019

Actually, in the older VW 1.6's, the owner's manual in the cars said you could go up to 25% gasoline when absolutely necessary. In the early 80's, I probably came very close to that ratio a few times.

I would never do it again......and certainly not do it in these later cars.

prsa01 · Feb 4, 2019

3 -30 nights in Duluth area

A series of poor decisions had us in Duluth for the 3 30 below nights. Our mkv with 300k+ is typically spoiled in an attached garage so it doesn't get many hard starts. On the positive side, a relatively new battery but I get the feeling the glow plugs may not be the best.

I typically slightly overdose with PS white during the colder weather (<-10f}.

I decided to just let the car sit until I had to start it because it was supposed to be a balmy -4 or so by then. Didn't take into account that the engine would take hours to warm up.

Anyway, parked by a power source and brought battery charger. Plugged in at 10 amps for 15 mins to warm battery. Glowed 3 times, cranked 10 seconds with just barely a pop. 2 more glows and 10 more seconds to rough running. Ran OK within 2 minutes of running

Satsonic · Feb 4, 2019

i add additives right before fueling said:
Doing the same thing. Just put some additive, plastic sealed measuring cup & funnel in the trunk. That way I will add before a fill-up (on just those fill ups that I know it will drop below 20 deg F). I haven’t had any problems but just figure it’s cheap insurance and possibly 1 less thing to have to deal with. [emoji23]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

~TDIguy~ · Feb 4, 2019

Yea doing the treatment before filling is definitely the better bet, but around here with using pump treated fuel and parking in a 40 degree garage i add the stuff as kinda a double protection. So far i havent had any trouble this way unless i forget

[486] · Feb 5, 2019

Fix_Until_Broke said:
Still not excited with Kwik Trip and their fuel obviously gelling up even with the equivalent of 2 gallons of gasoline mixed in with 15 gallons of diesel plus power service and heat.

I've started experimenting with waste oil lately

my tank had a majority of 5w20 drain oil and gasoline, 4:1 ratio, with a few gallons of diesel still in there from before the experiment started.
started fine throughout the cold we had, about as expected with delipped ARL pistons, lots of white smoke and misfiring until the pistons got a little heat in them

Even better for the fact that I'm running a #24 battery I pulled off the core pile at work, after the 51r I had in it before let me down before the real cold hit (it wouldn't even hold 150A load on the tester)

Fix_Until_Broke · Feb 5, 2019

I guess there's not much for paraffin in engine oil so not much risk of it gelling

Hadn't thought of that instead of diesel.

Plenty of other side effects, but gelling isn't one of them

[486] · Feb 5, 2019

Fix_Until_Broke said:
I guess there's not much for paraffin in engine oil so not much risk of it gelling Hadn't thought of that instead of diesel.

Plenty of other side effects, but gelling isn't one of them

Yeah, any wax in engine oil would make for some very sludgey oil. Pennzoil, anyone?

I figure so long as the pump head and nozzles last 10k miles, they've paid for themselves. Anything beyond is 'profit'

turbobrick240 · Feb 5, 2019

Heh, Pennzoil and Quaker State used to have loads of paraffin 30+ years ago. Nasty sludge. More recently they have some really nice GTL oils. Pennzoil was actually selling "synthetic" GTL oil as conventional in the yellow bottle for awhile.

TornadoRed · Feb 9, 2019

Fix_Until_Broke said:
I wonder if the CAT 2 micron fuel filter has anything to do with it along with my thermostatic tee being bypassed?

Still not excited with Kwik Trip and their fuel obviously gelling up even with the equivalent of 2 gallons of gasoline mixed in with 15 gallons of diesel plus power service and heat.

Based on my experience, a fuel filter with thermostatic-T is no advantage. It might help when a cold engine is first started, but when the thermostat opens up and cold gelled or partially gelled fuel flows into the filter then the engine will die and you could be stranded 5 miles from home or work. I'd rather stick with the CAT 2-micron filter without the thermo-T.

I had a gelling problem with Kwik Trip diesel several years ago. I don't trust it more or less than any other diesel, but I've been adding plenty of PS to each tank just to be on the safe side. Double or triple the usual amount.

eli · Feb 9, 2019

Some facts relating to above:
All the diesel fuel comes from the same pipelines. Kwik Trip blends more winterizer in theirs than any competitor in the area. Each petroleum blend is state mandated and approved.

Anyone gel up in this brutal cold?

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